Wind Turbine on Long Island

Huge wind turbine installed

The clean-energy device was installed at a 1,200-acre wholesale nursery in Laurel, in Riverhead Town, at a cost of $500,000.

Under the Long Island Power Authority's Backyard Wind Initiative, available to both residential and commercial customers, about $127,000 will be rebated to the nursery

The device is predicted to produce 157,555-kilowatt hours of electricity annually, realizing an approximate energy savings of $29,000.

This is one reason why wind power isn't more popular. The initial cost vs payback stinks, 13 years to break even. And you can expect some major bills for repair and maintenance in 13 years as well.
 

ylexot

Super Genius
Yeah, I also looked into the local people doing wind power some. The one person who has their windmill operating paid $26k and is getting ~$1600-$2000 worth of energy per year. A 10-15 year break even point is typical for wind power. They live on the water.

If I lived on the water, I might consider making the investment. Unfortunately, I don't and the tallest tower I could have would be lower that the tree tops in the area. So, not a good investment.
 
I'd love to do solar/wind generation, but the cost for quality components is just way to far out of my reach.

I haven't gotten the bugs worked out of my Mr. Fusion yet.
 
And there we have the solution. There should be small LOCAL reactors all over the place.

For the distribution of energy, yes, I agree.

For the logistics.... bad idea. If for nothing else, imagine now both new and spent fuel traveling in smaller batches all over the place, no longer centralized. Absolute control of that fuel becomes a nightmare. Far more chances for accidents, contamination and theft. Costs will skyrocket.

Your idea would work well if small scale hydrogen-based fusion at a home-generator level became a reality, but not so long as we still use fission.
 

Larry Gude

Strung Out
For the distribution of energy, yes, I agree.

For the logistics.... bad idea. If for nothing else, imagine now both new and spent fuel traveling in smaller batches all over the place, no longer centralized. Absolute control of that fuel becomes a nightmare. Far more chances for accidents, contamination and theft. Costs will skyrocket.

Your idea would work well if small scale hydrogen-based fusion at a home-generator level became a reality, but not so long as we still use fission.

OK, point being, nuke power has a role, a huge role, be it pebble bed or what have you and any talk of worry about spent fuel is so much fear mongering. People can steal oil and gas tankers pretty damn easy and blow up schools or bunny factories and it ain't happening. I would imagine we can figure out how to secure dangerous products.

No one wants to talk about it but, nuke is opposed by greens just as much as it is by oil/coal/nat gas proponents.
 

ylexot

Super Genius
For the distribution of energy, yes, I agree.

For the logistics.... bad idea. If for nothing else, imagine now both new and spent fuel traveling in smaller batches all over the place, no longer centralized. Absolute control of that fuel becomes a nightmare. Far more chances for accidents, contamination and theft. Costs will skyrocket.

Your idea would work well if small scale hydrogen-based fusion at a home-generator level became a reality, but not so long as we still use fission.

I don't think that would be much of a problem. The small reactors will run for ~10 years before needing to be refueled.
 
OK, point being, nuke power has a role, a huge role, be it pebble bed or what have you and any talk of worry about spent fuel is so much fear mongering. People can steal oil and gas tankers pretty damn easy and blow up schools or bunny factories and it ain't happening. I would imagine we can figure out how to secure dangerous products.

No one wants to talk about it but, nuke is opposed by greens just as much as it is by oil/coal/nat gas proponents.

I don't think that would be much of a problem. The small reactors will run for ~10 years before needing to be refueled.

Just the eternal pessimist in me coming out......
 

bcp

In My Opinion
Good. Then you are in charge of reactor security/waste disposal. I want a worrying pessimist in charge of very important things.

:buddies:
Cant we just ship the cores to Hati to be used in structural repairs?
Once its covered with drywall, who would know?
 

This_person

Well-Known Member
For the distribution of energy, yes, I agree.

For the logistics.... bad idea. If for nothing else, imagine now both new and spent fuel traveling in smaller batches all over the place, no longer centralized. Absolute control of that fuel becomes a nightmare. Far more chances for accidents, contamination and theft. Costs will skyrocket.
The new fuel now comes from several different vendors to the many commercial, college, government/testing, and military reactors. Nothing centralized.

The spent fuel, thanks in huge part to Mr. Reid, and now Mr. Obama, is still being stored in pools and casks at those many reactor sites, or on an enormous reesrvation in Idaho. Nothing centralized about any of it.

The transfer casks for the spent fuel (new fuel needs no tight control, you can walk up to it and hold it in your hands safely) are so safe as to be idiotic to worry about. Your car has a far greater chance of blowing up and causing severe problems than these casks do.

Meanwhile, if we reconstituted the fuel (thank you Mr. Carter for making that impossible in the US), we'd generate only <10% of the high level waste we generate now.

An MIT study done decades ago suggested the best thing in the world for the nuclear industry would be many, many, many cookie cutter local generating stations that are all alike instead of Palo Verde sized behemouths (or even Calvert Cliffs sized). They suggested it would greatly reduce the cost of building, operating, maintaining, training...... The one and only problem with doing this, of course, is the public is entirely ignorant of the safety culture within the industry, and instead sees bad movies that grossly distort the industry.

It's a sad state of affairs for the US, honestly.
 

ylexot

Super Genius
An MIT study done decades ago suggested the best thing in the world for the nuclear industry would be many, many, many cookie cutter local generating stations that are all alike instead of Palo Verde sized behemouths (or even Calvert Cliffs sized). They suggested it would greatly reduce the cost of building, operating, maintaining, training...... The one and only problem with doing this, of course, is the public is entirely ignorant of the safety culture within the industry, and instead sees bad movies that grossly distort the industry.

I've been saying that too. Approve a single design that is small enough to make on an assembly line and truck to its installation location. That would also revitalize our manufacturing capabilities and create a lot of jobs.
 
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