Why Shoe?

SAHRAB

SAHRAB

This is fun right?
This is something i've heard conflicting things about.

My first draft had Borum on all 4 hoofs.
MyLittlePonies horse also had them all around, but then the farm we boarded at, decided to change it and had the rears removed (they were kind and let her know afterwards that they decided what was best).
my second draft (a 20 year old mare) was a straight off the Amish farm belgian and she never had shoes so i kept her that way.
My quarterhorse had smooth shoes all around but we just changed him to borum also.
"The Boys" quarterhorse also has smooth shoes all around, but his Mustang only has borum up front.
Tonk the SlOoOoOoOw (<--click) plow horse, and my daughters pony are barefoot right now.

i know the benefit of not having shoes, virtually no cleaning the hoofs (they clean themselves it seems) and not packing up during the snow (probably the same reason). he doesnt slip or slide more than any of the shod horses (actually i think last weekend he may have done better than those shod). and my farrier (who originally owned him) says not to bother with them either.

but what is the advantage?
 
fredsaid2

fredsaid2

New Member
Humm....ours is barefoot all around and must still pick hooves. Like flossing, you can get away with not doing it but you'll pay for it later. For me shoeing would be to protect the hoof from abnormal wear, provide support or traction (calks, borium), or aid the way of going. So far my game plan is to stay barefoot till the farrier recommends otherwise. Shoes or no shoes, it’s an individual choice. Best to choose the one that keeps the horse comfortable for the job he has.
 
SAHRAB

SAHRAB

This is fun right?
fredsaid2 said:
Humm....ours is barefoot all around and must still pick hooves. Like flossing, you can get away with not doing it but you'll pay for it later. For me shoeing would be to protect the hoof from abnormal wear, provide support or traction (calks, borium), or aid the way of going. So far my game plan is to stay barefoot till the farrier recommends otherwise. Shoes or no shoes, it’s an individual choice. Best to choose the one that keeps the horse comfortable for the job he has.
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probably because mine are drafts, much bigger hoofs that clear alot easier (doesnt mean i dont check, specially around the frog)
 
mingiz

mingiz

Horse Poor
Shoes depend on what type of work your horse does and if his feet are good. I usually shoe during the riding season. Mainly because I do alot of mountain riding. Otherwise mine are barefoot. I have the farrier coming next week and he will pull shoes until spring they will go back on my riding horse. The borum is used alot with the amish horses for traction on the roads. It's good to pull the shoes in the winter so that they don't get so balled up with snow and it gives the hoof a change to grow out the nail holes. I had a horse that wore a bar type shoe because of weak hoof wall. The other hooves were unshod. It was a correction to help the bad hoof. Which helped his coffin bone because it was starting to rotate. He is now a companion horse at 26. Even if they are bare foot you still need to clean them out. If not thrush will get cha quick in all this wet weather....
 
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DQ2B

Active Member
Barefoot is much healthier for the horse but the trim must be properly done and lifestyle can help/hinder the barefoot horse. A barefoot horse (and in my response I am assuming the trim is correct) has proper foot function and the foot is able to expand and contract upon loading and and unloading which keeps the frog in contact with the ground utilizing circulation and enableing the frog to grow and compact in a dense material as well as the digital cushion which will not be properly formed with a shoe on. A shoe does not allow expansion of the hoof wall upon loading and the coffin bone cannot come to a parallel or near parallel position. There is alot more info out there if you do a search but barefoot is the way to go in my opinion if the lifestyle supports it.
 
Four*Leaf*Farm

Four*Leaf*Farm

RIP Quinn
There is an EXCELLENT article about barefoot hooves in this months Practical Horseman. All my guys are barefoot right now and I normally won't shoe unless I'm heavily competing. (That hasn't happened for quite some time now :rolleyes: My TB mare had shoes on her last summer and she was off on lame with them on. Once they came off, she seems to be much more comfortable.
 
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DZIGGY

New Member
A lot of farriers will say horses need shoes because it helps them or corrects a problem that they may have. I think it faults them and/or covers a problem. I have been a farrier since 1997 and I prefer not to shoe...I could make up a bunch of BS and tell you your horse needs shoes and make a bunch of money off of you...But I don't. So whats that tell you about me! Horses in the wild naturally take care of the own hooves in their natural enviroment. Since we have them in stalls and in fields where we control their enviroment, we need to make sure we keep them trimmed. Shoes are an option, not a must have. If you get a the chance read "Making Natural Hoofcare Work for You!" by Pete Ramey.....Thanks
 
Four*Leaf*Farm

Four*Leaf*Farm

RIP Quinn
DZIGGY said:
A lot of farriers will say horses need shoes because it helps them or corrects a problem that they may have. I think it faults them and/or covers a problem. I have been a farrier since 1997 and I prefer not to shoe...I could make up a bunch of BS and tell you your horse needs shoes and make a bunch of money off of you...But I don't. So whats that tell you about me! Horses in the wild naturally take care of the own hooves in their natural enviroment. Since we have them in stalls and in fields where we control their enviroment, we need to make sure we keep them trimmed. Shoes are an option, not a must have. If you get a the chance read "Making Natural Hoofcare Work for You!" by Pete Ramey.....Thanks
Click to expand...

Like I said Practical horsemen did an article and Pete Ramey explained. It is worth the read. :howdy:
 
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DQ2B

Active Member
DZIGGY, do you follow Pete Ramey's and the other "wild horse" trim methods when you do your trims? I started doing my own triming last year because I was under the impression that that were no "barefoot" trimmers in S. Md. At least when I searched on the various websites, none were listed. Wish I had known about you, it's been a loooong, hard road learning mostly on my own. Glad to hear that Pete Ramey and others are finally getting the word out in S. Md!
 
SAHRAB

SAHRAB

This is fun right?
DZIGGY said:
A lot of farriers will say horses need shoes because it helps them or corrects a problem that they may have. I think it faults them and/or covers a problem. I have been a farrier since 1997 and I prefer not to shoe...I could make up a bunch of BS and tell you your horse needs shoes and make a bunch of money off of you...But I don't. So whats that tell you about me! Horses in the wild naturally take care of the own hooves in their natural enviroment. Since we have them in stalls and in fields where we control their enviroment, we need to make sure we keep them trimmed. Shoes are an option, not a must have. If you get a the chance read "Making Natural Hoofcare Work for You!" by Pete Ramey.....Thanks
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I have heard the same from my Farrier (a great Amish farrier, who unfortunately keeps threatening to move to New York). i was just mainly asking for opinions on those with "experience" if they noticed a difference between how their Un-Shod horses "held up" on the trail versus the Shod ones.

Its good to see a businessmen/woman who looks into whats best for the customer instead of trying to nickel/dime them to make a "buck"
 
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DQ2B

Active Member
Holding up on the trail can be dependent on a lot of things for the barefoot horse. Of course the correct trim has to be there first but if a horse has worn shoes for the past 15 years of his life and you pulled them last week, even with a correct trim, chances are he may not be too comfy on the trails. If he's always kept on soft terrain and never gets any conditioning on hard terrain, then gravel roads and rocky spots may always be ouchy for him. A heel first landing is the first requirement to get that conditioning. Walking on pavement, sand/stone dust arena work and leading on gravel roads help get the conditioning. Sugary, high carb feeds may also cause a constant uphill battle for proper hoof growth. Boots also make the transition easier and they have some out there now that work really well for trail riding. I cut frog pads from dense closed-cell foam to insert into mine and walked my horse in them during the transition to help add pressure to the frog. My stalls will actually have pea gravel for bedding (as soon as I get them finished). People think I'm nuts, but so far I have only seen improvement in my horse's hooves. As you can tell, this is a hot subject for me. I could go on...
 
fredsaid2

fredsaid2

New Member
DQ2B said:
DZIGGY, do you follow Pete Ramey's and the other "wild horse" trim methods when you do your trims? I started doing my own triming last year because I was under the impression that that were no "barefoot" trimmers in S. Md. At least when I searched on the various websites, none were listed. Wish I had known about you, it's been a loooong, hard road learning mostly on my own. Glad to hear that Pete Ramey and others are finally getting the word out in S. Md!
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When you say "barefoot" trim are you talking about something more specific than just going shoeless? Just wondering because I've worked with four area farriers in the past and none ever pushed shoes.
 
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DQ2B

Active Member
fredsaid2 said:
When you say "barefoot" trim are you talking about something more specific than just going shoeless? Just wondering because I've worked with four area farriers in the past and none ever pushed shoes.
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Most definitely. I am speaking about the trim methods employed by some of the "pioneers" on the subject like: Jamie Jackson, Pete Ramey, Gene Ovnick, Cindy Sullivan, K.C. La Pierre and Strasser.
 
SAHRAB

SAHRAB

This is fun right?
DQ2B said:
Most definitely. I am speaking about the trim methods employed by some of the "pioneers" on the subject like: Jamie Jackson, Pete Ramey, Gene Ovnick, Cindy Sullivan, K.C. La Pierre and Strasser.
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Just curious how do their methods differ from others?
 
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DQ2B

Active Member
SAHRAB said:
Just curious how do their methods differ from others?
Click to expand...

I really, REALLY, do not want to step on the toes of any farriers that may be on board here so I'll try to answer your question by telling some of the things the "barefoot" trimmers follow. Check out the above web sites too though, Pete Ramey especially has a lot of really good articles and links on his site.

Mustang roll, as appy mentioned. Never, ever trim into or rasp the toe callus, trim before any flaring starts and rasp flares away (in most cases), heels rasped to maximize pruchase and down just to live sole, walls rasped to a credit card longer than sole. Frog left alone except for hanging or dead material. Bars trimmed at an angle following the frog end ending at sole height at the back. Toes should be short with a fairly quick break over, the majority of the hoof should be behind the first third of the frog. Frogs wide with a shallow central sulcus. These are some of the basics and I may not have explained them the best (I'm not a professional) and certainly there are lots of special requirements for damaged, founder cases etc.

Note: the trim is just one aspect of the "barefoot" advocates. Lifestyle plays just as important roll in the success for the barefoot horse.
 
TotalControl

TotalControl

Leap Of Faith Farm
SAHRAB said:
I have heard the same from my Farrier (a great Amish farrier, who unfortunately keeps threatening to move to New York). i was just mainly asking for opinions on those with "experience" if they noticed a difference between how their Un-Shod horses "held up" on the trail versus the Shod ones.

Its good to see a businessmen/woman who looks into whats best for the customer instead of trying to nickel/dime them to make a "buck"
Click to expand...


I will come to St. Mary's County. Sorry it has taken a little while to get back to you. With the holiday's and all I have been pretty busy. Thank you for you interest in natural hoof care, I will call you to set something up.

Thank you,
Don Ziegler
Zieglers Farrier Service
410-586-8056
 
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