Should we support our ex-president?

missi1013

missi1013

Catch Me If You Can!
I was watching the Hannity and Colmes show on FOX News and they where interviewing a women that said that most americans support ex-president Carter on trying to get better relations with Cuba. I want to know what most americans think and do you think they are building nuclear weapons over there? Now take in mind our past history with Cuba!


I just wanted to know. Because I hate, not being like most americans.:silly:
 
Frank

Frank

Chairman of the Board
I think our *ex-president* should support our *President*, and not presume to speak on behalf of the U.S. without the approval of the White House.
 
J

jimmy

Drunkard
He was sent over there to improve relations with Cuba and to learn more about what's going on there. Carter has every right to make any assesment he wants about that situation.

I agree with StarBuck. It's ridiculous how long this stupid embargo has been going on. And how many acts we've legislated that are just going to make it more and more difficult to repair relations. The Red Menace is gone and the Pinko's are just another island south of Key West.

Yes I'm worried about the exploitation of Cuba by heartless MNC's bent on pushing US Capitolism on the world at all costs, but politically, I think it's the right move.

It's a shame that this situation doesn't get more public attention...other than the Bush administration listing them on the "terrorist" list and possible targets for the US...God, that kind of labling by Bush was counterproductive to our efforts...one of the dumbest moves in his presidency as far as I"m concerned...
 
Frank

Frank

Chairman of the Board
He was sent over? By whom? The administration? The U.S. government? The U.N.?

No. He was invited to come as a consequence of one of the programs of his own Carter Center. He's there as a private citizen. As such, he can say whatever he wants, and Bush has said that what he has said and done will have no effect on his policy with Cuba, although Bush appears to leaning towards lifting the embargo, on the grounds that it's pointless and isn't having any discernible effect.

If only Washington would consider wiping out all of their programs which after 30-40 years, has had no discernible effect.
 
Ken King

Ken King

A little rusty but not crusty
PREMO Member
It never hurts to talk about things, so what Carter is doing is okay with me. I think he is well aware that he cannot speak for the US of A, but it has always been acceptable for previous Presidents to confer with the current President about matters affecting the nation. Had GW wanted to block the visit he could have. He chose not to so let us see what it leads to. Normalizing relationships with the Cubans could be big money for some industries and it shouldn't be too long before Castro's time on Earth is up, so a little greasing of the wheel might not be a bad idea.
 
J

jimmy

Drunkard
Agreed. And I WAS under the impression that he was sent there by the administration. Thought I heard something about it on CNN. But if I'm wrong, thanks for the correction.

Still doesn't change my point, though, and we all seem to be in agreement that he can say whatever he wants and that normalizing relations with Cuba would be a good idea.

And, Frank, as for the getting rid of things that don't work for years, I say BRAVO!! Let's start w/the embargo and move on to the drug war, eh?
 
vraiblonde

vraiblonde

Board Mommy
PREMO Member
Patron
There are lots of things I don't understand and our relationship with Cuba is one of them. What exactly is our problem with them? Why restrict Cuba when Castro is a ham 'n egger compared with the Chinese?

But I do think that Jimmy Carter should mind his own business. If Bush wants to get right with Cuba he'll send a real envoy, not some failed ex-President.
 
missi1013

missi1013

Catch Me If You Can!
Ummm Hello, have we forgotten our past with Cuba! Castro is not and far from a nice person. He is and always will be against America. And if you think that he is going to show some old ex-president the nuclear weapons that he is making under ground, then you are not with it!

If we want to help relations with Cuba, then we need to get Castro out of there. That's the only way. We can't trust Castro and never will. So for now it's pointless for him to be over there. To Castro it probley looks like the US is kissing his butt. And I hope not!

I think we should send Janet Reno over there. Maybe they would have kept her and done us all a favor!
 
J

jimmy

Drunkard
Wow, Missi...I don't know where to begin to tell you all the things that are wrong with your last statement....so i won't.

And Jimmy Carter, Vrai, for all his failings as a president has been a very important figure in foreign policy since. So it was a great idea sending him there and he garners respect from international leaders, believe it or not.

Castro is not the monster we previously claimed him to be. Communism is not the threat it once was. It's high time to normalize relations in a situation that would certainly prove mutually beneficial and be right in line with what the international community has been imploring us to do for years...
 
vraiblonde

vraiblonde

Board Mommy
PREMO Member
Patron
First you, Jimmy:
And Jimmy Carter, Vrai, for all his failings as a president has been a very important figure in foreign policy since.
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For instance...?

Communism is not the threat it once was.
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Communism is an enormous threat - it destabilizes economies and promotes political unrest, not to mention the various human rights violations that go hand in hand with a dictatorship. But Castro's Cuba isn't the Communist threat that China is...and we don't boycott them. Is it because Cuba doesn't really have anything to offer us other than cigars?

Now you, Missi:
Ummm Hello, have we forgotten our past with Cuba!
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The only past we have with Cuba, to my knowledge, is the Missile Crisis 40 years ago. And the Elian Gonzales thing, but that was hardly Castro's fault.

And it IS pointless for Carter to go trotting over there - it's not like he has any say-so about US policy.
 
Christy

Christy

b*tch rocket
Jimmy Carter, as kind hearted as the man is, is a DOPE! He's best off building houses. I imagine Castro is getting a big chuckle behind closed doors over Carter. Didn't he used to refer to him as "The Peanut Farmer"? And didn't Castro take Jimmy C up on his offer for taking in all the Cubans by emptying all his prisons and rafting them all over here?

And when the hell is Castro going to die? I swear it's a communist conspiracy! ;)
 
Ken King

Ken King

A little rusty but not crusty
PREMO Member
Christy,

You know, the French will clone anything, do you think that they have cloned Castro? He sure has been around a long time. :lmao:

I thought everyone called Carter "Peanut farmer" or actually "Mr. Peanut". :roflmao:
 
Larry Gude

Larry Gude

Strung Out
Anyone who does not remember the butt plugging we took from Dear El Presidente, courtesy of his favorite dupe, Mr. Carter, needs to shut the hell up.

Mariel Boat lift, anyone??? 1980? Anyone?

For those of you who don't know or remember: In an effort to reunite some Cubans with their family members who'd left for the US years before, a mass exodus was concocted and executed.

It was with great joy that Mr. Castro and Mr. Carter made reality this fuzzy, warm, human love story.

Some 125,000 people were dumped in Miami, lived in tent cities for months and the creme de la creme of Castros sewers now had a nice, new country to live in.

Hardcore criminals, insane people, diseased folks. Maybe even a few decent people here and there? Hell of a way to conduct immigration policy.

Some cigar, that.

I'd agree that the current relationship is rather silly if we just ignore the facts that lead up to it.

How would you feel towards the US knowing that one of its favorite Presidents, JFK, tried to have you killed numerous times?

Bygones, no?

Castro is like any other despot. It is one thing to hold the reins of power tightly. It is another to deal with free people and all the problems it brings. He don't want no normalization.

Carter got used by Fidel and would take any opportunity to make better of it. "Well, no...he didn't call me the next morning, but he might have!"

Laughable to make more of it than that.
 
J

jimmy

Drunkard
Yeah that was something else, that Mariel Boat Lift....pretty much destroyed Carter's chances for re-election. Like I said, he wasn't a very good president....

However, as dispicable a manuver on Castro's part as the boat lift was, it really was just another in the seemingly endless volley between the US and Cuba for the past 50 years. Can you say "Bay of Pigs?" "Exploding Cigars"? "Poisoned Powder on Shoes" the list goes on.

Castro has a pretty deplorable human rights record and freedom of expression is an idea I don't even know if he can pronnounce.

However, the bulk of this conflict is over hurt feelings and old wounds that both sides keep pretending aren't healed. A new approach to US-Cuban relations would CERTAINLY benefit the Cuban people in that normalized relations would give the international community impetus to put pressure on Castro to improve conditions there. Right now, he can use the embargo (and rightfully so in many ways) to point out why his country is in the state that it is. And the international community is AGAINST the embargo whole-heartedly; make no mistake.

Vrai, I gotta just laugh at your "red menace" theories. China is certainly not the human rights bastion of the world and there's some securtiy issue there but the Communist Threat I was refering to was the stupid idea that it was the job of the "free peoples" of the world to rid the world of communism and stop the spread! We were doing what was right for everyone!....yeah...ask Russia how it feels about the joys of capitalism...you wanna talk about failed economies?

And lastly, not "boycotting" China has a lot to do with simple politics. True, we have a lot more to gain from diplomatic relations with China than we do from Cuba, but the main purpose is that it makes more sense politically to keep dialogue open with China and to have them interact in an international body, like the UN, than it does to put them on our sh*t-list.
 
vraiblonde

vraiblonde

Board Mommy
PREMO Member
Patron
Vrai, I gotta just laugh at your "red menace" theories. China is certainly not the human rights bastion of the world and there's some securtiy issue there but the Communist Threat I was refering to was the stupid idea that it was the job of the "free peoples" of the world to rid the world of communism and stop the spread! We were doing what was right for everyone!....yeah...ask Russia how it feels about the joys of capitalism...you wanna talk about failed economies?
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Sometimes I forget how young you are, Jimmy. Then you post and remind me. Thanks!

I don't think I said anything about a "Red Menace", theory or otherwise. I merely stated as fact that Communist countries tend to be politically and economically unstable with a rather impressive record of human rights violations. If you know of a Commie country that doesn't adhere to this scenario, please enlighten me.

You are an interesting mix of contradictions. On one hand, you have that We Are The World thing going on, then you pooh-pooh Communism like it has nothing to do with people's suffering. Fascinating.

Anyway, you stated that Carter was an important figure in foreign policy. I asked you for some examples to support that statement. Still looking?
 
missi1013

missi1013

Catch Me If You Can!
If Castro is such a nice guy, what about him shooting down our planes or buying arms from China? Why is he buying arms from China? How do we even know if the people in Cuba want us to have good relations with them. Last thing I knew they all hated us! The Gonazlas case made that clear, when they were having a big party's in the streets and yelling bad things about us! I think Castro will be the first one to stab us in the back! He is crazy you know! :silly:
 
Larry Gude

Larry Gude

Strung Out
Now there you go jetmonkey,

We're trying to be nice and talk about one incredibly inept issue at a time...

Jeez, 444 days.

Anybody remember 18-20% interest rates?

And the supreme embarrassment...The 1980 Moscow Olympics.

"We're not coming...nah..."
 
Hessian

Hessian

Well-Known Member
Man...it IE HEARTWARMING to see so many have a clear memory of the failures of "thet fine ol' Georgia boy."

My question relates to Caster's "inspection" of the Bio lab. Was this supposed to assure us that Castro isn't playing with white powder? What a joke! He can do it anywhere he wants and there are no UN inspectors or former presidents who will get access to it.

Castro will go...soon...but, will there be a #2 Castro or will there be a wave of reform? Sounds to me that although the Cuban people are miserable...there are thousands that have pledged their soul to communism...hmm, sounds like France 1789 to me.:eek:
 
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