My relationship with Christ makes religion a laugh, a fabrication which fails miserably to meet the needs of the soul. People are chased away by the canned religion thing. Do you characterize your position as a relationship or a religiion? Or as a nothing?

Being a Christian is a personal relationship with Jesus Christ, based on our personal acceptance of His sacrifice on the cross of Calvary for the remission of our sins.

Religion has nothing to do with it. Religion is for those who do not know Christ.

That is all.

Your poll options are lacking. I have a personal relationship with Christ. Religion is a tool used to enhance that relationship. Both/And not Either/Or.

My relationship with Christ makes religion a laugh, a fabrication which fails miserably to meet the needs of the soul.

I don't believe religion is intended to meet the needs of the soul.

People are chased away by the canned religion thing.

You got that right. Even using the word "canned", I think, gives it too much credit. Even canned foods are edible and hold their nutrients.

The most meaningful personal relationships I've made with other people were made outside of the church.

I've come to the conclusion - I just don't fit in with religion, or at church. :shrug:

My religion strengthens my relationship.

Very simple.

Your poll options are lacking. I have a personal relationship with Christ. Religion is a tool used to enhance that relationship. Both/And not Either/Or.

Concur, a lot of people think they know Christ or at least their version of Him, the question is does he know them.

The most meaningful personal relationships I've made with other people were made outside of the church.

I've come to the conclusion - I just don't fit in with religion, or at church. :shrug:

Sorry to hear that, a lot of that depends on both the leadership of the church and the people, whether they are authentic. A real church, is a family of believers and a lot of times are closer than flesh and blood. Our church is that way even with the singles we dont feel out of place.

I don't believe religion is intended to meet the needs of the soul.


I've come to the conclusion - I just don't fit in with religion, or at church. :shrug:

I find that particularly sad.

Sorry to hear that, a lot of that depends on both the leadership of the church and the people, whether they are authentic. A real church, is a family of believers and a lot of times are closer than flesh and blood. Our church is that way even with the singles we dont feel out of place.

Absolutely agree. Our church family is the same way, but we don't call ourselves religious, either.

We just call ourselves Christians - brothers and sisters in Christ.

I find that particularly sad.

Yeah. Me too.

I find that particularly sad.
As do I. I don't subscribe to religion myself, but there are times that I wish that I could. For some people it seems to be the only thing that keeps them getting up in the morning.

I believe it is both. It is too bad that the word religion has such a negative connotation.

Too often, those who claim "it's a relationship, not a religion" are one's who are undisciplined in their faith and practice and live like pagans.

Also too often, those who put faith in religion, not Christ, live lives of legalistic obedience ans self-righteousness.

Both faith (relationship) and obedience (religion) are part of being identified with Christ.

It is remembering to keep them in their proper place that matters most.

The Apostle James (inspired by the Holy Spirit) wrote:

19 Know this, my beloved brothers: let every person be quick to hear, slow to speak, slow to anger; 20 for the anger of man does not produce the righteousness of God. 21 Therefore put away all filthiness and rampant wickedness and receive with meekness the implanted word, which is able to save your souls.

22 But be doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving yourselves. 23 For if anyone is a hearer of the word and not a doer, he is like a man who looks intently at his natural face in a mirror. 24 For he looks at himself and goes away and at once forgets what he was like. 25 But the one who looks into the perfect law, the law of liberty, and perseveres, being no hearer who forgets but a doer who acts, he will be blessed in his doing.

26 If anyone thinks he is religious and does not bridle his tongue but deceives his heart, this person's religion is worthless. 27 Religion that is pure and undefiled before God, the Father, is this: to visit orphans and widows in their affliction, and to keep oneself unstained from the world.

All are excellent answers. I hope they prove to be thought-provoking for folks.

The flaw in my opening remarks is this: Our faith is fed by our fellowship and education, both of which necessarily come from a Bible-believing church. Radiant1 caught that immediately.

My attempt to separate relationship from religion was very much an attempt to separate legalistic and tradition-bound, cold-hearted ceremony from the passionate and one-on-one communion with Christ we can enjoy, and it takes place in the heart, originates there, I think. But that may be cause for a whole 'nother thread right there.

Being a Christian is a personal relationship with Jesus Christ, based on our personal acceptance of His sacrifice on the cross of Calvary for the remission of our sins.

Religion has nothing to do with it. Religion is for those who do not know Christ.

That is all.

How can you have a relationship with an "invisible man in the sky" as George Carlin said?

Have you ever seen Jesus? What does he look like?

How can you have a relationship with an "invisible man in the sky" as George Carlin said?

Have you ever seen Jesus? What does he look like?

I've seen Him.... in my granddaughters eyes.... I've seen Him.... in the beauty of a sunset.... or the glint of a fresh caught trout just released back into the water.... I've seen Him ..... He is the source of my life....

George Carlin said that line with pure respect.... as I recall....

:coffee:

How can you have a relationship with an "invisible man in the sky" as George Carlin said?

Have you ever seen Jesus? What does he look like?

Easy those born again talk to him through prayer and he talks to us through the reading and the proclamation of the word, VIA the Holy Spirit. You dont need to see Him, to see Him working.
You might want to ask Him to reveal Himself to you if you have doubts!

As do I. I don't subscribe to religion myself, but there are times that I wish that I could. For some people it seems to be the only thing that keeps them getting up in the morning.

And there is THE key. Whatever religion/faith in a higher being is or is not, it is supposed to provide order and reason and help people live a better life presuming that life conforms with the individual right to life, liberty and pursuit of happiness that is my faith.

I applaud and support it whenever and wherever it does so.

On the other hand, when it is used to be divisive and destructive of individual life and liberty and pursuit of happiness, not so much.

:buddies:

I don't know where the terminology came from. I never really liked the term "relationship". Just a sample of "believe" and trust. These are the terms that we need to communicate to people.

That if you confess with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

Romans 4:24 but also for us, to whom God will credit righteousness--for us who believe in him who raised Jesus our Lord from the dead.

Romans 10:10 For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you confess and are saved.

Prov 3 Trust in the Lord with all your heart
and lean not on your own understanding;
6 in all your ways submit to him,
and he will make your paths straight.[a]

How can you have a relationship with an "invisible man in the sky" as George Carlin said?

Have you ever seen Jesus? What does he look like?

Have you ever seen Julius Caesar? How about George Washington? King Tut?
Your right they are all just figments of our imagination.....:popcorn:

Have you ever seen Julius Caesar? How about George Washington? King Tut?
Your right they are all just figments of our imagination.....:popcorn:

Uh, not to be a dick but, so far as I know, folks don't generally pray to Caesar for guidance and spiritual nourishment.

The simply answer is that faith is faith and it's supposed to be about what you believe; not literal facts. Fair? :buddies:

Uh, not to be a dick but, so far as I know, folks don't generally pray to Caesar for guidance and spiritual nourishment.

The simply answer is that faith is faith and it's supposed to be about what you believe; not literal facts. Fair? :buddies:

no...not fair.

Originally Posted by Disco Stu View Post
How can you have a relationship with an "invisible man in the sky" as George Carlin said?

Have you ever seen Jesus? What does he look like?

The insinuation of this comment is that God does not exist because he can't be seen and that there is no evidence of him. Faith does not require "proof" I agree. But the "invisible" man in the sky is a dig. The historical evidence is overwhelming of the existence of Christ and the accuracy of the bible via archeology.

proof and evidence are different.

no...not fair.



The insinuation of this comment is that God does not exist because he can't be seen and that there is no evidence of him. Faith does not require "proof" I agree. But the "invisible" man in the sky is a dig. The historical evidence is overwhelming of the existence of Christ and the accuracy of the bible via archeology.

proof and evidence are different.
No it doesn't, at best it shows a small kernel of truth with a very high amount of speculation.

No it doesn't, at best it shows a small kernel of truth with a very high amount of speculation.

:killingme:killingme

:killingme:killingme
:killingme:killingme


I can do the same thing, does it make me look any smarter or more like you?

It is what is taught. God is this old bearded looking guy who sits on a white throne and watches us, until he gets pissed and throws lightning bolts down at us for doing something wrong.

How can I have a relationship with someone I have never seen? I can IMAGINE this Jesus is with me right next to me, but if I were on a subway talking to Jesus people would thing I am looney.

Is God watching us like an ant farm? Seriously.

It is what is taught. God is this old bearded looking guy who sits on a white throne and watches us, until he gets pissed and throws lightning bolts down at us for doing something wrong.

How can I have a relationship with someone I have never seen? I can IMAGINE this Jesus is with me right next to me, but if I were on a subway talking to Jesus people would thing I am looney.

Is God watching us like an ant farm? Seriously.

If you let yourself start a relationship with Jesus.... you'll be able to talk to Him with your thoughts... it's telepathic.... it works.... and since He's always right their in your heart.... His angels at His side... you don't have to worry....

It's a cool thing! I pray that you will someday get to enjoy it!

A child of God..... awesome...

Becky

It is what is taught. God is this old bearded looking guy who sits on a white throne and watches us, until he gets pissed and throws lightning bolts down at us for doing something wrong.
How can I have a relationship with someone I have never seen? I can IMAGINE this Jesus is with me right next to me, but if I were on a subway talking to Jesus people would thing I am looney. Is God watching us like an ant farm? Seriously.
Faith is believing in what is not seen, through evidence that is seen. God left us plenty of evidence that would lead anyone to believe in Him if they really want to. Then there's the Bible which gives us written information about Him.

God isn't that old man sitting on a throne waiting to throw lightning bolts down at us when we do wrong. Like a good parent, he watches us and guides us through life and gives both guidance & discipline when needed.

God knows every thought you have so you don't have to speak to Him audibly in public, either. There is nowhere you can go and be out of God's sight.

Faith is believing in what is not seen, through evidence that is seen. God left us plenty of evidence that would lead anyone to believe in Him if they really want to. Then there's the Bible which gives us written information about Him.

God isn't that old man sitting on a throne waiting to throw lightning bolts down at us when we do wrong. Like a good parent, he watches us and guides us through life and gives both guidance & discipline when needed.

God knows every thought you have so you don't have to speak to Him audibly in public, either. There is nowhere you can go and be out of God's sight.

Agreed.

"Faith is the substance (assurance) of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen (conviction of). (Heb 11:1)

Although this verse is essentially a spiritual definition of faith, it is applicable to all aspects of belief in, or not in, God. It makes things hoped for, or expected, as real as we are here today and already possess them, and that makes the evidence of things unseen blessings of Christianity.

Faith is the conviction that what God says is true, and demonstrates our confidence in the trustworthiness of God, and the promises He has made to the world, both believer and non-believer.

Pray that the unbeliever comes to this knowledge of faith.

It is what is taught. God is this old bearded looking guy who sits on a white throne and watches us, until he gets pissed and throws lightning bolts down at us for doing something wrong.
y.

You are thinking of Zeus.