Civil Service vs. Contractor

[sparkyaclown]

I can speak on this from both sides. I started as a fed at Indian Head many years ago. I decided to go for the contracting route after 7 years in due to the fact that I was performing the work of someone several grades higher than me yet due to red tape I was faced with waiting for my pay to catch up to my abilities. I spent 8 years as a contractor and finally returned to civil service a couple of years ago.

During my contractor time I was able to exceed what I had been making at Indian Head to the point of what my max earning potential would have been had I stayed. However the downside to this happened every year around the same time. The fact of life for a contractor is your contract gets rebid. If your lucky nothing changes. However at some point luck will run out, either through the cutting of your position from the contract or a new company takes over that you know from the start is not going to be a picnic to work for. Especially given the fact that they are under no obligation to continue paying you at your current level.

I was lucky enough to avoid these situations but still the stress of knowing the possibilities existed was allot to deal with. I saw friends of mine who worked for a different company (VERY large company at that) being relieved to find out that the company they worked for had won the new contract. Unfortunately the company neglected to inform the employees that a few slots were cut from the contract until the last day of the old contract. In other words the company knew for several weeks that they were to be let go but did not bother to give the employee any advanced notice so they could begin looking. This of course was an underhanded play on their part to keep the positions filled in the current contract until it expired and squeeze the maximum billable amount out of the contract. Instead the company arranged for their supervisors to meet them at their desks that afternoon to let them know that since they were the last ones hired they were being let go because the new contract did not have as many slots. Then the supervisor stood there to monitor them while they packed up their belongings and then escorted them out of the building. Same situation happened to two friends of mine and several of their coworkers working at different locations under different contracts for the same company.

In the end I was offered a civil service position while working as a contractor and decided that the instability of the contractor life far outweighed the earning potential. So I returned to civil service and realistically, I lost a total of $500 a year salary wise. Maybe less, since within two months of me starting the contract I was on was taken over by a new company who had way underbid it to get in the door. While I would never ask, little things my coworkers said here and there have convinced me that they all received a substantial paycut and that the benefits in no way came close to our former company.

In summary, I'm happy to be back in civil service again and will not enter the contractor field again. With 17 years in I would say stay in and if the drive gets you then keep hammering at transferring to something closer.

[Ken King (Premo)]

Originally Posted by beerlover

Yep - I just went out to the OPM website and looked it up. I swear I was never made aware of the pension part. I guess that was part of the benefit of HR regionalization. We don't even have an HR rep here at my organization, or at the other three I've been assigned to. By the way - why so angry?

Who is angry? I'm not, I just find it amazing that many people tend to open their traps without knowing what they are talking about, all I did was refute your misunderstanding of a system that you have been in for over 17 years and seem to know nothing about.

[beerlover]

Originally Posted by Ken King

Who is angry? I'm not, I just find it amazing that many people tend to open their traps without knowing what they are talking about, all I did was refute your misunderstanding of a system that you have been in for over 17 years and seem to know nothing about.

O.K., maybe I was concentrating too hard on your Yosemite Sam avatar. I never really gave much thought the the retirement system because I'm still so far away from retirement. They never offered any kind of training class on this stuff unless you were approaching retirement age. I read up on the TSP years ago and started contributing to that, but from everything I was told all these years a pension was never mentioned. I'm amazed myself.

And I opened my trap without knowing what I was talking about so I could find out. Thanks for the info.

[beerlover]

Originally Posted by sparkyaclown

I can speak on this from both sides...<snip>

Thanks - that's just the kind of perspective I was hoping to find.

[Ken King (Premo)]

Originally Posted by beerlover

O.K., maybe I was concentrating too hard on your Yosemite Sam avatar. I never really gave much thought the the retirement system because I'm still so far away from retirement. They never offered any kind of training class on this stuff unless you were approaching retirement age. I read up on the TSP years ago and started contributing to that, but from everything I was told all these years a pension was never mentioned. I'm amazed myself.

And I opened my trap without knowing what I was talking about so I could find out. Thanks for the info.

I learned many years ago to find out for myself what the real rules are, do yourself a favor and get familiar with Part III of Title 5 of the United States Code, many times HR and management get it wrong and if you know the rules you can avoid many of the unpleasantness that come with working in the Federal sector.

[StrawberryGal]

Originally Posted by Ken King

I learned many years ago to find out for myself what the real rules are, do yourself a favor and get familiar with Part III of Title 5 of the United States Code, many times HR and management get it wrong and if you know the rules you can avoid many of the unpleasantness that come with working in the Federal sector.

Would you teach and help me to get a job with Federal Government? I have been trying to get in for 11 years now.......

[lillyst]

Originally Posted by Ken King

Another comment.

Federal employees covered by FERS are elligible for an annuity after completing just 5 years of service (it will be deferred until age 62), with 10 or more years of service the annuity can start once reaching minimum retirement age. Claiming that you are trapped once in Federal Service is pure BS.

Maybe you are in a field that isn't very competitive. But, his field is and there are very few "real" openings and if they are they tend to be in crummy places. There is always continuous OPEN hire but those rarely result in an actual hire. Since you were so concerned about people opening their mouths w/o knowing what their talking about I thought you'd want to know that not all FED Positions are located in desirable places and not all positions with an "opening" actually result in a physical person being hired.

[DooDoo1402]

Originally Posted by beerlover

O.K., maybe I was concentrating too hard on your Yosemite Sam avatar. I never really gave much thought the the retirement system because I'm still so far away from retirement. They never offered any kind of training class on this stuff unless you were approaching retirement age. I read up on the TSP years ago and started contributing to that, but from everything I was told all these years a pension was never mentioned. I'm amazed myself.

And I opened my trap without knowing what I was talking about so I could find out. Thanks for the info.

Actually, I thought that his response was rather callous myself. And it's not the first one I seen from this person (to inlcude their own forum... )

And I agree, agencies do not have an obligation to teach you these things (unless you have a strong union contract). And yes, with the regionalization, it is now even harder to get HR support. And it is going to get worse, not better.

There are plenty of contractor opportunities down here... but they are just as competetive as civil service positions. This Comptroller selects from the open continuous too... but being in the loop here... it is rare they'll select outsiders for higher graded positions. There are too many Indians already here waiting... and they'll get picked over an outsider merely because management don't want or need a pile of Indians submitting EEO complaints. I am sure it is like that where ever you go in DoD, perhaps most other agencies. Someone suggested that there are other agencies here too, but chances of an outsider are slim -- based on the facts I stated above.

It wouldn't hurt to place a few statements in your resume that you are attempting to transfer because you live closer to Patuxent River and tell them you are the best thing since peanut butter, and lastly tell them you have ERP background (hopefully you have this)... We also have a component called the Business Financial Management (BFM) that are accounting and budget folks that support various programs and offices. They usually hire from the 501 open continuous. in fact, they have more positions and opportunities than the Comptroller shop. They are looking for folks with a budgeting background all the time... Good luck...

[BernieP]

Originally Posted by clevalley

Being a contractor I know we get paid a lot better... but the benefits for the Fed is really good - harder to get canned also!

I also know as a contractor we do not have federal red tape when it comes to purchasing or getting something done... this really depends on the agency - I do know the people I work for will come to me to buy something on the contract so they can get it faster than dealing with gov. purchasing...

If I had 17 years vested - I would ride it out, retire and come back as a contractor...

At certain levels this is not true. There is a salary range set for each job (under contract). If it were significantly less expensive to use a civil service person, they would.
Trust me, when it comes to spending the company's money the red tape will be just as thick. Pass through is another story.

[Ken King (Premo)]

Originally Posted by lillyst

Maybe you are in a field that isn't very competitive. But, his field is and there are very few "real" openings and if they are they tend to be in crummy places. There is always continuous OPEN hire but those rarely result in an actual hire. Since you were so concerned about people opening their mouths w/o knowing what their talking about I thought you'd want to know that not all FED Positions are located in desirable places and not all positions with an "opening" actually result in a physical person being hired.

Retirement isn't competitive at all. I did my 30+ years and now don't worry about it.

If you took the time to read I was only responding to the comment that he thought he didn't have a pension option for his service, which as even he later admitted after researching it was wrong.