Man with shotgun holding kids

[letmetellyou]

Originally Posted by BernieP

Here are the simple rules I was taught, never pull a gun unless you intend to use it. The guy was using it. He was using it to capture the perpetrators and not let them assault him. He contends the men were on his property. You are not allowed to defend your property with a firearm proactively He didn't use the firearm proactively. He held the kids at bay until the police arrived. and if "close enough" is the measure, please define that distance, 10, 20, 100 feet, yards?
I have also been taught that you cannot use deadly force, and pointing a loaded firearm is considered deadly force, to "defend" your property. Who taught you that? Get your money back, evidently they were wrong. The use of a weapon is only justified when you are in fear for your or your families's life and there are no safe alternatives - like not calling the kid onto your property. Where did anyone say he called the kid onto his property? You just make stuff up don't you?
What's not stated is as daming as what is. There were not allegations of mischief, no accusations of noise, damage or other bad behavior, just walking. The mere fact Fritz had to add "close enough" indicates the parents' comment that the boy was on common ground may be in fact true.

No allegations by who? You are only listening to one side of the story.

I know that when I was their age we had access to a car but we walked to our buddy's house to "hang out". We would play cards, shoot hoops (he had a hoop and lights on his driveway) or watch tv - just chill. If the local pizza sho was open we might even take the path behind the houses up to the shoppng center to buy a snack.

If the boys had been together, if it were a group my opinion, my rationale to believe the parents' version would be different.

The kid wasn't on a path behind the guys house.

Who died? So what you are saying, if someone comes onto my property I have to wait until they attack me to point my firearm at them? I am glad you are not the states attorney here.

If you can't use a firearm to safeguard property....why are armored car drivers carrying firearms?

[Baja28 (Premo)]

Originally Posted by BernieP

Here are the simple rules I was taught, never pull a gun unless you intend to use it. Intentions and actually using it are two different things. If I pull one, I will use it but only as a last resort.

You are not allowed to defend your property with a firearm proactively You need educating...

and if "close enough" is the measure, please define that distance, 10, 20, 100 feet, yards? You have a point here.

I have also been taught that you cannot use deadly force, More educating required...

and pointing a loaded firearm is considered deadly force, to "defend" your property. Lots more education required...

The use of a weapon is only justified when you are in fear for your or your families's life and there are no safe alternatives Yay! you almost got one right!! Remove the word "only" and you score!

- like not calling the kid onto your property. What's not stated is as daming as what is. There were not allegations of mischief, no accusations of noise, damage or other bad behavior, just walking. Ummm...trespassing is illegal pal.

The mere fact Fritz had to add "close enough" indicates the parents' comment that the boy was on common ground may be in fact true.

I know that when I was their age we had access to a car but we walked to our buddy's house to "hang out". We would play cards, shoot hoops (he had a hoop and lights on his driveway) or watch tv - just chill. If the local pizza sho was open we might even take the path behind the houses up to the shoppng center to buy a snack.

If the boys had been together, if it were a group my opinion, my rationale to believe the parents' version would be different.

I hope you don't own a gun. You have much to learn about Castle Doctrine and the use of firearms.

[ItalianScallion (Premo)]

Originally Posted by letmetellyou

St. Mary’s County’s state’s attorney said Monday that a Wildewood resident was lawfully protecting his family and property during the nighttime confrontation, and that no charges will be filed in the matter.
Where's all the people who say that you can't use a firearm to protect your property in Maryland?

You just won't admit defeat and let it rest will you? I was told by my Charles County officer friends that only cops can go "one up" in these situations. One up means that, if the thief has a knife or a gun, the cops can shoot. There is a heirarchy of weapons but even the cops cannot shoot in all situations.

If I hear someone in my house and I get up, turn the lights on and see that he only has a screw driver, I cannot shoot him! If I do, I'm going to jail. If it's dark and I'm not sure, I might stand a chance in court. Honestly, you need to get off this kick that MD follows the same RTC laws as Texas...

[Baja28 (Premo)]

Originally Posted by ItalianScallion

You just won't admit defeat and let it rest will you? I was told by my Charles County officer friends that only cops can go "one up" in these situations. One up means that, if the thief has a knife or a gun, the cops can shoot. There is a heirarchy of weapons but even the cops cannot shoot in all situations.

If I hear someone in my house and I get up, turn the lights on and see that he only has a screw driver, I cannot shoot him! If I do, I'm going to jail. If it's dark and I'm not sure, I might stand a chance in court. Honestly, you need to get off this kick that MD follows the same RTC laws as Texas...

Dude, he didn't shoot anyone. Never even fired a shot. He detained them as is his lawful right to do.

[letmetellyou]

Originally Posted by ItalianScallion

You just won't admit defeat and let it rest will you? I was told by my Charles County officer friends that only cops can go "one up" in these situations. One up means that, if the thief has a knife or a gun, the cops can shoot. There is a heirarchy of weapons but even the cops cannot shoot in all situations.

If I hear someone in my house and I get up, turn the lights on and see that he only has a screw driver, I cannot shoot him! If I do, I'm going to jail. If it's dark and I'm not sure, I might stand a chance in court. Honestly, you need to get off this kick that MD follows the same RTC laws as Texas...

Um...why would I admit defeat when it has been revealed to you that here....IN MARYLAND...there have been people who broke into a house, were shot, and the homeowner was NOT charged with anything. I don't know what the laws are in Texas, but I do know that you have a right to defend yourself in your home here in Maryland. Deadly force applies.

Man Breaks Into Home, Shot, Then Arrested - Southern Maryland News

(MD) Pr. George's Man Shoots, Kills Intruder (Washington Post) - THR
another one...no charges.

Baltimore man cleared in killing - baltimoresun.com
and another one.

[ItalianScallion (Premo)]

Originally Posted by Baja28

Dude, he didn't shoot anyone. Never even fired a shot. He detained them as is his lawful right to do.

I know that. I'm just making this point to "letmetellyou" about a previous thread to show that liberal Maryland automatically makes the good guy guilty until proven innocent...

Originally Posted by letmetellyou

Man Breaks Into Home, Shot, Then Arrested - Southern Maryland News

This is one exception that I was speaking about. Usually at night (5am in this case) and there was a struggle over the gun. I shouldn't have to tell some lawyer that I was in fear of my life nor should I have to struggle with an assailant and hope I come out alive before I can shoot him.

Originally Posted by letmetellyou

(MD) Pr. George's Man Shoots, Kills Intruder (Washington Post) - THR
another one...no charges.

But look at the comments at the bottom of the article from other Marylanders who know Maryland and this:

"In the other recent shooting, a Laurel man fired on four people who were trying to break into his SUV in September, killing a 16-year-old boy and seriously wounding a 23-year-old man. A grand jury indicted the SUV owner, Glenn R. Ellis, 37, on murder and other charges. He is scheduled to go on trial in May." Wanna bet he didn't walk? Wake up bro! Md is against the good guy.

Originally Posted by letmetellyou

Baltimore man cleared in killing - baltimoresun.com
and another one.

Again, we're up against someones opinion of what a "justified" homicide is. If you read the article, the cops took the law abiding mans' guns for evidence and they still had them after 9 years??? I hope they gave him a loaner

"Nine years later or one year later, the facts are the facts". West, meanwhile, wants his weapons returned. Police seized two handguns — a .357 revolver and a .380 automatic — from him that night, both of which were registered but taken into evidence by police.

Massey guessed that the guns were destroyed long ago, but police spokesman Anthony Guglielmi said police have some good news for West: His guns are still in a police evidence room.

Look, all I'm saying is that Maryland is not 100% on these situations. Criminals don't go to school to learn that, if they break into certain houses, they will be shot & killed. I would never shoot someone breaking into my house w/o some sort of provocation or need to. But I can also say that, if it's at night and I don't know if he has a gun, down he goes. I'll expect you to plead my case if/when I get charged.

[letmetellyou]

Originally Posted by ItalianScallion

This is one exception that I was speaking about. Usually at night (5am in this case) and there was a struggle over the gun. I shouldn't have to tell some lawyer that I was in fear of my life nor should I have to struggle with an assailant and hope I come out alive before I can shoot him.

Ok...so this is the one exception, but you see there are three more.

But look at the comments at the bottom of the article from other Marylanders who know Maryland and this:

"In the other recent shooting, a Laurel man fired on four people who were trying to break into his SUV in September, killing a 16-year-old boy and seriously wounding a 23-year-old man. A grand jury indicted the SUV owner, Glenn R. Ellis, 37, on murder and other charges. He is scheduled to go on trial in May." Wanna bet he didn't walk? Wake up bro! Md is against the good guy.

Yea...um...show where is it legal to shoot someone for trying to break into a vehicle?

Again, we're up against someones opinion of what a "justified" homicide is. If you read the article, the cops took the law abiding mans' guns for evidence and they still had them after 9 years??? I hope they gave him a loaner

You do you realize that the cops take cops guns after a police involved shooting? Like the article said...it's evidence. Now as far as them not giving it back, the case was obviously forgotten about. Still another example which bolsters my argument.

Look, all I'm saying is that Maryland is not 100% on these situations. Criminals don't go to school to learn that, if they break into certain houses, they will be shot & killed. I would never shoot someone breaking into my house w/o some sort of provocation or need to. But I can also say that, if it's at night and I don't know if he has a gun, down he goes. I'll expect you to plead my case if/when I get charged.

Maryland is 100% on these situations. The police friend of yours in Charles County is wrong. Deadly force can be met with deadly force in any situtation. If you wake up in the middle of the night and find an intruder in your house with a screwdriver and you fear for your life, you will not be charged with a crime. I defy you to show me an example otherwise.

[tom88]

Originally Posted by Lurk

It was such a warm night that night, I'm sure the friend had all the windows and doors open and it was easy to hear the confrontation in the middle of the neighbor's back yard across the street. You know how acute a kid's hearing is resulting from all that i-Pod and Video gaming stuff they play these days.

I think this is more of that sarcasm I noted in another post.

[tom88]

Originally Posted by ItalianScallion

You just won't admit defeat and let it rest will you? I was told by my Charles County officer friends that only cops can go "one up" in these situations. One up means that, if the thief has a knife or a gun, the cops can shoot. There is a heirarchy of weapons but even the cops cannot shoot in all situations.

If I hear someone in my house and I get up, turn the lights on and see that he only has a screw driver, I cannot shoot him! If I do, I'm going to jail. If it's dark and I'm not sure, I might stand a chance in court. Honestly, you need to get off this kick that MD follows the same RTC laws as Texas...

Well sir let me clue you in on something. Maryland has had a "Castle Doctrine", protecting a person from criminal prosecution for as long as I can remember, however they one uped it in 2010 when a law was signed providing civil immunity for a resident protecting his/her self in their home.

[awpitt]

Letter in yesterday's Enterprise...

On the night of Oct. 20, my son was held at gunpoint by a Wildewood resident. I live in Wildewood — a family-friendly community with pools, parks, walking and bike paths; a neighborhood where it is commonplace for kids to regularly play flashlight tag after dark, running through the woods and backyards of the neighborhood. That is the culture.
My son was going to his friend’s home in Wildewood. They were meeting on his back deck, so without a second thought he walked through the clearing between homes — the common area.

SoMdNews.com: How we think about guns in St. Mary’s