Planned Parenthood

[teenageddirtbag]

Abortion is murder mmmkay.

[libby]

One poster (I think Wenchy) has stated that abortion is a no-brainer in the first trimester, worthy of more consideration in the 2nd, and abhorrent in the 3rd. Well what if we break that down into weeks, or even days of gestation instead of trimesters?
If pregnancy generally lasts 270 days +/-, is it okay to abort until day 200, but on 201 it becomes a crime?
If memory serves, the dissenting opinions in Roe v. Wade recognized that viability would be earlier and earlier as technology advanced, and indeed, that is the case. There are images of heart surgeries being done on babies +/- 22 weeks along. There is one picture in which the baby grabs the surgeons finger. So again, we have a baby in one hospital room being saved through medical advancements, and down the hall another baby of the same gestational age is having it's brain punctured and sucked out.
Either all life is valuable, or some lives can be discarded for whatever reason is perceived as legitimate by the more powerful, or the majority. Hitler and Hussein did nothing different than that which you advocate.

Originally Posted by libby

One poster (I think Wenchy) has stated that abortion is a no-brainer in the first trimester, worthy of more consideration in the 2nd, and abhorrent in the 3rd. Well what if we break that down into weeks, or even days of gestation instead of trimesters?
If pregnancy generally lasts 270 days +/-, is it okay to abort until day 200, but on 201 it becomes a crime?
If memory serves, the dissenting opinions in Roe v. Wade recognized that viability would be earlier and earlier as technology advanced, and indeed, that is the case. There are images of heart surgeries being done on babies +/- 22 weeks along. There is one picture in which the baby grabs the surgeons finger. So again, we have a baby in one hospital room being saved through medical advancements, and down the hall another baby of the same gestational age is having it's brain punctured and sucked out.
Either all life is valuable, or some lives can be discarded for whatever reason is perceived as legitimate by the more powerful, or the majority. Hitler and Hussein did nothing different than that which you advocate.

Libby? If a child is not wanted it shouldn't be born and "evacuated" ASAP. Preferably in the first 8 weeks. Even at that age you will see their stubby little arms and legs thrashing as the vacuum sucks and the curette dices them apart.

If the child is "viable" then I do have a problem with it, and hope people like you will be there to adopt the unwanted child, or you will pay with your tax dollars while this child is being raised.

Do you want to support all of these extra "unwanted" people being raised by parents who NEVER wanted them...and support the parents as well?

I don't, but I respect your opinion.

Are you a foster parent? Have you adopted any of these children? Do you educate so abortion is never even an option?

[PsyOps]

Originally Posted by libby

One poster (I think Wenchy) has stated that abortion is a no-brainer in the first trimester, worthy of more consideration in the 2nd, and abhorrent in the 3rd. Well what if we break that down into weeks, or even days of gestation instead of trimesters?
If pregnancy generally lasts 270 days +/-, is it okay to abort until day 200, but on 201 it becomes a crime?
If memory serves, the dissenting opinions in Roe v. Wade recognized that viability would be earlier and earlier as technology advanced, and indeed, that is the case. There are images of heart surgeries being done on babies +/- 22 weeks along. There is one picture in which the baby grabs the surgeons finger. So again, we have a baby in one hospital room being saved through medical advancements, and down the hall another baby of the same gestational age is having it's brain punctured and sucked out.
Either all life is valuable, or some lives can be discarded for whatever reason is perceived as legitimate by the more powerful, or the majority. Hitler and Hussein did nothing different than that which you advocate.

For the most extreme believers in abortion it's not a matter of value, it's a matter of viability. Value has no meaning in the termination of life if it's not viable. But ask any of them when a fetus becomes viable and I bet they can't come up with a timeframe.

If you want to make a comparison of Hitler and S. Hussein to abortion you have to be willing to admit that abortion is not central to one person. This makes it even more scary in a couple of different ways:

1) It destroys life at its most innocent level.

2) You can easily remove the Hitlers and Husseins of the world; how do you remove an entire movement of people that support such killing as late-term and partial-birth abortions, especially when it is virtually condoned in our legal system?

[PsyOps]

Originally Posted by Wenchy

Libby? If a child is not wanted it shouldn't be born and "evacuated" ASAP. Preferably in the first 8 weeks. Even at that age you will see their stubby little arms and legs thrashing as the vacuum sucks and the curette dices them apart.

Do you even realize what you are saying? A child not wanted? Well, I don’t want my 2 year old anymore. Phhhtttt… gone. Can’t you see how insane that sounds? For so many of us this is an incomprehensible thought.

Originally Posted by Wenchy

If the child is "viable" then I do have a problem with it, and hope people like you will be there to adopt the unwanted child, or you will pay with your tax dollars while this child is being raised.

Are you willing to define for me when a child is viable? Please tell me when the exact moment is?

Originally Posted by Wenchy

Do you want to support all of these extra "unwanted" people being raised by parents who NEVER wanted them...and support the parents as well?

Do you realize a sea turtle egg has more rights to life than a human “fetus”? When a sea turtle lays its eggs they become federally protected and anyone that so much as disturbs them has committed a federal crime. Don’t you find that a little amazing? Less than 1% of the abortions are due to the most extreme circumstances (rape, incest, life of the mother, severe disability…). That makes abortion nothing more than birth control. What that means is we have a society that is behaving irresponsibly. Actions with no consequences. Go get it evacuated. Just that easy. We’re talking about a human life.

Originally Posted by Wenchy

Are you a foster parent? Have you adopted any of these children? Do you educate so abortion is never even an option?

Yes! With my kids and I’m doing it right now; I hope.

[ItalianScallion (Premo)]

Originally Posted by Wenchy

Libby? If a child is not wanted it shouldn't be
conceived in the first place!

:fixed:

Originally Posted by Wenchy

If the child is "viable" then I do have a problem with it, and hope people like you will be there to adopt the unwanted child, or you will pay with your tax dollars while this child is being raised.
Do you educate so abortion is never even an option?

I'd rather pay for a child's care than for it's termination.
What about old people Wenchy? With your thinking they can be terminated too. Is that OK? Dayum lady! A life is a life and it is from conception to death!
And yes I do educate so abortion is never an option. God is the controller of the life & death of the innocent, not us.

[Radiant1]

Originally Posted by Wenchy

Do you educate so abortion is never even an option?

I do and there are also two children alive today due to my counseling of their mothers. They are healthy, happy, and well loved. I help the mothers out with $ flow from time to time when they need it too. Both have told me that things weren't as bad as they seemed at first and were glad they didn't get an abortion. Most pro-lifers don't just talk smack, they do what they can to make a difference.

You know Wenchy, if PP were to just stick with education and preventing conception I wouldn't have too much problem with them; however, the fact that they readily perform abortions and hold back info on crimes that may be involved in the pregnancy, etc. makes it another issue. In addition, I do not like my tax dollars going to help them perform abortions either, I'd much rather my tax dollars go to education, counseling, vocational training, etc.

As Libby pointed out, Margaret Sanger was a racist and advocated negative eugenics. This is part of the ideology that PP was founded on and I think that should be taken into consideration before one praises her efforts.

[puggymom]

Most people who are pro choice are not pro abortion. Pro abortion, to me anyway, means every pregnancy should end in abortion. I do not like abortion BUT I have said it before but I firmly believe that abortion should be safe, legal, and RARE!!!! Do you honestly think this morning as I watched my 15 month old have a major tantrum (with real tears and everything) because I would not let him dump the dogs water bowl over I thought to myself 'gosh I should just abort him?' Of course not.
But I am a realist and abortions WILL happen whether they are legal or not. In fact abortion rates where it is illegal is comparable to where it is legal so laws really accomplish nothing:

Facts on Induced Abortion Worldwide

Legal restrictions on abortion do not affect its incidence. For example, the abortion rate is 29 in Africa, where abortion is illegal in many circumstances in most countries, and it is 28 in Europe, where abortion is generally permitted on broad grounds. The lowest rates in the world are in Western and Northern Europe, where abortion is accessible with few restrictions

This is defiantly a supply-demand issue. I think instead of spending all this time, money, and energy on making abortion illegal (supply) we should ask ourselves WHY is there such a demand?
We as a society have to be doing something wrong if so many woman are getting pregnant only to terminate the pregnancy. The problem is I do not think there is one right answer that will work for every child, kwim?

[This_person]

Originally Posted by Wenchy

The viability of the fetus outside of the womb. I have no memories of the womb, even from the third trimester, do you? During the third trimester the baby can survive with today's technology.

If a fetus were "viable" at 19 weeks, would you change your stance on second trimester? I have no memories of being one year old, either. And, I certainly could not have maintained myself without support from other people - should my parents have been able to abort me from life?

I still think the world would be better off without people procreating and spitting out children they can't afford/want.

I agree with this. But, when such actions happen, I don't think that their killing the kids is a reasonable answer.

Again, I feel sorry for you that you chose to procreate with a woman who chose to abort your baby. That's very sad and I can understand your stand on this issue because of this.

I do appreciate your kind words and understanding on this.

[puggymom]

Originally Posted by This_person

If a fetus were "viable" at 19 weeks, would you change your stance on second trimester?

I know this probably sounds but I wish they could be able to remove the 'embryo-fetus-baby' and place it in some sort ot womb-like incubator until it is fully developed.