In Georgia clash, a lesson on U.S. need for Russia

[Nonno (Premo)]

In Georgia clash, a lesson on U.S. need for Russia - International Herald Tribune

WASHINGTON: The image of President George W. Bush smiling and chatting with Prime Minister Vladimir Putin of Russia from the stands of the Beijing Olympics even as Russian aircraft were shelling Georgia outlines the reality of America's Russia policy. While America considers Georgia its strongest ally in the bloc of former Soviet countries, Washington needs Russia too much on big issues like Iran to risk it all to defend Georgia.

And State Department officials made it clear on Saturday that there was no chance the United States would intervene militarily.
Bush did use tough language, demanding that Russia stop bombing. And Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice demanded that Russia "respect Georgia's territorial integrity."
What did Putin do? First, he repudiated President Nicolas Sarkozy of France in Beijing, refusing to budge when Sarkozy tried to dissuade Russia from its military operation. "It was a very, very tough meeting," a senior Western official said afterward. "Putin was saying, 'We are going to make them pay. We are going to make justice.' "
Then, Putin flew from Beijing to a region that borders South Ossetia, arriving after an announcement that Georgia was pulling its troops out of the capital of the breakaway region. He appeared ostensibly to coordinate assistance to refugees who had fled South Ossetia into neighboring Russia, but the Russian message was clear: This is our sphere of influence; others stay out.

[Pete (Premo)]

If you guys have seizures over 4,000 dead in 5 years in Iraq I wonder how you will react with the 10's of thousands of dead US troops if we sent a division to Georgia.

Are you the same people who were crying "Iraq is a sovereign nation, we have no business meddling with Saddam, he's not so bad, we are evil imperialists! Bush is a war monger

[Larry Gude (Premo)]

Originally Posted by Nonno

[ The image of President George W. Bush smiling and chatting with Prime Minister Vladimir Putin of Russia from the stands of the Beijing Olympics even as Russian aircraft were shelling Georgia outlines the reality of America's Russia policy.

...there really any need to worry at this point? Let me know when they get closer to Atlanta. Even then, it's not really news. I mean, it's happened before...

[forestal]

I think our objection to dead Americans is that they shouldn't die for nothing.

No WMD's, Saddam not a threat to our National Security = 4000 dead Americans who gave their lives for George's lies.

Originally Posted by Pete

If you guys have seizures over 4,000 dead in 5 years in Iraq I wonder how you will react with the 10's of thousands of dead US troops if we sent a division to Georgia.

Are you the same people who were crying "Iraq is a sovereign nation, we have no business meddling with Saddam, he's not so bad, we are evil imperialists! Bush is a war monger

[forestal]

Whoa! I never thought I meet a conservative who tolerated Russian expansion....

You guys really have lost all your core values and only have one left: make up excuses for poor governing.

Originally Posted by Larry Gude

...there really any need to worry at this point? Let me know when they get closer to Atlanta. Even then, it's not really news. I mean, it's happened before...

[RadioPatrol]

Originally Posted by forestal

I think our objection to dead Americans is that they shouldn't die for nothing.

No WMD's, Saddam not a threat to our National Security = 4000 dead Americans who gave their lives for George's lies.

Get off it Frosty .... @ the time 6 - 8 yrs ago ... everyone including your Angel BC thought Iraq had WMDs ... quit trying to rewrite history with todays facts

[RadioPatrol]

Originally Posted by forestal

Whoa! I never thought I meet a conservative who tolerated Russian expansion....

You guys really have lost all your core values and only have one left: make up excuses for poor governing.

WASHINGTON - Russia's use of overwhelming military force against Georgia, including strategic bombers and ballistic missiles, is disproportionate to any threat from the former Soviet state and could escalate tensions in the volatile region, a senior U.S. official said Saturday.

This is a dumb ass comment ... and shows how wrong headed politicians and diplomats are ... when you unleash the dogs of war ... you go full on, no pansy ass half measures ... sounds like the Russians know how to engage in a conflict

Political status

The United Nations, European Union, Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe (OSCE), Council of the European Union, North Atlantic Treaty Organization (NATO) and all other countries in the world recognize South Ossetia as part of Georgia. However, the de facto independent republic governed by the secessionist government held a second independence referendum[6] on November 12, 2006, after its first referendum in 1992 was not recognized by the international community as valid.[7] According to the Tskhinvali election authorities, the referendum turned out a majority for independence from Georgia where 99% of South Ossetian voters supported independence and the turnout for the vote was 95%[8] and the referendum was monitored by a team of 34 international observers from Germany, Austria, Poland, Sweden and other countries at 78 polling stations.[9] However, it was not recognized internationally by the UN, European Union, OSCE, NATO and the Russian Federation, given the lack of ethnic Georgian participation and the legality of such referendum without recognition from the central government in Tbilisi.[10] The European Union, OSCE and NATO condemned the referendum. Parallel to the secessionist held referendum and elections, the Ossetian opposition movement (The Salvation Union of South Ossetia) to Kokoity, organized their own elections in which both Georgian and some Ossetian inhabitants of the region voted in favour of Dmitri Sanakoev as the alternative President of South Ossetia.[11] The alternative elections of Sanakoev claimed full support of the ethnic Georgian population. In 2007, Dmitri Sanakoev became the head of the Provisional Administration of South Ossetia.

On July 13, 2007, Georgia set up a state commission, chaired by the Prime Minister Zurab Noghaideli, to develop South Ossetia's autonomous status within the Georgian state. According to the Georgian officials, the status will be elaborated within the framework of "an all-inclusive dialogue" with all the forces and communities within the Ossetian society.[12]

On August 8, 2008, on the same day as the 2008 Olympic Games officially commenced, hostilities began between Georgian forces and South Ossetia's separatist forces. The Russian Foreign Minister has stated that over 1500 civilians and 15 Russian peace keepers have been killed since hostilities began.[13]

it sounds like the entire area is influx ... and Georgia was the aggressor ... but things have been back and forth for a couple yrs ....

still not our concern ... this is a European Problem ... let the EU and UN deal with it ... with out involving us ...

[Pete (Premo)]

Where is you libs favorite prom queen, the UN? They should vote to condemn Russia for their not nice behavior. THAT will get Putin's goat and make him stop.

[Pete (Premo)]

Originally Posted by forestal

I think our objection to dead Americans is that they shouldn't die for nothing.

No WMD's, Saddam not a threat to our National Security = 4000 dead Americans who gave their lives for George's lies.

Your logic befuddles me

Saddam : ruthless dictator + hundreds of thousands dead + tens of thousands tortured + invaded neighbor + defied UN + kicked out UN inspectors not allowing them to verify no WMD orders + coalition of a few nations going with us = Not worth it.

Versus

Russia-Georgia conflict : thousands dead + no WMD threat + no coalition of nations going with us = worth military action.

Why don't you just admit it, you are going to blast Bush regardless of what he does and you don't give a shiat what it is?

DIAF hypocrite.

[Nonno (Premo)]

Originally Posted by Pete

If you guys have seizures over 4,000 dead in 5 years in Iraq I wonder how you will react with the 10's of thousands of dead US troops if we sent a division to Georgia.

Are you the same people who were crying "Iraq is a sovereign nation, we have no business meddling with Saddam, he's not so bad, we are evil imperialists! Bush is a war monger

Bush is NOT a warmonger. He's a wimp masquerading as a cowboy.