welfare payments are too high

[bcp (Premo)]

Originally Posted by DipStick

I'm all for reform, but eliminating the system as a whole? Should we take benefits away from people who actually need help and use the system the way it's designed solely because others abuse the system?

lets look at that.
First, no. there are people that really are in a position due to health that prevents them from working, so In my opinion, it is a fair and just tax placed on me to assist them.
however, I would be willing to bet that the vast majority of social suckers are not in this position. and they flaunt it. Look at JPC, on one hand claims he cant work cant do anything, yet he proves that he can do research when he wants, He is able to type and from what I see communicate semi coherently, he even thinks he is able to hold a high public office and work for the good of all deadbeats. He is scamming the system and he would be one of them that were cut off in my plan.

but, lets say that you are on welfare because you honestly need it, there is no answer when it comes to you finding employment because of a real condition.
Now, you have a neighbor, you are friends with them. They are on the public payroll, but you know they are scamming, you say nothing because it does not hurt you at all.
But, what if it was said that on such and such a date, welfare would end as you know it and you would be reduced to the plan, or something like it as I outlined, and the reason was that there were too many scamming the system and because of it the system would be broke.

To keep your rightful assistance, you might just be tempted to turn in those people you know that are out working under the table jobs all day and collecting their check each month.

[sockgirl77 (Premo)]

Originally Posted by bcp

lets look at that.
First, no. there are people that really are in a position due to health that prevents them from working, so In my opinion, it is a fair and just tax placed on me to assist them.
however, I would be willing to bet that the vast majority of social suckers are not in this position. and they flaunt it. Look at JPC, on one hand claims he cant work cant do anything, yet he proves that he can do research when he wants, He is able to type and from what I see communicate semi coherently, he even thinks he is able to hold a high public office and work for the good of all deadbeats. He is scamming the system and he would be one of them that were cut off in my plan.

but, lets say that you are on welfare because you honestly need it, there is no answer when it comes to you finding employment because of a real condition.
Now, you have a neighbor, you are friends with them. They are on the public payroll, but you know they are scamming, you say nothing because it does not hurt you at all.
But, what if it was said that on such and such a date, welfare would end as you know it and you would be reduced to the plan, or something like it as I outlined, and the reason was that there were too many scamming the system and because of it the system would be broke.

To keep your rightful assistance, you might just be tempted to turn in those people you know that are out working under the table jobs all day and collecting their check each month.

There are also single mothers who are working full time that get assistance because they cannot make ends meet. One of the welfare benefits that I strongly agree with keeping is Daycare Assistance. Daycare is outrageous right now. Once upon a time, I worked to just pay daycare. After I had Thing 3, I was paying $550 per week in daycare alone.

[SamSpade]

Originally Posted by DipStick

I'm all for reform, but eliminating the system as a whole? Should we take benefits away from people who actually need help and use the system the way it's designed solely because others abuse the system?

Thing is, why do we even have them? Why not just increase the payments and decrease the food stamps?

As I understand it, in the thirties and forties, we were still dealing with over and under production on farms, and the government dealt with "surplus" food it acquired by redistributing it to those who had the stamps to get it. People were actually starving then.

Nowadays, starvation is extremely unlikely, and childhood obesity is MUCH greater among the poor. They're not starving.

We should cut food subsidies and deal with it otherwise. A substantial amount of money is wasted just HIRING people to keep track of who gets the stamps, and subsidizing farmers needlessly raises the cost of food in the first place. There has to be a better way to address the problem than by tweaking a model that is eighty years out of date.

[bcp (Premo)]

Originally Posted by sockgirl77

There are also single mothers who are working full time that get assistance because they cannot make ends meet. One of the welfare benefits that I strongly agree with keeping is Daycare Assistance. Daycare is outrageous right now. Once upon a time, I worked to just pay daycare. After I had Thing 3, I was paying $550 per week in daycare alone.

Why did you keep going back to JPC?
at what point does someones choices become the responsibility of everyone else?
Was there no father to go after for payment?

Im sorry but, to be honest if you already had things 1 and 2 and were on assistance, what was it in your mind that made you think thing 3 would be a good idea?

[SamSpade]

Originally Posted by bcp

Im sorry but, to be honest if you already had things 1 and 2 and were on assistance, what was it in your mind that made you think thing 3 would be a good idea?

In the case of my two sisters - becoming a single mom of three kids wasn't in the plan before Daddy decided to start jumping the assistant. Lots of single moms start that experience as a working married mom.

[sockgirl77 (Premo)]

Originally Posted by bcp

Why did you keep going back to JPC?
at what point does someones choices become the responsibility of everyone else?
Was there no father to go after for payment?

Im sorry but, to be honest if you already had things 1 and 2 and were on assistance, what was it in your mind that made you think thing 3 would be a good idea?

I wasn't on assistance with Things 1 and 2. I ended up single 4 weeks after Thing 3 was born. I got daycare assistance for a very brief period of time until I no longer qualified for it. And yes, there was a father to go after payment. However, not even the government can force him to pay his child support. My point is that there are times that it is needed. Things happen. It helped me get thru a rough period of time. I had to jump thru ridiculous hoops to get any assistance that I had. However, I did not live off of it. I always worked. I would not have been able to work for the few months that I did qualify for the daycare assistance if it was not there. But, because I was able to work, I was able to get where I am today. I am supporting my 3 kids without any assistance or child support and bought my first home 2 months ago.

Like others have said, welfare should be there as temporary assistance for those that are helping themselves. Unfortunately, that is not always the case and there are many people who are abusing it.

[kwillia]

Originally Posted by sockgirl77

I wasn't on assistance with Things 1 and 2. I ended up single 4 weeks after Thing 3 was born. I got daycare assistance for a very brief period of time until I no longer qualified for it. And yes, there was a father to go after payment. However, not even the government can force him to pay his child support. My point is that there are times that it is needed. Things happen. It helped me get thru a rough period of time. I had to jump thru ridiculous hoops to get any assistance that I had. However, I did not live off of it. I always worked. I would not have been able to work for the few months that I did qualify for the daycare assistance if it was not there. But, because I was able to work, I was able to get where I am today. I am supporting my 3 kids without any assistance or child support and bought my first home 2 months ago.

Like others have said, welfare should be there as temporary assistance for those that are helping themselves. Unfortunately, that is not always the case and there are many people who are abusing it.

The story you laid out is a perfect example as to how it should work. Receiving entitlements should never become the "career". Time after time I hear of when the scruitiny is upfront and people who legitimately end up in a situation needing temporary help cannot get it yet people who have received for years get to continue doing so without a 2nd glance.

The longer someone is on the dole, the more focus should shined on them and their situation until something finally forces them onto their own two feet.

[Nickel]

Originally Posted by sockgirl77

bought my first home 2 months ago.

That's so awesome! Congratulations!

[sockgirl77 (Premo)]

Originally Posted by kwillia

The story you laid out is a perfect example as to how it should work. Receiving entitlements should never become the "career". Time after time I hear of when the scruitiny is upfront and people who legitimately end up in a situation needing temporary help cannot get it yet people who have received for years get to continue doing so without a 2nd glance.

The longer someone is on the dole, the more focus should shined on them and their situation until something finally forces them onto their own two feet.

I personally know someone who was able to live off the system while she was in college. They paid her tuition, daycare, gave her cash assistance for gas and whatnot, gave her food stamps, AND she qualified for Section 8 that paid her housing. She has had her AA for a couple of years now and still receives a majority of the same assistance. Why? She quickly figured out that if she kept herself under a certain income level she would qualify for all but the cash assistance. She is not even using her degree. It has all baffled me. It makes me want to puke. I could go on and on about everything that she is receiving but I just do not want to get my BP raised this afternoon.

[sockgirl77 (Premo)]

Originally Posted by Nickel

That's so awesome! Congratulations!

Thank you. I felt so liberated until I had to start forking out money for repairs/renovations.

But, I am saving money per month. My mortgage is cheaper than my rent.