Help with handgun purchase

[Novus Collectus]

Originally Posted by Sparx

I haven't looked over the paperwork he gave me yet. I thought he said it was registered in his name in OH. I have no property in OH. He bought it just before Christmas.

The paperwork is probably just the reciept. Some people confuse buying from a dealer as registration.

You do not need property to have a residence in another state, you can have a room or a place to stay that you maintain as a residence for when you stay there.

If one of you is not a MD resident, and if he is only an Ohio resident and you do not maintain a residence in Ohio, then he did not give you the handgun yet, he is letting you temporarily borrow it for sporting purposes because if he gave it to you, then you broke the law.
What you have to do to make it a legal transfer of ownership accross state lines is to find a MD dealer that will let him ship the handgun to him, then have the MD dealer transfer it to you. He will need to send a copy of his ID.

Now the dealer does not know where he is, so if you shipped the handgun to the MD dealer with a copy of his ID and contact info, then you should be covered because technically you are sending it to the MD dealer with the other person's permission and by their authority even though the dealer does not need to know this.

If you do not transfer ownership through a MD FFL and you were not residing in Ohio at the time of transfer, then that is a violation of both MD and Fed law. If you go through a MD dealer, this would fix everything, but remember, to make things go smoothly, the handgun is going to be shipped to the dealer by the person that is giving it to you. It would not be a good idea to just walk into the shop with it because it will confuse the dealer and he will probably refuse to do it.

I am not a lawyer, but you are not the first person that has had to deal with this before.

If you were not residing in Ohio at the time of transfer, then your possession right now is only legal if the handgun is being loaned to you because by both MD and fed law one can loan a firearm to another state resident for sporting purposes. For a handgun to be legally loaned in MD, it has to be for free with no money changing hands. So remember, right now it is a "temporary, gratuitous loan" for sporting purposes.

[Sparx]

Originally Posted by Novus Collectus

The paperwork is probably just the reciept. Some people confuse buying from a dealer as registration.

You do not need property to have a residence in another state, you can have a room or a place to stay that you maintain as a residence for when you stay there.

If one of you is not a MD resident, and if he is only an Ohio resident and you do not maintain a residence in Ohio, then he did not give you the handgun yet, he is letting you temporarily borrow it for sporting purposes because if he gave it to you, then you broke the law.
What you have to do to make it a legal transfer of ownership accross state lines is to find a MD dealer that will let him ship the handgun to him, then have the MD dealer transfer it to you. He will need to send a copy of his ID.

Now the dealer does not know where he is, so if you shipped the handgun to the MD dealer with a copy of his ID and contact info, then you should be covered because technically you are sending it to the MD dealer with the other person's permission and by their authority even though the dealer does not need to know this.

If you do not transfer ownership through a MD FFL and you were not residing in Ohio at the time of transfer, then that is a violation of both MD and Fed law. If you go through a MD dealer, this would fix everything, but remember, to make things go smoothly, the handgun is going to be shipped to the dealer by the person that is giving it to you. It would not be a good idea to just walk into the shop with it because it will confuse the dealer and he will probably refuse to do it.

I am not a lawyer, but you are not the first person that has had to deal with this before.

If you were not residing in Ohio at the time of transfer, then your possession right now is only legal if the handgun is being loaned to you because by both MD and fed law one can loan a firearm to another state resident for sporting purposes. For a handgun to be legally loaned in MD, it has to be for free with no money changing hands. So remember, right now it is a "temporary, gratuitous loan" for sporting purposes.

Can he loan it to me forever and can I take it to a shooting range for SPORT without losing it?

[DEEKAYPEE8569]

Originally Posted by JimW711

And the "legal" way! Maryland law requires that any handgun purchase has to go through a licensed dealer for the paperwork even if the actual purchase is from someone that's not a licensed dealer.

A guy I worked with purchased a handgun I had about 4 years ago and we used the Maryland Small Arms Range in Upper Marlboro to handle the paperwork. If I had sold him the gun without using them or another dealer, I would be in deep shyt.

That's what I thought. I read about it once online somewhere, then I asked one of the guys at The Tackle Box and he verified the information.

[Novus Collectus]

Originally Posted by Sparx

Can he loan it to me forever and can I take it to a shooting range for SPORT without losing it?

Only a temporary gratuitous loan is legal in MD....but "temporary" is undefined.

Look, this is not the proper way to look at it, but in reality unless you break the law with it or it is stolen then recovered the police will never ask, and if you ever lived out of state after Christmas (even for a short time) you could have acquired it there legally and brought it back to MD legally. So basically there is no way they can know unless you tell them when and where it was acquired. Also, for MD the statute of limitations for an illegal regulated firearms transfer is I think three years anyway.

So to avoid stretching the definition of "temporary", if would be in your best interest to spend sixty dollars to have it in your name on state records by transfering through a MD dealer (about $30 for overnight shipping to the dealer, and about $20 for transfer fee and a $10 state application fee).

Also, what you could do is rent a room at the person's house that "loaned" it to you and so you are maintaining a residence there. The next time you go visit, transfer as Ohio state residents (if it is legal to in Ohio).

Like I said though, all this is just to cover your arse. In reality there is very little reason for the state to even inquire and since you do not have to speak to teh police at all, it is all on them to prove you did not recieve it when you were residing in Ohio at the time.

I have eight modern handguns I legally acquired while living in MD that MD has absolutely no knowledge of. There are a number of ways to legally own handguns in MD without MD having any record of it.Even though MD records all handgun transfers in the state by non-licensees, MD only knows about a fraction of the legally owned handguns in MD.

[Novus Collectus]

Originally Posted by DEEKAYPEE8569

That's what I thought. I read about it once online somewhere, then I asked one of the guys at The Tackle Box and he verified the information.

But he is wrong. You can transfer without a dealer through a MD State Police barracks.

[pcjohnnyb]

Originally Posted by Novus Collectus

But he is wrong. You can transfer without a dealer through a MD State Police barracks.

But telling you that would cause Tacklebox to lose some of their money for transferring firearms

[Novus Collectus]

Originally Posted by pcjohnnyb

But telling you that would cause Tacklebox to lose some of their money for transferring firearms

Yup.
I bet they don't tell people about the other way to get handguns in MD (from out of state) either. I bet they never mention the C&R or they will tell myths about having one.

[pcjohnnyb]

Originally Posted by Novus Collectus

Yup.
I bet they don't tell people about the other way to get handguns in MD (from out of state) either. I bet they never mention the C&R or they will tell myths about having one.

What is the "other way"?
Having it willed to you? That's just a guess , but that may fall under the "gift" category.

[Novus Collectus]

Originally Posted by pcjohnnyb

What is the "other way"?
Having it willed to you? That's just a guess , but that may fall under the "gift" category.

A gift between immediate family members has a requirement that an application for transfer be sent off to the MDSP within five days (no fee) and can only be done if both parties are state residents.
The bequeathed or intastate succession (i.e. inherited) can go over state lines without an FFL and although the person receiving them has to fill out an application for transfer and send it in to the MDSP (no fee IIRC) after recieving them, the politicians in their infinite wisdom forgot to add a time limit on how long one can wait to send that application in.

That is one of the other ways. The other are dual state residents who can buy in another state, transfer of an unservicable arm that is a curio or museum piece (and the reciever restoring it which is basically manufacturing at this point), or, and as I meant, having a C&R FFL which anyone not a criminal can get, costs $30 for three years and allows the purchase of C&R handguns from out of state and have them shipped right to your door.

I got both of these shipped right to my door, no seven day wait or nothng:

[Papi4baby]

Well the deal went south, he wanted half of the price as a deposit to hold for the 7 days. I back out.