Obama's associations may haunt bid

[Pete (Premo)]

Originally Posted by Bruzilla

Oh lookee here... it's Return of the Living Dread... Mr. National Security. Yeah, you're a fine one to judge.

Go ahead and call me a turd if it makes you feel better. Now that McCain is running on being a POW it won't be long before those "unsubstantiated accusations" become confirmed fact. Of course, then you'll just blame it all on a VLWC I'm sure.

You are a turd with corn in it.

[chernmax]

Originally Posted by Bruzilla

Jeeze... how thick are you? I was not comparing Obama's drug use to McCain's being a POW! I was comparing Obama's use of his books to get his negatives out to McCain using a Newsweek story to only show his positives.

As for his medals, those that you listed were the common outlay for most captured pilots. How about you look at what the Navy did for McCain and McCain alone... like giving him a very, very, unusual billet as CO of a non-deploying stateside-only training squadron instead of a deployable fleet squadron? Or how about how the Navy stashed him after his one and only CO billet and declined to promote him any further?

That's because as a result of his severe torturing he sustained life long injuries and could no longer serve in an Operation Deployable Squadron. And show me a link or proof that there was a set of canned metals captured pilots received!!! What bullsh!t, I served 24 years in the US Navy and I'm currently a retired Naval Officer myself, I've met McCain in person and as a result you can barely give him a firm hand shake because his wrists sustained life long injuries from the 5-1/2 years of hogtying during his torture sessions.

And I've worked in various training commands throughout my career, the trainers are the ones who prepare the deployable fleet squadrons and who more than anyone would have better served the next generation of combat pilot than a man who truely understood the dangers of being a combat pilot!!!

More ridiculous rhetoric, please step away from the keyboard, your arguments are making a total a$$ of yourself...

[chernmax]

Originally Posted by Pete

You are a turd with corn in it.

.....................................Cream of Corn

[Bann (Premo)]

Originally Posted by Pete

You are a turd with corn in it.

The little baby corns! :

[Bann (Premo)]

Originally Posted by chernmax

That's because as a result of his severe torturing he sustained life long injuries and could no longer serve in an Operation Deployable Squadron. And show me a link or proof that there was a set of canned metals captured pilots received!!! What bullsh!t, I served 24 years in the US Navy and I'm currently a retired Naval Officer myself, I've met McCain in person and as a result you can barely give him a firm hand shake because his wrists sustained life long injuries from the 5-1/2 years of hogtying during his torture sessions.

And I've worked in various training commands throughout my career, the trainers are the ones who prepare the deployable fleet squadrons and who more than anyone would have better served the next generation of combat pilot than a man who truely understood the dangers of being a combat pilot!!!

More ridiculous rhetoric, please step away from the keyboard, your arguments are making a total a$$ of yourself...

Thank you for your service to our country!

[chernmax]

Originally Posted by Bann

Thank you for your service to our country!

...............................Thank you

Originally Posted by chernmax

That's because as a result of his severe torturing he sustained life long injuries and could no longer serve in an Operation Deployable Squadron. And show me a link or proof that there was a set of canned metals captured pilots received!!! What bullsh!t, I served 24 years in the US Navy and I'm currently a retired Naval Officer myself, I've met McCain in person and as a result you can barely give him a firm hand shake because his wrists sustained life long injuries from the 5-1/2 years of hogtying during his torture sessions.

And I've worked in various training commands throughout my career, the trainers are the ones who prepare the deployable fleet squadrons and who more than anyone would have better served the next generation of combat pilot than a man who truely understood the dangers of being a combat pilot!!!

More ridiculous rhetoric, please step away from the keyboard, your arguments are making a total a$$ of yourself...

Those medals were as automatic as getting the Legion of Merit is for departing squadron skippers and you know it!

As to McCain's injuries, listening to post-war McCain they were suffered during his ejection when his arms were broken. It is only lately that the injuries to his arms have been attibuted to torture. Speaking of which, if you were a naval officer, how do you explain McCain's coming out of Vietnam being so tortured he can't raise his arms above his shoulders, yet he passes a flight physical and e-seat qual??? How does someone do that???

I agree with you on training commands, but the quality of billets there isn't the issue. The path through command for pilots is to first go through a Fleet squadron XO tour, then a fleet squadron CO tour. They are always skippers of Fleet units first. Then later they become the skippers of training squadrons... unless you're John McCain. The Navy broke with the standard and sent McCain to VA-174 first. Why would they do that? I've heard comments from other officers saying that McCain's dad used his influence to get him promoted above his place, but I can't see why his dad would do that. A fleet command at that point is much more prestigious than a training command. The only reason i can think of for the Navy to take that action was they felt McCain was owed his shot at being a skipper, but they didn't feel he was up to going off on his own and running a deployed squadron. VA-174 didn't deploy and would never engage in combat, so it was a very low-risk assignment for someone with questionable performance in the past.

[Bann (Premo)]

Retired Naval Officer with 24 years of service who has *actually met* John McCain vs. an E6 with ....10(?) years of service.

[chernmax]

Originally Posted by Bruzilla

Those medals were as automatic as getting the Legion of Merit is for departing squadron skippers and you know it!

As to McCain's injuries, listening to post-war McCain they were suffered during his ejection when his arms were broken. It is only lately that the injuries to his arms have been attibuted to torture. Speaking of which, if you were a naval officer, how do you explain McCain's coming out of Vietnam being so tortured he can't raise his arms above his shoulders, yet he passes a flight physical and e-seat qual??? How does someone do that???

I agree with you on training commands, but the quality of billets there isn't the issue. The path through command for pilots is to first go through a Fleet squadron XO tour, then a fleet squadron CO tour. They are always skippers of Fleet units first. Then later they become the skippers of training squadrons... unless you're John McCain. The Navy broke with the standard and sent McCain to VA-174 first. Why would they do that? I've heard comments from other officers saying that McCain's dad used his influence to get him promoted above his place, but I can't see why his dad would do that. A fleet command at that point is much more prestigious than a training command. The only reason i can think of for the Navy to take that action was they felt McCain was owed his shot at being a skipper, but they didn't feel he was up to going off on his own and running a deployed squadron. VA-174 didn't deploy and would never engage in combat, so it was a very low-risk assignment for someone with questionable performance in the past.

Talking with you is like being pecked to death by a chicken, although annoying, it will never happen. Let's change gears, who is more qualified to be Commander In Chief of our Armed Forces and in charge of our strategic nuclear arsenal? You have the floor...

Originally Posted by chernmax

Talking with you is like being pecked to death by a chicken, although annoying, it will never happen. Let's change gears, who is more qualified to be Commander In Chief of our Armed Forces and in charge of our strategic nuclear arsenal? You have the floor...

Now, now... don't go all Pete on me and try to change the discussion. Answer my questions.

How does a guy who is supposedly brutally tortured by the NVA to the point where he can no longer raise his arms pass a Navy flight physical and ejection seat qual? I've had both, plus the same flight physiology and DWEST survival quals he had to go through, and there is NO WAY a guy can pass any of these if he can't raise his arms over his head! So... before you go calling me a chicken or any other names, please answer the question.

Next, answer how it is that McCain was given command of a stateside training squadron without first being CO of a fleet squadron.

If you really were a naval officer for 23 years, you know that guys the Navy finds fit for higher command, especially those who are legacies to two distinguished admirals and a POW, don't get stashed to an admin job in the basement of the Senate Office building to await retirement. If the Navy found McCain unfit for higher command, why should I find him fit to be Commander-in-Chief?