Should we just let GM, Ford and Chrysler fail?

[Kittykat33]

I work for GM!!! We have had ALOT of lay off's this past month. It is really scary thinking we can lose our jobs!

[itsbob (Premo)]

Originally Posted by Pete

GM directly employs 266,000 people, Ford 90,000, Chrysler 133,000 with an estimated 4 million other jobs directly related to supplying parts and or services.

4.4 million jobs would be lost. Asia would have no domestic competition. Every dollar of profit spent on vehicles would leave the country destined to foreign corporate offices.

Chrysler isn't even a car company anymore, let alone American owned.. it's profit already goes somewhere else.. Let them die or merge.

Feel for whomever they merge with, but maybe they'll get rid of the lines that don't sell and keep Jeep and their mini-vans.

Ford is international as is GM, I don't see how they would 100% fail no matter what the Government does. Internationally they still sell a LOT of cars. If they got so big that they can sell 100,000 or 200,000 cars and STILL not make a profit, maybe they need to go away.

[ylexot (Premo)]

Originally Posted by Kittykat33

I work for GM!!! We have had ALOT of lay off's this past month. It is really scary thinking we can lose our jobs!

My uncle worked for GM and just retired. He already has three unsolicited job offers. Get a job with someone else.

[itsbob (Premo)]

how are Toyota sales going?

How much money do they want to borrow to stay afloat?

[Pete (Premo)]

Originally Posted by ylexot

Why can't the companies go to the unions and say, "you have to take pay/benefits cuts or the company closes permanently"? Are the unions the only ones who can make demands?

BTW, every time that I have seen a spokesperson/proponent for the "loan", it has been a union leader...

They have but how far can you go? You have been suckling the teet for 30 years and you make $36 driving a forklift on night shift. How open are you to taking a $10 an hour pay cut? the other thing is the culture of white collar hate the labor unions have created as a recruiting tool. Ask any GM employee who is screwing them and they will rattle off a couple names of CEO's who made $5M last year and how if GM can afford to pay that guy $5M they can afford to pay me more. If you get out a calculator and show them that if the CEO made 0 and they split his $5M up among the 266,000 employees it comes to $18.78 per person per year, they just stammer a little and say "Well I know the fat cats make more than that and they are screwing us."

Deal Journal - WSJ.com : Why GM Says Bankruptcy Is an Impossibility

I read an article that said the new UAW contract married up all the Big 3 and the "new" average hourly wage in Detroit is down to $30.00.

[Pete (Premo)]

Originally Posted by itsbob

how are Toyota sales going?

How much money do they want to borrow to stay afloat?

Toyota is down 35% compared to GM's 42%. They are not a US company, I have no idea how much they have asked the Japanese government for if they have at all. they have recieved billions in subsidies form states and cities to build plants.

[SamSpade]

I'm amused by a future where Washington has little control over what auto manufacturers are allowed to build in this country.

If Washington declared that all new cars had to reach a certain mpg - and none of the manufacturers were American - would any of them have to listen?

[ylexot (Premo)]

Originally Posted by Pete

They have but how far can you go? You have been suckling the teet for 30 years and you make $36 driving a forklift on night shift. How open are you to taking a $10 an hour pay cut? the other thing is the culture of white collar hate the labor unions have created as a recruiting tool. Ask any GM employee who is screwing them and they will rattle off a couple names of CEO's who made $5M last year and how if GM can afford to pay that guy $5M they can afford to pay me more. If you get out a calculator and show them that if the CEO made 0 and they split his $5M up among the 266,000 employees it comes to $18.78 per person per year, they just stammer a little and say "Well I know the fat cats make more than that and they are screwing us."

Deal Journal - WSJ.com : Why GM Says Bankruptcy Is an Impossibility

I read an article that said the new UAW contract married up all the Big 3 and the "new" average hourly wage in Detroit is down to $30.00.

The CEOs/management should take a pay cut too. Want to survive? Suck it up. But what is really killing them is the lifetime union benefits.

[ylexot (Premo)]

Originally Posted by SamSpade

I'm amused by a future where Washington has little control over what auto manufacturers are allowed to build in this country.

If Washington declared that all new cars had to reach a certain mpg - and none of the manufacturers were American - would any of them have to listen?

Yes, because the regulations apply to any car sold in the US.

[Pete (Premo)]

Originally Posted by SamSpade

I'm amused by a future where Washington has little control over what auto manufacturers are allowed to build in this country.

If Washington declared that all new cars had to reach a certain mpg - and none of the manufacturers were American - would any of them have to listen?

I would think that if you sell in the US you have to comply with US regulations.

That brings up another point. How much has government regulation added to the cost of a car by them mandating things like anti-lock brakes, air bags, tire pressure monitoring systems and other agruably unneeded requirements?