We're not socialists...

[kom526]

Originally Posted by Vince

And not only is the government bailing out companies that are going to fail anyway, but they are forcing Banks to take money that the Banks don't even want (check Wells Fargo for that one). And with all the bailout, etc. going on, we are still heading for a very deep depression.

A not so funny thing about the banks wanting to give the money back, just yesterday Droopy (Barney Fwank) said something along the lines of "if they don't want to play by our rules, then they can give the money back". Well I'd like to see a bunch of them get a case of responsibility and give the money back and say screw you capital hill. But it won't happen.

What would they outcry be if the banks did start giving money back and then the White House decided to follow through with their punitive audits? Would people FINALLY start realizing that this administration is shredding the constitution and replacing it with a form of government that is a proven non performer?

[hvp05 (Premo)]

Originally Posted by kom526

Yes, you do let the free markets take care of this problem. It's called capitalism, you either get a chance to succeed with a good business plan and marketing of a product or service that people need and/or want, or you fail miserably due to lack of a sound business plan, poor management, or providing a good or service that has no demand.

I should have added that bit to my post.

True capitalism is an exceptionally efficient system: fail, die, be removed; succeed, prosper, grow. Meaning only the best and most capable are allowed to continue. That does not mean those who have failed are doomed to live in misery, just that they need to find somewhere else to become successful - which, shocking though it may be, most people could actually accomplish if they were challenged to do so.

What the government is doing now is propping up businesses and business models that should have been removed long ago. So now the system is cluttered with bad ideas and bad workers, and it's only going to fester... on the back of MY money, and everyone else's here.

If you, Rosehaven, can attempt to explain how that is a POSITIVE thing, please indulge me.

[Merlin99 (Premo)]

Originally Posted by Rosehaven

Look if those of you are really bent out of shape that the government stepping into this mess is the slippery slope of socialism....then what is your solution (sorry for the alliteration there)? Do we just do nothing and let "the free market" or "the market forces" go to work? What do you say to the people who will lose their jobs because the government didn't act out of concern to do so is socialist? What do you say to the people losing their homes because the government refuses to buy the bad mortgages and hold them until they can be later sold at a time when prices go back up?

Just give me your answer to that.

(chirping crickets in the silence)

Can you still hear those crickets?

[This_person]

Originally Posted by Merlin99

Can you still hear those crickets?

Perhaps she should respond to post 7, or 8, or 9, or 10?

[ylexot (Premo)]

Originally Posted by Merlin99

Can you still hear those crickets?

No, now it's our turn to listen to the crickets...

[PsyOps]

Originally Posted by Larry Gude

Geithner On Ousting CEOs, Reviving Economy | - CBS News




Of course.

I just wonder if all this would be happening if McCain had been elected.

[Mike (Premo)]

Originally Posted by Rosehaven

Look if those of you are really bent out of shape that the government stepping into this mess is the slippery slope of socialism....then what is your solution (sorry for the alliteration there)? Do we just do nothing and let "the free market" or "the market forces" go to work? What do you say to the people who will lose their jobs because the government didn't act out of concern to do so is socialist? What do you say to the people losing their homes because the government refuses to buy the bad mortgages and hold them until they can be later sold at a time when prices go back up?

Just give me your answer to that.

(chirping crickets in the silence)

You ask a lot of questions. I wish I was the Big Brain elected on the promise I could fix all this. Let reality bite you cricket girl - Socialism Is NOT the answer in a country founded on the principles of FREEDOM.
Point to a place where socialism has worked and then ask your condescending questions again.
Free market principles and capitalism gave this country the prosperity it has enjoyed making it the leader and envy of the free world until recently.

The mortgage crisis is a spin off of the liberal idea that everyone should be able to own a home and live the American Dream. It was another failed Socialist program, almost entirely run by the Democrats to reward their constituency. It's massive failure nearly crippled the economy. Too bad much our our financial structure was all in bed together having incestuous relations with our elected officials.

Do you really think the same bozos that led us to this awful economic mess can fix it by throwing money at it? Especially the inexperienced team of Hussein and his tax cheats?? They don't even read the bills they sign. Calling them bozos is an insult to clowns everywhere.

This disaster was happened and needs to be fixed - people are screaming for it. Early in the bailout/stimulus discussion aid was meant to be "timely, targeted, and temporary."

Hussein and his congressional buddies on BOTH sides of the aisle plans ended up being NONE of that. They've saddled us with enormous debt and new programs that will remain in place long after America fixes its own problems as it would have without gov't interference. As it repairs itself through the work of the hard working people of America - Hussein will be declared a genuis - while the deficit triples. He spoke out venomously against the debt and spending of George Bush as a candidate. His hypocrisy is staggering. The bankrupting of America is not an act of genius.

It is the misguided belief that enriching the poor that will save our economy. I'm hardly rich and barely make enough to support my family of 4, but what I make, I want to keep. And if I decide on charity - it will be as much as I want to give and to whom I want to give. I live within my means and teach my children the same. I support my family first, they are my responsibility - put some away for a rainy day, plan for the future, and pray to the good Lord for guidance.

Please find me an example of a nation that prospers under socialism that you and your associates seem to think is going to be the solution for everything. In the meantime, I'll sit back and listen to your cricket obamazombies chirping "Hope," "Change," "Hope, "Change"...

[Rosehaven]

My deepest apologies for not sitting by the screen and waiting with baited breath to hear the Truth. Haven't heard it yet.

Look, one out of every ten jobs in this country is touched by the auto industry (even Rush says that is so). So you let GM fail and the others and that is going to take more than just the auto folks down the drain. Now I understand the logic being used---F--'em, they're stupid, they made mistakes, screw them. In theory, they will rebuild. But what happens until that takes place? All of these folks go down the tubes.

Look, we have all allowed companies to get so big that a stupid mistake made in Detroit or Upper Marlboro has the potential of taking down companies all over the world. I wish that wasn't the case but if we follow this "F'em approach, a lot of folks in a lot of places get nailed. This isn't the '50's when everything that happened in one place usually stayed in that place. So you just can't use that Free Enterprise/The Market Knows approach because we're now dealing with a monster never before seen.

Nobody knows how we're gonna get out of this. But the fact is, we're all inter connected--yeah, even liberals are hurt.

Originally Posted by Rosehaven

Now I understand the logic being used---F--'em, they're stupid, they made mistakes, screw them. In theory, they will rebuild. But what happens until that takes place? All of these folks go down the tubes.

They can go train in a different industry only to still be jobless.

[Pete (Premo)]

Originally Posted by Rosehaven

My deepest apologies for not sitting by the screen and waiting with baited breath to hear the Truth. Haven't heard it yet.

Look, one out of every ten jobs in this country is touched by the auto industry (even Rush says that is so). So you let GM fail and the others and that is going to take more than just the auto folks down the drain. Now I understand the logic being used---F--'em, they're stupid, they made mistakes, screw them. In theory, they will rebuild. But what happens until that takes place? All of these folks go down the tubes.

Look, we have all allowed companies to get so big that a stupid mistake made in Detroit or Upper Marlboro has the potential of taking down companies all over the world. I wish that wasn't the case but if we follow this "F'em approach, a lot of folks in a lot of places get nailed. This isn't the '50's when everything that happened in one place usually stayed in that place. So you just can't use that Free Enterprise/The Market Knows approach because we're now dealing with a monster never before seen.

Nobody knows how we're gonna get out of this. But the fact is, we're all inter connected--yeah, even liberals are hurt.

You have a point BUT the fact is if GM fails, since it has a large market share in the world auto industry other companies will step up to fill the giant vacuum in supply GM collapse would create. Other car companies will have to expand to fill the production needed to replace GM. this means some will expand their own facilities, some will scavenge GM facilities. Either way there will be a home for much of the former GM work force with new companies. Some will be able to stay put while Toyota changes the sign on a plant in Lansing Michigan from Pontiac to Toyota, some might have to move to Lexington KY if they want the job.

If the UAW and the government do not poke big labor in the eye and they try to crate the same mess in the new companies that they did at GM that contributed to its downfall Michigan will become more of a wasteland than it already is. Toyota or Nissan are not going to buy an old GM plant and rehire GM workers for $75 an hour.