Maybe I'm down with Socialism after all

[vraiblonde]

As far as I can tell, and someone can feel free to correct this, the median household income in the US is around $50,000.

I am firmly middle class, with a modest home and modest vehicle.

So if the government would call my house free and clear, I'd be good to go with my $50k a year. And why wouldn't they do that? It's not like some dictator or his homie would want my house - they'd probably want something a lot bigger and newer, with more stuff in it.

Obviously we'd get government provided utilities - phone, water, electricity, fuel oil. And I'm pretty frugal in that department, too, so I doubt I'd suffer a whole lot.

So they take all the money that everyone now makes, divvy it up fair and square; take all the big homes and fancy cars that people own and divvy it up so we all live pretty much how I live now; everyone has to wear clothes that cost about what my clothes cost; everyone has government health care (which I don't care about because I rarely go to the doctor); and everyone becomes completely economically equal.

I could go for this, because I really wouldn't lose anything.

Bill Gates and all those zillionaire celebrities and athletes - they're going to have a huge adjustment. But they're the ones that want this equality and make such a big deal about it, so they rightfully should have to give up their stuff to get it.

I paid payroll taxes today and that always puts me in a foul mood. But I realized that instead of forking out money to be distributed to people I don't even know, maybe Socialism could work for me and I've been opposed to it for no reason.

All those rich people with big houses and lots of land would have to subdivide so that people with less could have a house and some land. Multiple houses would be out of the question - one house per family. And one car per family.

Then I wouldn't have to worry about working or making money, or at least not as much. I'd pretty much be exactly the same as I am now under the new equality. Granted, it would all fall apart in the next generation, but that's their problem, right? Most of them are all for Socialism now, so let them pay the price. "Imagine..."

Seriously, what do I care about the economy or debt or deficits? All that happens is that the rich get richer, the poor get poorer, and the middle class struggle to pay for it all.

BUT! With Socialism, the rich and poor would join the middle class, and I'd be the same as I am now. Score!

So I say go for it, Maobama! Go get 'em, Nancy and Harry! Make us all equal so I can have a break instead of working my ass off all the time.

[Sonsie]

47% Will Pay $0 Income Tax in 2009

CNN, 47% Will Pay No Federal Income Tax:

In 2009, roughly 47% of households, or 71 million, will not owe any federal income tax, according to estimates by the nonpartisan Tax Policy Center.

Some in that group will even get additional money from the government because they qualify for refundable tax breaks.

Check out the graph there if you really want to get steamed. Everyone who votes should pay something — and that something should rise when spending does. Skin in the game . . . .

[Larry Gude (Premo)]

Originally Posted by vraiblonde

As far as I can tell, and someone can feel free to correct this, the median household income in the US is around $50,000.

I am firmly middle class, with a modest home and modest vehicle.

So if the government would call my house free and clear, I'd be good to go with my $50k a year. And why wouldn't they do that? It's not like some dictator or his homie would want my house - they'd probably want something a lot bigger and newer, with more stuff in it.

Obviously we'd get government provided utilities - phone, water, electricity, fuel oil. And I'm pretty frugal in that department, too, so I doubt I'd suffer a whole lot.

So they take all the money that everyone now makes, divvy it up fair and square; take all the big homes and fancy cars that people own and divvy it up so we all live pretty much how I live now; everyone has to wear clothes that cost about what my clothes cost; everyone has government health care (which I don't care about because I rarely go to the doctor); and everyone becomes completely economically equal.

I could go for this, because I really wouldn't lose anything.

Bill Gates and all those zillionaire celebrities and athletes - they're going to have a huge adjustment. But they're the ones that want this equality and make such a big deal about it, so they rightfully should have to give up their stuff to get it.

I paid payroll taxes today and that always puts me in a foul mood. But I realized that instead of forking out money to be distributed to people I don't even know, maybe Socialism could work for me and I've been opposed to it for no reason.

All those rich people with big houses and lots of land would have to subdivide so that people with less could have a house and some land. Multiple houses would be out of the question - one house per family. And one car per family.

Then I wouldn't have to worry about working or making money, or at least not as much. I'd pretty much be exactly the same as I am now under the new equality. Granted, it would all fall apart in the next generation, but that's their problem, right? Most of them are all for Socialism now, so let them pay the price. "Imagine..."

Seriously, what do I care about the economy or debt or deficits? All that happens is that the rich get richer, the poor get poorer, and the middle class struggle to pay for it all.

BUT! With Socialism, the rich and poor would join the middle class, and I'd be the same as I am now. Score!

So I say go for it, Maobama! Go get 'em, Nancy and Harry! Make us all equal so I can have a break instead of working my ass off all the time.

Income and expense are half the equation. Now add in assets and liabilities. Imagine you're 55, home paid off, cars paid off, lots of personal possessions, nice savings account, good looking investments, perhaps inheritance. You do not have a median life.

All of that goes to the state. So, you keep or, more accurately, they give you the house and car because they are median. You don't own them. Why are you going to fork out $10,000 for a new roof? Or do routine maintenance on the home and car?

The problem with socialism and communism, when it's not on paper, is it runs smack dab into the human condition. We are, in fact, all individuals. Some of us may be better artists, some better business people. Some more or less useless. To each by his needs, from each by his means works fine as a static model, to take what Vrail has now and given it to someone who has less in order to even things up and make it 'fair'.

What about tomorrow? What about a year from now when you have again accumulated more stuff than your neighbor because you work harder or smarter or save more or are simply luckier? The process HAS to repeat itself, constantly taking your 'excess' and giving it to the less...fortunate.

If you want to be a plough horse that just works every day, lives a modest life and sheds all your extra responsibilities and extra freedoms until you just fall over in the field, then socialism is for you.

The 'problem' with capitalism is, and this used to be accepted, it is not 'fair' as defined by what you get for simply existing. It is totally fair based on what you do, what you produce, how you live, what you learn, effort, diligence and so forth. This leads to the problem in socialism; all the motivation to do well is gone.

I think your life would change a whole lot more than you think it would.

[Larry Gude (Premo)]

Originally Posted by Sonsie

Check out the graph there if you really want to get steamed. Everyone who votes should pay something — and that something should rise when spending does. Skin in the game . . . .

It is flat out ####ing criminal that someone paying no taxes should be allowed to vote.

[vraiblonde]

Originally Posted by Larry Gude

I think your life would change a whole lot more than you think it would.

I don't think so. It would take awhile for everything to fall to ####, and I'd be dead by then. The true consequences of Socialism won't be realized for a number of years. Let the next generation worry about it - they vote for this crap, screw 'em.

[vraiblonde]

Originally Posted by Sonsie

Check out the graph there if you really want to get steamed. Everyone who votes should pay something — and that something should rise when spending does. Skin in the game . . . .

Heck no! Let the rich people pay - they have the money. Make them cough up and redistribute their wealth until it's all equal. There are 300 million people in the US, and around 100 million households. Look at all these multi-billionaires:

The 400 Richest Americans - Forbes.com

Gates and Buffett top the list, and both supported Obama and the Democrats. So they should have to liquidate and redistribute. Why should they have so much when I'm thinking twice about a $25 mascara? I'll bet Larry Ellison buys what he wants and doesn't even think about it.

Then, when you add in the multi-millionaires, I'll bet it comes out where they could all kick in and give each and every household $1 million. Don't you want $1 million? I do!

[Baja28]

47% Will Pay $0 Income Tax in 2009

CNN, 47% Will Pay No Federal Income Tax:

In 2009, roughly 47% of households, or 71 million, will not owe any federal income tax, according to estimates by the nonpartisan Tax Policy Center.

Some in that group will even get additional money from the government because they qualify for refundable tax breaks.

I have to call foul here. This guys writs a blog and references his sources as other blogs. I'm not buying that someone making over a million doesn't pay taxes (or even over $100K) for that matter. Plus he says they won't "owe" as in at the end of the year they won't have to write a check. They pay all year, they just don't under pay so they don't owe.

[Pandora]

Originally Posted by vraiblonde

I don't think so. It would take awhile for everything to fall to ####, and I'd be dead by then. The true consequences of Socialism won't be realized for a number of years. Let the next generation worry about it - they vote for this crap, screw 'em.

Now...now... the ENTIRE generation didn't vote for this crap. If the ENTIRE generation was supportive of Socialism, I wouldn't get phone calls from the school telling me my son is way too vocal during debate class.

Personally, I don't think throwing money at social problems solve anything... because we have been doing that for years and it has solved nothing. You give a child everything they want they will never work to strive for better and hard work and dedication should be rewarded which isn't done in a Socialistic economy.

I totally wish those who paid no taxes didn't vote.... Oh how different things would be and out of our household income, more than 60% (61% to be exact) of my salary alone went to pay Federal/State and Local Taxes (excluding property tax). Our house deserves to have our vote(s) weigh more than the household down the street living off the dole. And in no way shape or form should ANYONE get money out of a piggy bank when they didn't pay anything into the piggy. (i.e. earned income credit).

And you say you never go to the doctor, well, neither do I and I have always had excellent health coverage. I am just not big on wasting my time when I'm not sick... and I believe that prescription drugs hinder the bodies natural immune system and will go sick for weeks before stepping foot in the doctor's office (which hasn't happened but a handful of times).

But you just never know when a medical problem will crop up... For instance, I went to an eye exam earlier this year and learned I have Glaucoma (only in my left eye), now we are talking about my vision... completely different. Under Socialism, I would have to put my vision in the hands of government officials? Well... ahh.... And they just might think, well, you have 1 healthy eye, why should we bother treating the other? You can still see out of 1 eye.. do your job and pay your taxes so we will not pay for preventative treatment to prolong your vision.

No thank you!

[vraiblonde]

You buncha freakin' brainwashed capitalists. Fine! If you want to work your butts off and pay taxes so that rich people can keep all their billions and you have to worry about your heating bill, go right ahead.

I want some government goodies. And I'm not talking about WIC beans, either. I want a house that I don't have to pay for, and I want a check for my beer and cigarettes, and I want some lobster from Shoppers. If you guys don't want your share, give it to me.

[vraiblonde]

I think the very least the billionaire Democrats could do is give us all a free vacation each year. A week long cruise, with airfare and some weekend fun at your departure port is only around $5000. They could afford that easy, and we could all lay in the sun for a week.

Hell, you're always seeing pictures of celebrities vacationing around the globe in crazy expensive resorts. They should even it up and redistribute their vacations to the less fortunate, like me. Stingy bastards. You'd think they were Republicans.