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Old 10-20-2009, 09:59 PM   #41 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by vraiblonde View Post
It's pretty interesting watching the White House get all spun up over a news network that doesn't suck their ass. Bush and Cheney got raked over the coals by every network, including Fox, and you didn't see their people out there trying to shut them down.

If anyone is unAmerican, it's Obama and his media stooges.
President Bush was an American with character and dignity and he didn't suffer fools well. That is the sum and substance for why he was hated by Hollywood and the MSM. He didn't grovel for them, didn't co-habit with them and did't invite them to sleep in the Lincoln Bedroom. They just couldn't handle that.
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Old 10-20-2009, 11:02 PM   #42 (permalink)
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See, heres the "fair and balanced" part that liberals never seem to get. It's okay that they present a conservative view, watch close, heres the tricky part, AS LONG AS THEY ALSO PRESENT THE LIBERAL VIEWPOINT

Thats what we miss with the networks and CNN. They slant too, but have no equivalent of Alan Colmes, or Geraldo, and when they do invite folks to debate, its always the ones who agree with them. Makes for pretty pi#% poor debate.
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Old 10-21-2009, 12:17 AM   #43 (permalink)
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I'm glad you got it on the first try. I'm getting the impression that THAT is what is supposedly making FOX "un-American". Because they DON'T say that.

No, what is un-American is an organization that touts itself to be unbiased when clearly they are. I remember during the Bush administration how un-American FOX claimed every one was that would voice their opposition to the administration in power then. Now that the administration has changed party, it is funny how all of a sudden it soooo American to do the same thing they lamented in the first place. I'm sorry....I just don't call that American at all.

"Fair and balanced" does not mean for one nanosecond that it is unbiased. I'm clearly biased. But I try to be fair in my online discussions, and grant time to both sides in my presence. I don't go off on rants or prejudge people and I am willing to change my position if the argument is compelling.

I think you need to look up the definition of unbiased. Then come back to me and tell me it isn't another way of saying "fair and balanced". Your wrong.

I don't think your nearly as biased as others are in this forum. You are one of the few someone can have civil discourse with. Yes, you are fair in your discussions and grant time to both sides. If FOX were more like you, then yes, it would still be biased, but as you say, it wouldn't go on rants or prejudge as it does now.


My dad coached my team in Little League. He was biased to ME, as his son, but he benched me as often as I deserved and he showed no favoritism in his *coaching* even though everyone knew I was his actual favorite. It was his job to hit practice balls to everyone, not just me.

As I've mentioned before, I once got on Sam Donaldson's old radio show, and his comment was that even if you're very liberal - as he is - you can be FAIR if you don't softball questions or remember to give scrutiny to both sides of an issue. FOX, more often than not will at least bring guests on who are not in agreement with the host and are often antagonistic - something I've almost never seen other hosts do. They also have people like Geraldo and Shep Smith host shows, and they're big time liberals.

If you're conservative, and you watch the major networks, you'll see bias right from the morning show to the evening news. People are excoriated just for being conservative, as if that alone is reason for alarm.

I agree with Sam Donaldson, you can be fair in reporting. Unfortunately, FOX doesn't do that. Of the guests that come on, yes, some are antagonistic, but perhaps they have cause to be, for guests are more often than not ridiculed in much the same manner a conservative is on MSNBC. It flat out blatant. I am surprised you don't see it yourself.

If the lunatic fringe that is hitting the airwaves is what conservatism means today, then yes there is cause for alarm. But, I don't believe that real conservatives are the fringe. True conservatives wouldn't engage in the smut we have been witnessing on our TV screens.
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Old 10-21-2009, 12:21 AM   #44 (permalink)
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Ni Hao!
Youqu de shi. Wo faxian liao hen duo jintian zai Zhongguo!
Which means what exactly? And in what language?
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Old 10-21-2009, 12:29 AM   #45 (permalink)
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You seem to forget (or weren't around at the time) that Cronkite started advocacy journalism, with his reporting of the Tet Offensive. Look where it's gotten the press now, half of America now recognizes the establishment media is in the tank for socialists.
The Tet Offensive has nothing to do with the state of journalism today. Conglomerates have everything to do with the state of journalism today. Money interests trump the interests of journalism, money wins, and news stops.

FOX has a great formula and niche market.....it is all about the bottom line and if you think news fits into that, your sadly mistaken. And FOX unfortunately isn't the only network that has sold out. They all have.
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Old 10-21-2009, 06:56 AM   #46 (permalink)
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I agree with Sam Donaldson, you can be fair in reporting. Unfortunately, FOX doesn't do that. Of the guests that come on, yes, some are antagonistic, but perhaps they have cause to be, for guests are more often than not ridiculed in much the same manner a conservative is on MSNBC. It flat out blatant. I am surprised you don't see it yourself.

If the lunatic fringe that is hitting the airwaves is what conservatism means today, then yes there is cause for alarm. But, I don't believe that real conservatives are the fringe. True conservatives wouldn't engage in the smut we have been witnessing on our TV screens.

You have a lot of gall talking about the lunatic fringe. You spend inordinate amounts of time creating these convoluted, rambling ad hominem attacks on every poster you disagree with here. And you have since your first appearance.

Oh and good thing we're not charged for the bandwidth we use in each post, you'd be broke.

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Old 10-21-2009, 07:02 AM   #47 (permalink)
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The Tet Offensive has nothing to do with the state of journalism today. Conglomerates have everything to do with the state of journalism today. Money interests trump the interests of journalism, money wins, and news stops.

FOX has a great formula and niche market.....it is all about the bottom line and if you think news fits into that, your sadly mistaken. And FOX unfortunately isn't the only network that has sold out. They all have.
Okay, so, where do you recommend I go for news, information, and educated opinion about those things? Huffpost? Mediamatters?
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Old 10-21-2009, 09:35 AM   #48 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Alexa View Post
I agree with Sam Donaldson, you can be fair in reporting. Unfortunately, FOX doesn't do that. Of the guests that come on, yes, some are antagonistic, but perhaps they have cause to be, for guests are more often than not ridiculed in much the same manner a conservative is on MSNBC. It flat out blatant. I am surprised you don't see it yourself.

If the lunatic fringe that is hitting the airwaves is what conservatism means today, then yes there is cause for alarm. But, I don't believe that real conservatives are the fringe. True conservatives wouldn't engage in the smut we have been witnessing on our TV screens.
The lunatic fringe? Who ARE you talking about? People on Fox who are commentators exposing the likes of ACORN? Is that bad? Opening the eyes of the public to the corruption going on in our government? Have you actually ever watched any of these 'lunatic fringe' shows or just going by the snipits that the msm present you?
Is Fox fair and balanced? Fair, yes, as they do give information to you and tell you to fact check and decide. Balanced, not quite, they do lean to the right, which is good, they are the ONLY news channel that does, which doesn't quite balance out the preponderance of the Left leaning news channels.
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Old 10-21-2009, 09:53 AM   #49 (permalink)
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No, what is un-American is an organization that touts itself to be unbiased when clearly they are. I remember during the Bush administration how un-American FOX claimed every one was that would voice their opposition to the administration in power then.


No. What was unAmerican was to be opposed to a war after we had voted on it and had engaged in it. I could somewhat respect the opinion of someone who had been against it from the beginning and continued their opposition (as far as Congress was concerned). I never heard that it was unAmerican to be opposed to Bush or his administration - in fact, the most common retort Bush himself made about people who jeered him in public was that he thought freedom of speech was great.

And the reason I'd still say it's unAmerican to be opposed to a war after we begin is that men's lives depend on support from home. Their lives are on the line and while people are at home changing their minds, men have given their lives already. The time for bickering about a war is before it begins. I could never support the BS that says I support the troops but I am against the war. They're in a fight for their lives, and no one got sent to war on the support of a single ruling despot. It's disgraceful to vote to go to war and then, after it's too late for some young men who have died, back up and say, oh maybe not.
I think you need to look up the definition of unbiased. Then come back to me and tell me it isn't another way of saying "fair and balanced". Your wrong.

Then perhaps "bias" is the wrong word. I think FOX clearly shows a preference or an opinion that favors the right. There's no question about it, you can see it in FOX and Friends and in shows like Red Eye. But I also clearly see that the news broadcasts are even. I think they try to present both sides with fairness. For what it's worth, I think most of the Sunday morning talk shows do, as well (except Chris Matthews), although I think David Gregory's bias compels him to let more liberal guests get tossed a few softballs and lets them off when they give idiot non-answers. He's no Russert.

You would be hard-pressed to guess the political leaning of someone like Chris Wallace (son of 60 Minute's Mike Wallace).

Yes, the political shows have bias. They do on MSNBC as well. Heck, no one screeches about Comedy Central's shows (Colbert and the Daily Show), Letterman, The View or Maher's show on HBO, and they don't hide their bias at all. What they don't do, and what O'Reilly, Beck, Hannity and others do, is bring on guests who disagree with them. The few times I have enjoyed Maher's show is when he gets ambushed by guests he clearly thought agreed with him. He's not used to it, and is visibly bothered by it.

See, to me, it only makes sense to be fair to both sides, in journalism. If you let the guys whom you favor off easy, it's like letting the crooks run your office. You let them off easy, they'll wreck everything. If you chase every molehill and every rumor about those you don't like, you lose credibility. You do yourself a great favor by being fair. You kick out the jerks in your own camp, and you nail the SOB's in theirs. Consider it pest control. If you clean your own house, you can rest well. Moral high ground be damned.


It's a system that works - so long as there's competition. When there ISN'T any serious competiition against the side you favor, there's no pressing need to be fair, because no one will ever hold you accountable. Let me make that clear - when there's no opposition, and no chance of being held accountable, there's not only no incentive to be fair, there is every likelihood it will become corrupt. People are only as "good" as they need to be.

I am amused that the left is so very frazzled by FOX. They're one network. The left is like the selfish toddler who won't let his baby sister have one toy, while he plays with the rest. What's the damned threat? Opposition is normal. It's freedom of speech. LET them speak. I dare say, most conservatives on here WANT Pelosi and Reid out there talking - it exposes them. We WANT the left to be out there talking. The more they talk, the more people will see what they believe. The left doesn't appear to want conservatives talking at all. They want the stage to themselves.

For all the left's screeching about freedom of speech and tolerance, they clearly have no idea what it means. Honestly. They need to know that when you have freedom, it means everyone has that freedom, and not just those with whom you agree. My voice is just as free as anyone else's.
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Old 10-21-2009, 09:59 AM   #50 (permalink)
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Huffpost? Mediamatters?
You know, I do know people who rely on places like that for their news. What's scarier is that some of them are not Americans, so their total exposure to the U.S. political scene is what those sites tell them.

They're the flip side of NewsMax and TownHall. I don't go to them either, having, in the past, cited news stories which turned out to be spurious.

But MediaMatters - their own site declares that their sole raison d'etre is to counter the right. That's what they do. They're unabashedly left-wing, and they exist to counter conservative news. NOT unbiased.

Geez, you'd think the world was awash in conservative news coverage. It's like pointing tanks at a mouse. Is that mouse THAT dangerous?
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