Gospel of Inclusion.

[fredcaudle]

Originally Posted by Xaquin44

ummm if they never changed in meaning then they wouldn't be different translations.

I've heard many statements... but your's takes the cake. So, Koreans speak English? How about any other languages? Are we so centered on English that we must have everyone in the world speak as King James era people?????

Yeah, ok.. so they are written differently... amazing how Jesus stays exactly the same in all of them though. Amazing how the content never changes...

[camily (Premo)]

Originally Posted by fredcaudle

I've heard many statements... but your's takes the cake. So, Koreans speak English? How about any other languages? Are we so centered on English that we must have everyone in the world speak as King James era people?????

Yeah, ok.. so they are written differently... amazing how Jesus stays exactly the same in all of them though. Amazing how the content never changes...

Hi Fred!
Friday night and we're here. Sad, sad lives I tell ya'. It didn't always be this way. Actually, that's a good thing!

[JPC sr]

Originally Posted by fredcaudle

On Judgement Day the conditions for humanity will be greatly improved. Here's a picture of judgment day (I know, just written by men who were religious and trying to dupe everyone...)

I agree, and I sympathize, as I must deal with that too.

Originally Posted by fredcaudle

Revelation 20:11-15 (NIV) ... 13 The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead that were in them, and each person was judged according to what he had done.

See that "the sea" gave up its "dead" like people were in the "sea" and not in "hell or Heaven" and it says "Hades" meaning the grave as in "death and Hades [the grave] gave up their dead" not their living in torture as prisoners of an evil God.

The resurection means from the "dead" and not resurected from a firey hell.

Originally Posted by fredcaudle

Rev 20:14 Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death.

It says "death and Hell" are in the fire but not burning people being tortured.

The second death means dead to sin, link HERE.

And dead to sin, link HERE.

Sin causes death and not torture in a hell fire, link HERE and the free gift is eternal life not eternal torture in hell.

Originally Posted by fredcaudle

Rev 20:15 If anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.

Revelations 20:14-15 link HERE tells that death and hell are thrown into the lake of fire and not people.

Death is the final enemy destroyed = death where is thy sting link HERE.

Notice it says on that Day we shall ALL be changed, not some but ALL.

[fredcaudle]

Originally Posted by camily

Hi Fred!
Friday night and we're here. Sad, sad lives I tell ya'. It didn't always be this way. Actually, that's a good thing!

Very sad... and to think... I must go to a birthday party tonight and here I sit!

[fredcaudle]

Originally Posted by JPC sr

I agree, and I sympathize, as I must deal with that too.
See that "the sea" gave up its "dead" like people were in the "sea" and not in "hell or Heaven" and it says "Hades" meaning the grave as in "death and Hades [the grave] gave up their dead" not their living in torture as prisoners of an evil God.

The resurection means from the "dead" and not resurected from a firey hell.
It says "death and Hell" are in the fire but not burning people being tortured.

The second death means dead to sin, link HERE.

And dead to sin, link HERE.

Sin causes death and not torture in a hell fire, link HERE and the free gift is eternal life not eternal torture in hell. Revelations 20:14-15 link HERE tells that death and hell are thrown into the lake of fire and not people.

Death is the final enemy destroyed = death where is thy sting link HERE.

Notice it says on that Day we shall ALL be changed, not some but ALL.

Verse 15... If anyone's name was not found written in the book of life (interesting book, not book of dead), he (i.e. anyone not found in the book of life) was thrown into the lake of fire.

Second death means eternal separation from God the Father. We are all assigned to die once for sin (wages of sin is death), but Jesus paid the penalty of sin (death) and so those who profess (believe) in His name will not suffer eternal death. (Name is in Book of Life when you profess (believe) in the name of Jesus).

Again, God is Holy... those who sow unholiness and never ask for forgiveness and repent reap no part of a Holy God.

[godsbutterfly]

Originally Posted by JPC sr

I agree, and I sympathize, as I must deal with that too.
See that "the sea" gave up its "dead" like people were in the "sea" and not in "hell or Heaven" and it says "Hades" meaning the grave as in "death and Hades [the grave] gave up their dead" not their living in torture as prisoners of an evil God.

The resurection means from the "dead" and not resurected from a firey hell.
It says "death and Hell" are in the fire but not burning people being tortured.

The second death means dead to sin, link HERE.

And dead to sin, link HERE.

Sin causes death and not torture in a hell fire, link HERE and the free gift is eternal life not eternal torture in hell. Revelations 20:14-15 link HERE tells that death and hell are thrown into the lake of fire and not people.

Death is the final enemy destroyed = death where is thy sting link HERE.

Notice it says on that Day we shall ALL be changed, not some but ALL.

I certainly don't want to seem rude but generally speaking doesn't fire burn (unless it's like Moses and the burning bush) and wouldn't continually being burned hurt? I would think it would be excruciating pain. I knew someone who suffered severe burns on her face and arms and she was in agony.
As for all being changed - not all change is positive!
For me it is still a matter of God said it and I believe it. You cannot have an erasable Bible where you pick and choose only certain parts of it to suit yourself and make your point. God, by his own words, is a jealous God and that means it is all or nothing.

[JPC sr]

Originally Posted by fredcaudle

Verse 15... If anyone's name was not found written in the book of life (interesting book, not book of dead), he (i.e. anyone not found in the book of life) was thrown into the lake of fire.

Second death means eternal separation from God the Father. We are all assigned to die once for sin (wages of sin is death), but Jesus paid the penalty of sin (death) and so those who profess (believe) in His name will not suffer eternal death. (Name is in Book of Life when you profess (believe) in the name of Jesus).

Again, God is Holy... those who sow unholiness and never ask for forgiveness and repent reap no part of a Holy God.

Well I gave scripture text and link after text after link and more,

while you preach the traditional message with nothing to back it up.

So it boils down to those of us that want the deeper truths and not the comfortable truths.

The Bible says the second death means "death to sin" (see my many links in previous post) and here this poster says second death means "eternal separation" but death does not mean torture in hell as that would be living and not dead.

And "wages of sin is death" not toture in hell.

And "Book of life" not of death.

To believe as ye are told is what traditional Christianity is.

But the scriptures tells us a much better story indeed.

[JPC sr]

Originally Posted by godsbutterfly

I certainly don't want to seem rude but generally speaking doesn't fire burn (unless it's like Moses and the burning bush) and wouldn't continually being burned hurt? I would think it would be excruciating pain.

Natural fire burns but spiritual fire purifies.

And the burning bush of Moses that did not burn is a vivid example of Godly fire that does not burn.

Originally Posted by godsbutterfly

For me it is still a matter of God said it and I believe it. You cannot have an erasable Bible where you pick and choose only certain parts of it to suit yourself and make your point. God, by his own words, is a jealous God and that means it is all or nothing.

If you were preaching Bible instead of Christian tradition then that might be true.

But the Bible does not say what Christian tradition is claiming.

Therefore your words are wrong too, because you put your faith in what other people say instead of seeking the truth thyself.

[tommyjones]

Originally Posted by fredcaudle

I've heard many statements... but your's takes the cake. So, Koreans speak English? How about any other languages? Are we so centered on English that we must have everyone in the world speak as King James era people?????

Yeah, ok.. so they are written differently... amazing how Jesus stays exactly the same in all of them though. Amazing how the content never changes...

freddy, you have got to realize that the personn who translated the KJV did so to make the king happy and to make his interpretation THE interpretation.

i mean think about it

[godsbutterfly]

Originally Posted by JPC sr

Natural fire burns but spiritual fire purifies.

And the burning bush of Moses that did not burn is a vivid example of Godly fire that does not burn. If you were preaching Bible instead of Christian tradition then that might be true.

But the Bible does not say what Christian tradition is claiming.

Therefore your words are wrong too, because you put your faith in what other people say instead of seeking the truth thyself.

I am well acquainted with Holy Ghost Fire having experienced it on numerous occasion myself. I know of it's cleansing power and of the cleansing power of the blood of Jesus Christ. I use God's Butterfly because I know he changed my life from what it was to something good. By the way - how my life changed and why is absolutely not open to debate nor would I expect anyone else's to be unless they volunteered it. I am not perfect but I am living my life the best I can in accordance with what God's Word says so that when my life here on Earth is over I can live eternally in Heaven with Jesus Christ. That's what I believe and I can't make anybody else believe as I believe - especially not you. On the other hand - nobody - especially not you - can make me believe Hell is not the Lake of Fire and that I am misguided in the Rapture and all that will happen in the end times.