Maybe they should try a Rain Dance instead?

[Xaquin44]

Originally Posted by 2ndAmendment

He pointed out that they were seeing people do something and those people were the examples of Judaism. He was saying that is not the example to follow or to set.

ok, but he didn't say to go into the streets and pray when you mean it. He said to keep it private.

[2ndAmendment (Premo)]

Originally Posted by Xaquin44

I know it doesn't mean literally 'go into a closet' it just means cloister yourself when praying to keep it private.

and, isn't church just a big show anyway? I mean people walking down the aisle lighting candles, everyone stand, everyone kneel, turn to page 398 of the hymnal, sit, open your prayer book to corinthians 1:6 etc. etc.

It is just repetition, and I'll argue that it is meaningless, simply by the fact that you don't even pick it out. The preacher/father/minister/etc. etc. picks out the verses and readings and the congregation follows along. You're aloted (sp?) a couple minutes before the lords holy prayer to think to yourself in private and thats it. I do more talking to god outside church, because at least then I can relate what is actually on my mind.

also, I'm starting to ramble hehe

All churches are not like that.

[Xaquin44]

Originally Posted by 2ndAmendment

All churches are not like that.

I know .... but many are. Heck I've been to tons of them of almost all denominations. Everyone I've been to has elements of every other.

[2ndAmendment (Premo)]

Originally Posted by Xaquin44

despite my complaining etc. I can easily say the best times of my life were with my friends from church.

the words never ment anything to me (aside from the sermons, but our rector was awesome) and I already got the message of love/peace/etc.

I have no real problem with religion either, I just don't like seeing people bound to think and live life by the tenants of an ancient book. I mean look at the thread we had last week (I think) about the JW that let herself die after giving birth to twins .... all because of the way some guy read a book that was made 2000 years before the process that would have saved her was even invented.

And that is why JW's are considered a cult. And the JW's belief against transfusions did not come with the writing of the Bible. The Jehovah's Witnesses religious movement was founded by Charles Taze Russell (1852-1916), considerably after the first century AD.

[2ndAmendment (Premo)]

Originally Posted by Xaquin44

Misread.

exactly.

now, after hundreds and hundreds of translations and thousands of years .... you are 100% certain yours is right versus his?

Just focus on the values and toss the rest. The bible is like a whole bunch of nice thoughts (well, some bad ones and silly ones too) that someone decided to use to control other people with.

The validity of the Bible has been discussed in several threads in this forum, so I am not going to go through that again. If you are truly interested, the presentation is there for you to find if you search. Needless to say, the Bible translations are authentic in meaning. Some paraphrases are less accurate but still relate the Gospel.

[Nucklesack]

Originally Posted by 2ndAmendment

For only a minute?

Could it be this is the Religion Forum and not the anti-religion forum? If there were an Atheist Forum on SOMD and Christians or Muslims or Jews came into it and started witnessing then it would be antagonistic. Atheists coming into a Religion Forum and making fun or belittling Christians, Muslims, Jews, or other religions is antagonistic.

These are from the First page of the Religion forum

• What is Mormonism? A Baptist Answer Plenty of posts of disinfromation from Non-Mormon Christians
• Joseph Smith, Founder of Mormon Religion Starman3000m, a Non-Mormon Christian posting about Mormonism
• Christians embrace Scientology Non-Scientology Chrisitians (including the Religion mommy 2ndA) posting about Scientology
• Church uses hip style to build diversity 2ndA posts his own interpretations here too
• Muslims For Obama Non-Muslim Christians telling us about what Muslims believe
• Romney's Life Is His Father's Legacy Here you have a Christian, who threatened to divorce his wife if she didnt become a believer, tellings us that is different than a Mormon saying he wont marry unless his fiance becomes a believer.
• Rural town may block Muslim site No Antagonism in this thread either was there?

Want me to continue?

Remember you were told "He who is without sin....."

make sure you re-inforce them windows before you start throwing rocks.

[2ndAmendment (Premo)]

Originally Posted by Xaquin44

too bad it isn't addressed in the text.

In fact, it doesn't say anything like what you say anywhere near that other stuff I quoted.

There is much on the subject of prayer in the Bible and the gather of believers together is absolutely instructed. Have you ever read the Bible from cover to cover? In faith or truly seeking? Since the Bible is of the Spirit, it must be Spiritually appraised.

Matthew 5:44
"But I say to you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you,

This was obviously in public.

Matthew 19:13 Then some children were brought to Him so that He might lay His hands on them and pray; and the disciples rebuked them.

Matthew 21:22
"And all things you ask in prayer, believing, you will receive."

Mark 11:25
"Whenever you stand praying, forgive, if you have anything against anyone, so that your Father who is in heaven will also forgive you your transgressions.

Whenever is a pretty general time.

Luke 11:1
It happened that while Jesus was praying in a certain place, after He had finished, one of His disciples said to Him, "Lord, teach us to pray just as John also taught his disciples."

Obviously Jesus was in the presence of His disciples, so this was at least semi-public.

Here is a prime example of what I tried to say.

Luke 18:9-17

9And He also told this parable to some people who trusted in themselves that they were righteous, and viewed others with contempt:

10"Two men went up into the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector.

11"The Pharisee stood and was praying this to himself: 'God, I thank You that I am not like other people: swindlers, unjust, adulterers, or even like this tax collector.

12'I fast twice a week; I pay tithes of all that I get.'

13"But the tax collector, standing some distance away, was even unwilling to lift up his eyes to heaven, but was beating his breast, saying, 'God, be merciful to me, the sinner!'

14"I tell you, this man went to his house justified rather than the other; for everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, but he who humbles himself will be exalted."

15And they were bringing even their babies to Him so that He would touch them, but when the disciples saw it, they began rebuking them.

16But Jesus called for them, saying, "Permit the children to come to Me, and do not hinder them, for the kingdom of God belongs to such as these.

17"Truly I say to you, whoever does not receive the kingdom of God like a child will not enter it at all."

See the contrast and difference in attitude and they were both in public. And we are to pray without ceasing.

1 Thessalonians 5:16-18

16Rejoice always;

17pray without ceasing;

18in everything give thanks; for this is God's will for you in Christ Jesus.

That pretty much means we must pray in public and private to my way of thinking.

[2ndAmendment (Premo)]

Originally Posted by Xaquin44

ok, but he didn't say to go into the streets and pray when you mean it. He said to keep it private.

The Bible says to pray for one another.

James 5:12-20

12But above all, my brethren, do not swear, either by heaven or by earth or with any other oath; but your yes is to be yes, and your no, no, so that you may not fall under judgment.

13Is anyone among you suffering? Then he must pray Is anyone cheerful? He is to sing praises.

14Is anyone among you sick? Then he must call for the elders of the church and they are to pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord;

15and the prayer offered in faith will restore the one who is sick, and the Lord will raise him up, and if he has committed sins, they will be forgiven him.

16Therefore, confess your sins to one another, and pray for one another so that you may be healed The effective prayer of a righteous man can accomplish much.

17Elijah was a man with a nature like ours, and he prayed earnestly that it would not rain, and it did not rain on the earth for three years and six months.

18Then he prayed again, and the sky poured rain and the earth produced its fruit.

19My brethren, if any among you strays from the truth and one turns him back,

20let him know that he who turns a sinner from the error of his way will save his soul from death and will cover a multitude of sins.

[Xaquin44]

hmmmm so contradictions.

and yes, I have read the bible cover to cover a few times.

You say 'Since the Bible is of the Spirit, it must be Spiritually appraised' and I think that is the crux of the problems concerning it. Not everyone has the same spirit. People gather what they want to from the bible and per how they feel can put anything they want into it.

Unless you extrapolate directly from the text it can be different to anyone. Unfortunatly, taking directly from the text results in contradictions as seen above.

[2ndAmendment (Premo)]

Originally Posted by Xaquin44

I know .... but many are. Heck I've been to tons of them of almost all denominations. Everyone I've been to has elements of every other.

I have been to many churches myself. If you depend on a denomination, a church, or a person (minister, priest, etc), you will be disappointed. I depend on The Man, Y'shua, God manifest as man. There is no disappointment in Him.