Genesis 22

[Starman3000m]

Originally Posted by Xaquin44

that isn't really what I asked. I know you wouldn't trade it for the world, I'm asking if you could. There is a big difference.



First, punishing humanity for all time for the actions of the first two (the ones he actually created by the way) is stupid. I've been grounded before .... I would hope that my children and their children etc. etc. won't suffer too badly because of something I did ....

Actually, sacrificing his son proves that god is a terrible parent. Especially since he knows the future and could have easily seen the outcome.

edit: haha wow, god really is a bad parent lol

lets see here.

First Son: Adam. Married Eve (his sister) and was tempted by Satan (through the deeds of his sister). Got humanity kicked out of Paradise for eternity.

Daughter: Eve. Married Adam (her brother) and was tempted by Satan. Got humanity kicked out of Paradise for eternity.

Second Son: Jesus. Let get betrayed and crucified.

also as an aside, he knocked up the wife of a married man (which according to his own commandments you really shouldn't do).

I'm sure you love your son, Xaquin, and want the best for him.
If the only way to get to heaven is by accepting God's Plan of Salvation and not by personal works, wouldn't you want your son to know how to receive eternal life?

[Xaquin44]

you are dodging the question.

but to answer yours, of course I'd want my son to go to heaven, but I'm not so foolish as to think anyone or anything in the world can tell him exactly how to get there. I'll give him the values I have and hope they stick.

Will that get him in? I don't know, but if I can teach him to be the best man he can be I'll know I did my best (and I'll know he did his best too).

[Starman3000m]

Originally Posted by Xaquin44

you are dodging the question.

but to answer yours, of course I'd want my son to go to heaven, but I'm not so foolish as to think anyone or anything in the world can tell him exactly how to get there. I'll give him the values I have and hope they stick.

Will that get him in? I don't know, but if I can teach him to be the best man he can be I'll know I did my best (and I'll know he did his best too).

You mean - you are giving your son Free-Will????

[Xaquin44]

Originally Posted by Starman3000m

You mean - you are giving your son Free-Will????

yeah .... see I'm trying to be a good parent. I would never hold eternal torment over my sons head.

you still didn't answer the question I posted to you above.

[Starman3000m]

Originally Posted by Xaquin44

yeah .... see I'm trying to be a good parent. I would never hold eternal torment over my sons head.

you still didn't answer the question I posted to you above.

I personally do not believe that a saved person would want to lose it by deciding to reject the eternal life that they had received.

Many people have outwardly appeared to be "Christians" but had never really made the honest commitment to give their life to God.

If someone wrote you a check for Ten-Million Dollars then made it available to you just for the asking would you change your mind after accepting it and then give it back?

[Xaquin44]

Originally Posted by Starman3000m

I personally do not believe that a saved person would want to lose it by deciding to reject the eternal life that they had received.

Many people have outwardly appeared to be "Christians" but had never really made the honest commitment to give their life to God.

If someone wrote you a check for Ten-Million Dollars then made it available to you just for the asking would change your mind after accepting it and then give it back?

You still aren't answering the question. This isn't a 'would you' question, it's a 'could you' question.

I'll repost it for you.

"Lets say for instance that you are going to go to heaven. Could you, right now, abandon god and there by prove him wrong?"

edit: and no, I wouldn't give the check back unless it had some ugly strings attached.

[Starman3000m]

Originally Posted by Xaquin44

You still aren't answering the question. This isn't a 'would you' question, it's a 'could you' question.

I'll repost it for you.

"Lets say for instance that you are going to go to heaven. Could you, right now, abandon god and there by prove him wrong?"

No - because God would already know that my original decision to accept Yeshua as my Lord and Saviour was not a sincere one.

You can't fool God.

[Xaquin44]

so then there is no free will is there?

If it's already determined and can't be changed, then where is the 'free' part?

[Starman3000m]

Originally Posted by Xaquin44

so then there is no free will is there?

If it's already determined and can't be changed, then where is the 'free' part?

You are leaving Satan out of the equation here.

God wants you to go to heaven and has provided a way for you to receive Eternal Life.

Satan wants to keep your soul captive and under his control.

Which do you choose to follow?

[Xaquin44]

Originally Posted by Starman3000m

You are leaving Satan out of the equation here.

God wants you to go to heaven and has provided a way for you to receive Eternal Life.

Satan wants to keep your soul captive and under his control.

Which do you choose to follow?

what does that matter, if god already knows?

satan is a non issue (why god created him I don't know) (also why god allows him to remain I don't know either). Since god knoweth all or whatever, he'll know if a person is to be tempted or not.