Genesis 22

[Dougstermd (Premo)]

as a Father can you even consider this a justified act?

Further you really think that abram/abraham was really getting busy at age 100 or that he could hike up the hill/ mountain to consider killing his son?

just a thought not an anti-sermon

[Starman3000m]

Originally Posted by Dougstermd

as a Father can you even consider this a justified act?

Further you really think that abram/abraham was really getting busy at age 100 or that he could hike up the hill/ mountain to consider killing his son?

just a thought not an anti-sermon

Yes, it is quite difficult to comprehend with the mindset of our natural human intellect. But, one must remember that God deals with us on a spiritual level as the things of God are spiritually discerned.

But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned. (1 Corinthians 2:14)


Also, Abraham had a direct and personal communication with God and remained completely obedient in what God asked him to do.

However, this was a test of faith that God put Abraham through as it proved the degree of obedience and trust that Abraham had toward God. As a result God was pleased with Abraham's faith and did not allow Abraham to follow through with slaying Isaac.

"... Lay not thine hand upon the lad, neither do thou any thing unto him: for now I know that thou fearest God, seeing thou hast not withheld thy son, thine only son from me." (Genesis 22:12)

This was also a foreshadowing of what would come to pass in the life of Yeshua HaMAshiach (New Testament Jesus).

In other words, if just one faithful and obedient human was willing to give up his son to God in this manner then God would be willing to do what He asked of a mere mortal being. Herein is the foundational basis by which mankind receives forgiveness and reconciliation - through faith in the Atoning Blood of God's only begotten Son.

Herein is the test of faith placed upon all mankind:

And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up:
That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. (John 3:14-18)

There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. (Romans 8:1)

[Nucklesack]

Originally Posted by Dougstermd

as a Father can you even consider this a justified act?

Further you really think that abram/abraham was really getting busy at age 100 or that he could hike up the hill/ mountain to consider killing his son?

just a thought not an anti-sermon

God orders Abraham to kill Isaac as a burnt offering. Abraham shows his love for God by his willingness to murder his son. Abraham shows his willingness to kill his son for God. Only an evil God would ask a father to do that; only a bad father would be willing to do it.

"Now I know that thou fearest God..." This is an odd statement from God, who supposedly knows everything. If God knows the mind and heart of all humans, then why did he have to test Abraham to find out what was in his heart?

I'd definitely tell anyone who thought God was telling them to kill someone to go see a doctor and make sure they're on the right meds.

[Starman3000m]

Originally Posted by Nucklesack

God orders Abraham to kill Isaac as a burnt offering. Abraham shows his love for God by his willingness to murder his son. Abraham shows his willingness to kill his son for God. Only an evil God would ask a father to do that; only a bad father would be willing to do it.

"Now I know that thou fearest God..." This is an odd statement from God, who supposedly knows everything. If God knows the mind and heart of all humans, then why did he have to test Abraham to find out what was in his heart?

I'd definitely tell anyone who thought God was telling them to kill someone to go see a doctor and make sure they're on the right meds.

This was a one-time event in the Biblical accounts of how God dealt with mankind through the Patriarchs of old.

The specific circumstance with Abraham was unique and exemplified the ultimate action that God would be taking on behalf of reconciling mankind back to Him.

Meanwhile the Bible is full of other accounts where God tested the "Free Will" of mankind and, although God would knew the final outcome, He still allowed people to make their own free-will actions which would have commendations or consequences to their response of God's directives.

Abraham's thoughts upon being asked by God to slay his son must have been: God Gives and God Takes Away. Abraham did not question the God whom he knew to be the Supreme Authority over all things. Again, Abraham had a direct and personal communication with God that was unique in his life and which became the foundation of man's faith toward God.

Now, let's not forget one of the tests to see whether mankind obeyed a directive that was not so drastic as the one given to Abraham as a test. The best example is right at the beginning of when man was placed upon this earth:

According to Genesis, there were two decisive trees (options) in The Beginning. A tree of life that would provide eternal life and a tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil.

Adam and Eve were given directions not to eat of the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil.

Guess what happened? Their free-will disobedience caused man's downfall and separation from a perfect environment. Both were aware that God had directed them not to eat of that specific tree but they did it anyway.

(Kinda like when a parent asks a child not to do a specific thing)

Because of that free-will disobedience, mankind became inherently imperfect and separated from through the ability to resist and defy God's directives.
Adam and Eve were then expelled out of the Garden before they would have a chance to also eat of the "Tree of Life" which would have cause them to receive eternal life in a state of willful disobedience toward God.

Yet, God provided the way back for mankind to be forgiven and receive the eternal life that Adam and Even would have received had they eaten of the Tree of Life instead of the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil.

Yeshua HaMashiach (New Testament Jesus) is also called the Tree of Life whereby all who partake of accepting God's forgiveness through His Atoning Blood will receive Eternal Life. This is something God did for you even though you may defy His Authority. God allowed His Son, Yeshua, to pay the penalty for man's disobedience, defiance and separation that our souls have toward God, thus, the need for a Saviour!

It is ultimately your free-will decision whether to accept God's Plan of Salvation for your soul or believe God is a liar or choose to believe that God does not exist.

"I Am The Way, The Truth and The Life; No Man Can Come Unto The Father Except Through Me." (John 14:6)

[itsbob (Premo)]

So men could talk to God then, but not now?

Does God not have At&T??

God and Baby Jesus don't have At&T which means less bars in places like heaven.


Can you hear me now?

[itsbob (Premo)]

Originally Posted by Starman3000m

Guess what happened? Their free-will disobedience caused man's downfall and separation from a perfect environment. Both were aware that God had directed them not to eat of that specific tree but they did it anyway.

And yet this would have HAD to be part of God's plan in the first place. Adam and Eve HAD to eat the apple, and as you stated earlier God would have known prior that they were going to eat the apple, no matter what they were 'commanded'. So doing what was expected, and doing what needed to be done, was a sin??

[Dougstermd (Premo)]

would planning to kill be considered a conspiracy to murder???

[Xaquin44]

Originally Posted by Starman3000m

This was a one-time event in the Biblical accounts of how God dealt with mankind through the Patriarchs of old.

I had no idea you knew god on a personal level and, through the millenia, can verify that he has only performed a certain action once.

can you let me know if he plans on another world flood anytime soon?

[Starman3000m]

Originally Posted by Xaquin44

I had no idea you knew god on a personal level and, through the millenia, can verify that he has only performed a certain action once.

can you let me know if he plans on another world flood anytime soon?

Born-Again Children of God, through faith in Yeshua (New Testament Jesus) all know God on a personal/spiritual level. It is through the indwelling Holy Spirit of God's presence in our lives.

Prophecy states that the next time this earth will be by destroyed is by devastation through fire.

[Xaquin44]

Originally Posted by Starman3000m

Born-Again Children of God, through faith in Yeshua (New Testament Jesus) all know God on a personal/spiritual level. It is through the indwelling Holy Spirit of God's presence in our lives.

ever go fishing with him?