Is it possible...

[libby]

Originally Posted by ItalianScallion

YES they could choose not to sin but, even with Christ in our lives, we ALL still sin. You're saying that, even as accountable kids, they were sinless but I highly doubt that ANY accountable kid would not sin on the way to adulthood. One little lie, one disobeying their parents, one bad thought, etc., is sin. So the answer to your questions are:

Yes we have free will
Yes we can choose not to sin (For a time)
But no, we can't be sinless for our entire life

The verse: "All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God" makes it clear that every "accountable" person will sin. No accountable person misses that privilege and nowhere does the Bible speak of an "accountable" sinless person except Jesus. Even Paul says perfection won't come until eternity.

Why wouldn't He? Sure He doesn't have to tell us but it would give us something to "shoot for" IF it were possible.

Well, you can't have it both ways, IS. A person can, one moment at a time, one choice at a time, choose God, if they have free will.

[cheezgrits]

Here's a non-evangelical, non-religious response for you.

Yes, we are born with free will.

Yes, one could theoretically live without sinning by choice.

[ItalianScallion (Premo)]

Originally Posted by libby

Well, you can't have it both ways, IS. A person can, one moment at a time, one choice at a time, choose God, if they have free will.

I absolutely can have it both ways. You have free will so go and try NOT to sin tomorrow then come to RR tomorrow afternoon and tell me how it works out. I'll bet you sin.

Originally Posted by cheezgrits

Here's a non-evangelical, non-religious response for you.
Yes, we are born with free will.
Yes, one could theoretically live without sinning by choice.

And that's the answer she was looking for. She didn't want to hear otherwise and I brought up the "otherwise" view...

[libby]

Originally Posted by ItalianScallion

I absolutely can have it both ways. You have free will so go and try NOT to sin tomorrow then come to RR tomorrow afternoon and tell me how it works out. I'll bet you sin.

And that's the answer she was looking for. She didn't want to hear otherwise and I brought up the "otherwise" view...

Well, I'm not talking about me, I'm talking about a hypothetical person. And I have spiritual direction tomorrow, so I'll have to pass on the RR invite.
You are resisting because you don't like it, but free will is perfectly in keeping with Protestant theology.
It is possible. Not likely, not probable and certainly no commonplace. Only possible.

[Larry Gude (Premo)]

Originally Posted by libby

Recently having a conversation with my son, who loves philosophy and theology. It brought to mind a question I would like to ask our Protestant bretheren, at least some of them.
If I understand correctly, some Protestants do not believe in Original Sin. With this in mind I would like to ask, "is it possible for a person to commit no sin".
Now, it would seem that I have the Blessed Mother in mind, which I certainly did not when I had the conversation with my son. However, it did lead to that in my own mind as we went over the theological point, and it solidified her sinlessness to me, but I'm not trying to convince any of you of that.
I'm only interested in whether Protestant theology acknowleges the possibility. We all have free will, that is a point on which we all agree. Therefore, if we truly have free will, it is possible for a person to always choose the good. This is different from probable, or likely, or anything else. And I'm really not looking for a debate on the Blessed Mother.

Baptized as an Episcopal, we have a rather relaxed view of how 'it all works' and don't get too worked about the literalness of it all.

In short, 'sin' happens.

[b23hqb]

Originally Posted by Hank

I believe I can fly.

You certainly have the flight suit for it.

[StoneThrower]

Originally Posted by libby

Recently having a conversation with my son, who loves philosophy and theology. It brought to mind a question I would like to ask our Protestant brethren, at least some of them.
If I understand correctly, some Protestants do not believe in Original Sin. With this in mind I would like to ask, "is it possible for a person to commit no sin".
Now, it would seem that I have the Blessed Mother in mind, which I certainly did not when I had the conversation with my son. However, it did lead to that in my own mind as we went over the theological point, and it solidified her sinlessness to me, but I'm not trying to convince any of you of that.
I'm only interested in whether Protestant theology acknowledges the possibility. We all have free will, that is a point on which we all agree. Therefore, if we truly have free will, it is possible for a person to always choose the good. This is different from probable, or likely, or anything else. And I'm really not looking for a debate on the Blessed Mother.

Hi Libby,
I think what you are referring to is not being born without sin, but that some believe in Holy Perfection

"Christian perfection (also known as perfect love; heart purity; the baptism of the Holy Spirit; the fullness of the blessing; Christian holiness; the second blessing; the second work of grace; and entire sanctification) is a doctrine of the Holiness movement which holds that the heart of the regenerant (born-again) Christian may attain a state of holiness in which believers are made free from original sin, or depravity, and where there is a total love for God and others wrought by the infilling of the Holy Spirit."

that once you are saved it possible under the right conditions to no longer sin. Charles Wesley believed in this although he said he never obtained it. There was another famous person who embraced it as well but confessed he never obtained it. I am not aware of anyone today propagating this belief but Wesleyan was one that used to. He was wrong though as our sanctification is not complete until we are dead and become glorified.

[StoneThrower]

Libby I mean, if a person answers 'no' to #3 then they obviously do not believe in free will. Feel free to correct me on this point.

We have free will but.... God has two types of will sovereign will (that nothing can change) and permissive where if we sin he doesn't keep us from it, it grieves him but He still uses it. Joseph brothers are a great example. So our free will must operate within his that said. When we become born again he gives us a new nature with new desires we still sin but less because now we hate sin and have the Holy Spirit living in us. We will alway sin as that is the very thing that we are that nature never leaves us but as we become more and more sanctified it starves and becomes the weaker of the two.
Sanctification is about direction not perfection. We need Glorification at death to complete the process.

[StoneThrower]

Originally Posted by Radiant1

I understand the questions, believe me, I had a ton of them myself at one point. It basically boils down to logic. Jesus is God. God cannot by His very nature be impure in any way, shape, or form; therefore, Jesus could not take on a sinful nature by being born of Mary if she herself was not created sinless by Him in anticipation of what He was going to do (redemption). In other words, if Mary was like the rest of us average women then Jesus wasn't God. Mary being conceived without sin is actually a testament to God's glory and everything God is.

This leads to more questions of course, "Then why isn't Mary a savior?" The answer is because she was not God and did not make the sacrifice for us.

Another question, "Does that mean Mary didn't need a savior?" Of course she did. By way of anaology -- a man is walking along and falls in the ditch, he needs someone to save him by throwing in a rope and pulling him out. Or, the man is walking up to the ditch he does not see, and someone saves him by warning him. In both cases, the man is saved; however, in the latter example the saving happened before the actual fall into the ditch (like Mary). Jude 24-25: "Now to him who is able to keep you from falling and to present you without blemish before the presence of his glory with rejoicing, to the only God, our Savior through Jesus Christ our Lord, be glory, majesty, dominion, and authority, before all time and now and for ever." Mary was presented without blemish before the glory of God at the Incarnation.

Although it's implied in numerous places in scripture, you're not going to find a direct reference any more than you would Trinity; however, you can logical deduce truth from it regardless.

Because a mans seed wasnt involved and the Holy spirit came upon her that is why Jesus was born without an Adamic nature.

Mary confessed that she was a sinner in need of a savior.

[StoneThrower]

Originally Posted by libby

WTH does this have to do with works? You are making this into something it is not.
Why do you say it is impossible? Because it is extraordinarily hard? Because you don't know of anyone who has managed it?
It can not simultaneously say a person has free will, but also say it is impossible to always choose the good.
One choice at a time, one moment at a time, a person, of his own free will, can choose a sinless life.
If you say it is impossible, then IMO, you are saying God did not give us the freedom to choose Him.

We cant choose not to sin any more than to not breath.
We lie because we are liars its not the telling of lies that makes us a liar.
You can take a person but them on a deserted island all by them selves and they will sin as its what we are that nature never leaves us while we are alive. It can be starved though to a point as we become more holy we will be more conscious and strive to do it less.