Matthew 9:1-8 Jesus Forgives the paralyzed may

[hotcoffee]

Jesus Forgives and Heals a Paralyzed Man

Matthew 9:1 "Jesus stepped into a boat, crossed over and came to his own town. 2 Some men brought to him a paralyzed man, lying on a mat. When Jesus saw their faith, he said to the man, “Take heart, son; your sins are forgiven.”

3 At this, some of the teachers of the law said to themselves, “This fellow is blaspheming!”

4 Knowing their thoughts, Jesus said, “Why do you entertain evil thoughts in your hearts? 5 Which is easier: to say, ‘Your sins are forgiven,’ or to say, ‘Get up and walk’? 6 But I want you to know that the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins.” So he said to the paralyzed man, “Get up, take your mat and go home.” 7 Then the man got up and went home. 8 When the crowd saw this, they were filled with awe; and they praised God, who had given such authority to man."

Ok y'all this is the place where you should discuss it. Was Jesus Man or was Jesus God?

The Jewish nation believed that sin and disease went hand in hand. They saw it in Egypt when the plagues happened. They talked about it in Job. The Prophets would heal by the will of God.

Jesus had just been asked to leave from Gadarenes where He had squared of with demons. He had returned to Capernaum [His new home it seems.... away from Nazareth]. People knew Him there and wherever He went he drew large crowds of people. This is the area where the Centurion had sent for Jesus to heal his servant.

Now comes the part about the paralyzed man. He had to be carried through the crowds to get him to Jesus for the healing. [In another gospel they say he was lowered through the roof]. At any rate, the very act of working so hard to get to Jesus, the huge amount of faith it showed to travel with this man on a stretcher, the persistence of working through the crowd to get up close.... these are all testaments to the faith of these men. Even the fact that these men would be so loyal as to do all this for their friend who couldn't do it for himself is a testament of how good this man must have been.

So... when Jesus saw him, Jesus said..."Your sins are forgiven". Notice... Jesus didn't say "I forgive your sins"..... he said "Your sins are forgiven"... do you see the distinction?

The scribes [you saw them before.... one of the scribes wanted to go with Jesus when He left Capernaum the first time].... the scribes were aware of the large crowds Jesus was drawing... and large crowds always mean something is afoot.... so they are now waiting for Jesus to mess up... [the Washington Post or CNN of the day I would call them]....

When Jesus said "Your sins are forgiven" I can just see them saying to themselves "oh no you dint".... They didn't say anything out loud but Jesus could read their minds as clear as if they were speaking directly to Him.

He said to the scribes "What's the problem" [paraphrasing again].... What's the difference between saying "your sins are forgiven" and "take up your mat and walk".

There's the test, you see. If Jesus had said "your sins are forgiven".... and the guy was still paralyzed... then Jesus is not healing....

If Jesus says "get up and walk" and the man does.... then Jesus is healing....

AND since the man did get up and walk away.... and the Jewish people equated the paralysis with sin.... then Jesus had healed Him and His sins were forgiven.

Notice here.... Jesus, the son of God, was given authority to forgive sins hear on earth....

This... by the way.... is the beginning of the trip to the cross.... He will eventually be turned over to the Sanhedrin because He will be accused of blasphemy.

So.... go .... God or Human?

[ItalianScallion (Premo)]

Originally Posted by hotcoffee

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Was Jesus Man or was Jesus God? ...when Jesus saw him, Jesus said..."Your sins are forgiven". Notice... Jesus didn't say "I forgive your sins"..... he said "Your sins are forgiven"... do you see the distinction?

Again, both God & man but we have to discern which perspective He is speaking from. As we've said in the other thread, Jesus never stopped being God when He came to earth. He simply allowed the Holy Spirit to work through Him.

I wouldn't get too carried away with the part about Jesus forgiving sins or not because He is God after all and it depends on which perspective Jesus is speaking from. He does say that: "the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins"...

Originally Posted by hotcoffee

He said to the scribes "What's the difference between saying "your sins are forgiven" and "take up your mat and walk". Since the man did get up and walk away.... and the Jewish people equated the paralysis with sin.... then Jesus had healed Him and His sins were forgiven. Notice here.... Jesus, the son of God, was given authority to forgive sins hear on earth....So.... God or Human?

The Jews believed that only God could forgive sins (Mark 2v7) but they did not believe that Jesus was the Messiah, which was the heart of their problem. Their mis-understanding of Scripture is also why they had soo much trouble believing in who the real Messiah would be.

[hotcoffee]

Originally Posted by ItalianScallion

Again, both God & man but we have to discern which perspective He is speaking from. As we've said in the other thread, Jesus never stopped being God when He came to earth. He simply allowed the Holy Spirit to work through Him.

I wouldn't get too carried away with the part about Jesus forgiving sins or not because He is God after all and it depends on which perspective Jesus is speaking from. He does say that: "the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins"...

The Jews believed that only God could forgive sins (Mark 2v7) but they did not believe that Jesus was the Messiah, which was the heart of their problem. Their mis-understanding of Scripture is also why they had soo much trouble believing in who the real Messiah would be.

The human side of Jesus felt emotions. God has emotions as well. We see them in the story of Noah, Sodom, and even when the Abel offered his sacrifice. I think the human side of Jesus felt emotions like defeat and confusion.... these are emotions that God wouldn't feel. It's not easy to feel defeated when you are never wrong.

On a side note.... last night out of the blue, my husband said... "God must have been on drugs when He created goats".... I have to agree that goats are odd animals.... those floppy ears and the desire to eat anything and everything....

We don't understand everything God does. Then again... we don't have the perspective God has.

Just some thoughts on the difference between the human side and the God side. Jesus had the opportunity to feel both sides. I personally think He did a great job.

[Dondi]

I have a question.

On this incident of the man with palsy being healed, on what basis was the man forgiven his sins in this instance?

[hotcoffee]

Originally Posted by Dondi

I have a question.

On this incident of the man with palsy being healed, on what basis was the man forgiven his sins in this instance?

On his Faith. On the Faith of His friends....

Glad you brought this up... in this case we see intercession at work. The man and his friends were committed to getting to Jesus. They persevered through the crowds and all the obstacles.

Later in the gospels we'll see this scene described in more detail. They actually pulled the man up above the house Jesus was in and lowered him down to where Jesus was.... quite a feat....

Faith is not simply working up a feeling or suppressing doubts, but demonstrated commitment to getting to the One on whose power we stake our trust.

He was healed because they believed so strongly that Jesus would and could heal him.

[Dondi]

Yes. I guess my point was that it didn't seem like the faith of the palsy man was what got his sins forgiven, but rather the faith of his four friends. I mean it seems to bear that out in both passages, particularly in Mark 2:1-12.

I suppose we could read into it that the palsy man agreed to have his four friends take him to Jesus, which would require faith. But it was the friends who found a way to get him to Jesus through the roof of the house. And the palsy man certainly responded to rise up and walk, but that was only after Jesus told him his sins were forgiven.

I guess my question is: To what degree does the actions and faith of his four friends grant the palsy man forgiveness of sins? (Since it says Jesus saw their faith)

[hotcoffee]

Originally Posted by Dondi

Yes. I guess my point was that it didn't seem like the faith of the palsy man was what got his sins forgiven, but rather the faith of his four friends. I mean it seems to bear that out in both passages, particularly in Mark 2:1-12.

I suppose we could read into it that the palsy man agreed to have his four friends take him to Jesus, which would require faith. But it was the friends who found a way to get him to Jesus through the roof of the house. And the palsy man certainly responded to rise up and walk, but that was only after Jesus told him his sins were forgiven.

I guess my question is: To what degree does the actions and faith of his four friends grant the palsy man forgiveness of sins? (Since it says Jesus saw their faith)

I'm sure their faith had something to do with it. I doubt he could have ever made his way to Jesus without them. So their intercession for him spoke volumns.... but he had to have faith first and foremost.

Take the situation of a drunk.... His friends can drive him up to rehab but the drunk has to want to help [forgiveness] for the rehab to work.

I can pray for the sole of my neighbor but my neighbor has to ask for salvation for it to occur.

I use to tell a very special person in my life that I was sure that person would have salvation before that person died.... because that person means so much to me and I mean so much to the Lord.... I just couldn't imagine Heaven without that person there.... But I couldn't pray for that person's salvation.... I had to pray for the Lord to work in that person's life to bring that person to salvation.... know what I mean?

When 9-11 happened.... what was so devastating to me was not the terror I felt.... the thing that was so devastating to me was all those lost souls.... all those people who went out that morning without Jesus in their heart.... not knowing that it was the last day for them.... all the prayer in the world will not save one of them.... they are gone...

[Dondi]

I see what you mean.

Except a drunk is drunk of his own accord. The man with palsy didn't choose to have that condition. The man with palsy wasn't going there to receive forgiveness, only that he would be healed, for I'm sure he had heard the fame of Jesus healing the sick from all over.

[hotcoffee]

I was listening to WAVA this morning....

Alistair Begg just started a new series of sermons. So this morning he opened with 2 Kings 5....

2 Kings 5
New International Version (NIV)

Naaman Healed of Leprosy
5 Now Naaman was commander of the army of the king of Aram. He was a great man in the sight of his master and highly regarded, because through him the Lord had given victory to Aram. He was a valiant soldier, but he had leprosy.[a]
2 Now bands of raiders from Aram had gone out and had taken captive a young girl from Israel, and she served Naaman’s wife. 3 She said to her mistress, “If only my master would see the prophet who is in Samaria! He would cure him of his leprosy.”

4 Naaman went to his master and told him what the girl from Israel had said. 5 “By all means, go,” the king of Aram replied. “I will send a letter to the king of Israel.” So Naaman left, taking with him ten talents[b] of silver, six thousand shekels[c] of gold and ten sets of clothing. 6 The letter that he took to the king of Israel read: “With this letter I am sending my servant Naaman to you so that you may cure him of his leprosy.”

7 As soon as the king of Israel read the letter, he tore his robes and said, “Am I God? Can I kill and bring back to life? Why does this fellow send someone to me to be cured of his leprosy? See how he is trying to pick a quarrel with me!”

8 When Elisha the man of God heard that the king of Israel had torn his robes, he sent him this message: “Why have you torn your robes? Have the man come to me and he will know that there is a prophet in Israel.” 9 So Naaman went with his horses and chariots and stopped at the door of Elisha’s house. 10 Elisha sent a messenger to say to him, “Go, wash yourself seven times in the Jordan, and your flesh will be restored and you will be cleansed.”

11 But Naaman went away angry and said, “I thought that he would surely come out to me and stand and call on the name of the Lord his God, wave his hand over the spot and cure me of my leprosy. 12 Are not Abana and Pharpar, the rivers of Damascus, better than all the waters of Israel? Couldn’t I wash in them and be cleansed?” So he turned and went off in a rage.
13 Naaman’s servants went to him and said, “My father, if the prophet had told you to do some great thing, would you not have done it? How much more, then, when he tells you, ‘Wash and be cleansed’!” 14 So he went down and dipped himself in the Jordan seven times, as the man of God had told him, and his flesh was restored and became clean like that of a young boy.
15 Then Naaman and all his attendants went back to the man of God. He stood before him and said, “Now I know that there is no God in all the world except in Israel. So please accept a gift from your servant.”

16 The prophet answered, “As surely as the Lord lives, whom I serve, I will not accept a thing.” And even though Naaman urged him, he refused.
17 “If you will not,” said Naaman, “please let me, your servant, be given as much earth as a pair of mules can carry, for your servant will never again make burnt offerings and sacrifices to any other god but the Lord. 18 But may the Lord forgive your servant for this one thing: When my master enters the temple of Rimmon to bow down and he is leaning on my arm and I have to bow there also—when I bow down in the temple of Rimmon, may the Lord forgive your servant for this.”

19 “Go in peace,” Elisha said.

Footnotes:
a.2 Kings 5:1 The Hebrew for leprosy was used for various diseases affecting the skin; also in verses 3, 6, 7, 11 and 27.
b.2 Kings 5:5 That is, about 750 pounds or about 340 kilograms
c.2 Kings 5:5 That is, about 150 pounds or about 69 kilograms
d.2 Kings 5:22 That is, about 75 pounds or about 34 kilograms

So in this case Naaman didn't particularly believe.... It was Elisha who believed and knew that it would bring glory to God. Then again.... the young girl from Israel who served Naaman's wife had faith.

Naaman did walk into the Jordan to bathe.... he could have gone home in that self righteous huff he was in.... since there was not a real formal ceremony for him...

[hotcoffee]

Originally Posted by Dondi

I see what you mean.

Except a drunk is drunk of his own accord. The man with palsy didn't choose to have that condition. The man with palsy wasn't going there to receive forgiveness, only that he would be healed, for I'm sure he had heard the fame of Jesus healing the sick from all over.

Remember tho.... In those days they saw a direct connection between sin and disease. God had laid down the law [so to speake] that since they had not obeyed him... they would suffer disease. They believed that. Palsy was a disease and they believed the only reason this man was ill was because the human nature had been corrupted by sin....

Without forgiveness his disease was never going to get better.... There wasn't a Mayo clinic.... they really thought sin caused disease and disease caused death....