FANTASY CHALLENGE: TNT Summer Series at Loudon

[AndyMarquisLIVE (Premo)]

Originally Posted by OldHillcrestGuy

Andys mind is somewhere else this week, heck he has a couple of threads going out there, people trying to get him laid, girls fighting over him, who's the biggest ##### on the forums, his plate is quite full at the moment.

I did not see this "biggest #####" tread. Point me in the general direction. TIA.

[Gtmustang88]

Originally Posted by AndyMarquisLIVE

Harvick's been sucking this year.

He hasn't done anything in anything this season.

I see Joe Gibbs is having Tony race the 20 cars the next few races. That's right Joe, don't let the development driver develop by running the Nationwide Series, just send in your pro drivers to run the amateur series.

I hate to say it needs to go this far, but NASCAR needs to ban Cup owners and drivers from running in Nationwide.

Without the cup owners and drivers in the nationwide series, you will not attract all the fans, and you also wont' have a full field of cars. Even the field fillers they have now are so far off the pace from the regular busch drivers... Series isn't like what it use to be because even to run good in the busch series, you need to have a descent amount of money.

[nachomama]

Originally Posted by AndyMarquisLIVE

Harvick's been sucking this year.

He hasn't done anything in anything this season.

I see Joe Gibbs is having Tony race the 20 cars the next few races. That's right Joe, don't let the development driver develop by running the Nationwide Series, just send in your pro drivers to run the amateur series.

I hate to say it needs to go this far, but NASCAR needs to ban Cup owners and drivers from running in Nationwide.

I don't think they should be banned, because then you wouldn't have the numbers come out to watch the races (although I'd still go). But I think they should possibly limit the number of Nationwide Series races they can run per season, perhaps limit them to 12 per year.

[AndyMarquisLIVE (Premo)]

Originally Posted by Gtmustang88

Without the cup owners and drivers in the nationwide series, you will not attract all the fans, and you also wont' have a full field of cars. Even the field fillers they have now are so far off the pace from the regular busch drivers... Series isn't like what it use to be because even to run good in the busch series, you need to have a descent amount of money.

It hurts NASCAR in the long run.

Where's NASCAR going to find its talent? The Busch... oh wait, Camping World East Racing Series?



I like to watch the up-and-coming drivers. I'm a huge Joey Logano fan. I'm a huge Alli Owens fan. Joey's won in Camping World East, he's won in ARCA, he's even won in Nationwide Series. So what's next? He's gotta sit there and wait to be able to run another Nationwide Series.

Effing Stephen Leicht is a BACKUP DRIVER for Clint Bowyer...in Nationwide. He's got a Nationwide Series win and several top-fives, but no more possiblities.

We're starting to reach a point where drivers rise through their careers to the doorsteps of Nationwide, can't get a good ride and don't get the chance to make their way to Cup. Independent teams can only run one or two races before being run off by the big teams. Gilliland's team won a race before being bought out and shut down by Robert Yates.

There's no competition anymore. I'm all for getting fans' butts into the seats, but it reaches a point where there's no crop of talent anymore.

The Nationwide Series standalone events at Kentucky, Nashville, Milwaukee, Memphis and Gateway have done just fine for years without Spitcup drivers running in those races. We used to go to the Miami Busch Series race every year, and only a handful of Cup drivers raced there.

It's really a shame that here I am looking forward to being able to watch the up-and-comers race at New Jersey in an ARCA race. I don't even go to the Nationwide races anymore. When I do, I usually end up leaving early unless a NW driver has a shot at finishing in the top-five. But, I just can't wait to see Alli Owens, Scott Speed, Matt Carter, Matt Hawkins, Ricky Steinhouse, Justin Lofton and all the other up-and-comers race at New Jersey Motorsports Park. Plus, it'll be my first road course race and first Sports Car Club of America race the day after...

Where do you draw the line with the Cuppers?

[AndyMarquisLIVE (Premo)]

Originally Posted by nachomama

I don't think they should be banned, because then you wouldn't have the numbers come out to watch the races (although I'd still go). But I think they should possibly limit the number of Nationwide Series races they can run per season, perhaps limit them to 12 per year.

Cup drivers - 5 races

Cup owners and organizations shouldn't be allowed to own more than 2 cars, but we know they'll just do like Slick Rick and build cars and engines and funnel money to one of it's drivers' teams.

[Gtmustang88]

Originally Posted by AndyMarquisLIVE

It hurts NASCAR in the long run.

Where's NASCAR going to find its talent? The Busch... oh wait, Camping World East Racing Series?



I like to watch the up-and-coming drivers. I'm a huge Joey Logano fan. I'm a huge Alli Owens fan. Joey's won in Camping World East, he's won in ARCA, he's even won in Nationwide Series. So what's next? He's gotta sit there and wait to be able to run another Nationwide Series.

Effing Stephen Leicht is a BACKUP DRIVER for Clint Bowyer...in Nationwide. He's got a Nationwide Series win and several top-fives, but no more possiblities.

We're starting to reach a point where drivers rise through their careers to the doorsteps of Nationwide, can't get a good ride and don't get the chance to make their way to Cup. Independent teams can only run one or two races before being run off by the big teams. Gilliland's team won a race before being bought out and shut down by Robert Yates.

There's no competition anymore. I'm all for getting fans' butts into the seats, but it reaches a point where there's no crop of talent anymore.

The Nationwide Series standalone events at Kentucky, Nashville, Milwaukee, Memphis and Gateway have done just fine for years without Spitcup drivers running in those races. We used to go to the Miami Busch Series race every year, and only a handful of Cup drivers raced there.

It's really a shame that here I am looking forward to being able to watch the up-and-comers race at New Jersey in an ARCA race. I don't even go to the Nationwide races anymore. When I do, I usually end up leaving early unless a NW driver has a shot at finishing in the top-five. But, I just can't wait to see Alli Owens, Scott Speed, Matt Carter, Matt Hawkins, Ricky Steinhouse, Justin Lofton and all the other up-and-comers race at New Jersey Motorsports Park. Plus, it'll be my first road course race and first Sports Car Club of America race the day after...

Where do you draw the line with the Cuppers?

I understand where you are coming from, but money runs this sport. Sponsers want to sponser proven drivers and teams to get the most recognition for their company. Those stand alone events also don't draw a crowd near what a cup race does, nor do they have the seating capacity, but they have a hard enough time gettings those seats filled. Alot of those tracks end up giving sponsers alot of race tickets for free just to draw a crowd to the race.

[AndyMarquisLIVE (Premo)]

Originally Posted by Gtmustang88

I understand where you are coming from, but money runs this sport. Sponsers want to sponser proven drivers and teams to get the most recognition for their company. Those stand alone events also don't draw a crowd near what a cup race does, nor do they have the seating capacity, but they have a hard enough time gettings those seats filled. Alot of those tracks end up giving sponsers alot of race tickets for free just to draw a crowd to the race.

Really?

Joey Logano is sponsored by GameStop.

Alli Owens - ElectrifyingCareers.com, NECA

Chrissy Wallace - GEICO

Michael McDowell - Aaron's

Scott Speed - Red Bull

Michael Waltrip is sponsored by NAPA for chrissake. If this doesn't prove my point, than nothing will....

Sponsors want someone who's marketable, someone who they can sell their product to, someone who investors will take a liking to. Sponsors want someone who will show up to their conventions and their big sponsorship events and will mention them on television win or lose.

Fans like the same respect from a driver. Why do you think Kenny Wallace, Bill Elliott, Dale Earnhardt Jr., and Ken Schrader are so popular? Wouldn't you agree that Wild Thing would have a lot more fans if he wasn't such a pompous ass all the time?

The other thing that sells is good hard racing. Richmond sells out every single time we go there. You know why? It's the action track, and action is guaranteed.

Go to a track like Fontana. They're in a large market, they have all the big names racing, and they can't even sell 80,000 friggin' tickets. Why? The racing sucks. Every single time NASCAR goes there, the criticism is amped up and the writers and bloggers ask the same thing: Why does Auto Club Speedway have 2 dates? If you have a decent short track, you're going to have butts in the seats every single race you run. Look at Virginia Motor Speedway and Eldora Speedway. When it comes to racing, the thing that sells tickets is the racing action. If your track doesn't put on a good show, fans will not come.

The biggest problem for the Nationwide Series is the fans are slowly dissenegrating. The series has no identity. Sponsorship rights for the title of the series sold for half of what NASCAR wanted, and the fans are complaining more than ever about Nationwide Series races being boring. Now, I'm a long time racing fan, and the Nationwide Series used to be the most exciting series in NASCAR. Well, not anymore.

[AndyMarquisLIVE (Premo)]

Originally Posted by Gtmustang88

Those stand alone events also don't draw a crowd near what a cup race does, nor do they have the seating capacity, but they have a hard enough time gettings those seats filled.

Which is why Bruton Smith wants to take a date from Dover or Atlanta and move it to Kentucky, right?

[Gtmustang88]

Originally Posted by AndyMarquisLIVE

Really?

Joey Logano is sponsored by GameStop.

Alli Owens - ElectrifyingCareers.com, NECA

Chrissy Wallace - GEICO

Michael McDowell - Aaron's

Scott Speed - Red Bull

Michael Waltrip is sponsored by NAPA for chrissake. If this doesn't prove my point, than nothing will....

Sponsors want someone who's marketable, someone who they can sell their product to, someone who investors will take a liking to. Sponsors want someone who will show up to their conventions and their big sponsorship events and will mention them on television win or lose.

Fans like the same respect from a driver. Why do you think Kenny Wallace, Bill Elliott, Dale Earnhardt Jr., and Ken Schrader are so popular? Wouldn't you agree that Wild Thing would have a lot more fans if he wasn't such a pompous ass all the time?

The other thing that sells is good hard racing. Richmond sells out every single time we go there. You know why? It's the action track, and action is guaranteed.

Go to a track like Fontana. They're in a large market, they have all the big names racing, and they can't even sell 80,000 friggin' tickets. Why? The racing sucks. Every single time NASCAR goes there, the criticism is amped up and the writers and bloggers ask the same thing: Why does Auto Club Speedway have 2 dates? If you have a decent short track, you're going to have butts in the seats every single race you run. Look at Virginia Motor Speedway and Eldora Speedway. When it comes to racing, the thing that sells tickets is the racing action. If your track doesn't put on a good show, fans will not come.

The biggest problem for the Nationwide Series is the fans are slowly dissenegrating. The series has no identity. Sponsorship rights for the title of the series sold for half of what NASCAR wanted, and the fans are complaining more than ever about Nationwide Series races being boring. Now, I'm a long time racing fan, and the Nationwide Series used to be the most exciting series in NASCAR. Well, not anymore.

Yes, they want someone marketable, but they want a winner too. Mikey is about to loose napa and aarons. Now if you try to bring some of those sponsers you mentioned into cup, they aren't going to have to money to do it. Yea, kyle would have more fans if he wasn't an #######. I go to richmond twice every year too, and yes they say its sold out, but you can find quit a few empty seats around the track during the cup race and especially during the busch race. I have been to California speedway and i agree that track needs to loose a date. Half the fun at the track is the pre race stuff where everyone grills out and gets drunk and has a good old time.

Not all short tracks sell out, for instant martinsville, but that place is kind of out there in the middle of no where. I think you need to have action, but also a track in a good central location for fans to come too.

I think so far this year, the truck series has been the most exciting racing.

Originally Posted by AndyMarquisLIVE

Which is why Bruton Smith wants to take a date from Dover or Atlanta and move it to Kentucky, right?

He is adding alot of seats too the track, they would never of gotten a date with the seating capacity they have now.

[AndyMarquisLIVE (Premo)]

Originally Posted by Gtmustang88

He is adding alot of seats too the track, they would never of gotten a date with the seating capacity they have now.

Here, I'll fish away from the PR site and go somewhere you actually can go.

Kentucky Speedway - Seating Capacity: 66,089 ... Linky

Okay. Let's compare that to...

Darlington Raceway - Seating Capacity: 63,000

Homestead-Miami Motorsports Complex - Seating Capacity: 65,000

Martinsville Speedway - Seating Capacity: 65,000

Now, here's a few tracks that have more seats than Kentucky, but are fairly close to it in capacity.

Chicagoland Speedway - Seating Capacity: 75,000

Auto Club Speedway of Southern California - Seating Capacity: 92,000

I threw that one in there because they have a hard time selling half those seats.

Kansas Speedway - Seating Capacity: 81,687

This track did not sell out last year, with a Chase date.

Phoenix International Raceway - Seating Capacity: 76,800

Pocono Raceway - Seating Capacity: 76,812

Don't you hate those pesky little things called facts? Looks like those facts prove me right, again.