UNETHICAL policies. A review.

[Chestr]

Hello SOMD,

I've had a few raw deals in the past year and after my most recent adventure, I feel compelled to post here as an American consumer who believes in free commerce and ethical business practices and all the amazing freedom that they provide. I feel that it is my duty to reach out and pass on some free knowledge to the consumer so others may benefit from it.

So read on. It might even be interesting! I'd like to hope so.

My first Raw Deal happened when I and my 82 year old grandmother made appointments to BAYSHORE EYECARE for an eye exam. I made it very clear up front to BAYSHORE EYECARE that I would be needing an exam only because we intended to purchase eyeglasses online with our prescriptions. Before our appointment they were very agreeable and friendly. Little did I know that they had other ideas.

After my appointment and despite my objections, they still herded me into the showroom to try to show me a few overpriced models. I politely declined saying that I only wished to have my prescription from BAYSHORE EYECARE and I'd hit the road. They grudgingly agreed and gave me what appeared to be my prescription. I noticed some of the fields were blanked out and mentioned that I'd like them filled in before I left. After all, I had paid for it, right? That's when they became what I like to call "politely hostile." The woman (who's name I'll politely leave out of this review) calmly explained to me with slitted eyes that they could only give me "part" of my prescription because their insurance company forbade them from giving out the whole thing. When I asked why certain information (ON A PRESCRIPTION THAT I PAID FOR WITH MONEY) was left off I could literally feel the venom in her voice as she skillfully dodged and blocked every verbal attempt I made.

I have to admit that she was pretty damned good at it too. I'd have hired her!

I'm very calm when I'm getting screwed and I like to fight using information and the law Grandma said she was amazed that I never raised my voice after what that lady told me. But you could hear a pin drop in that place by the time she was through. I clearly had her uptight about something. I just didn't know what yet. That was the red flag that told me something wasn't right.

I drove home, somewhat defeated, and decided to do some research into the matter. I started out by looking up a few popular business insurance providers and questioning them. They all explained that they'd never heard of such a thing. I'm sure it's at least what the head honchos down at BAYSHORE EYECARE tell the staff to keep them quiet and happy. Then I found out on the internet that some eye doctors leave certain values off your prescription to prevent you from "shopping around." I think this idea took off to a larger degree with the ease of internet shopping.

Your run of the mill employee at BAYSHORE EYECARE probably doesn't know any better and it's not their fault. I didn't either until I did my homework and I hope you, the reader, do too.

It took a call to the Maryland Board of Ophthalmology and a few legal threats to finally get my full prescription and I never was able to get my grandmother's for her. The Maryland Board of Ophthalmology verified that this was indeed illegal and if they did not produce my records by written request, they may loose their license.

I feel that this is an unfair business practice and does not speak well for the reputation of BAYSHORE EYECARE. BAYSHORE EYECARE should not force it's customers to shop at their outlet by withholding information from a prescription that the customer bought and paid for.

A word of warning - if you'd like to get your prescription eyeglasses for $35 online from the same brands they sell at BAYSHORE EYECARE for $350 you're in for a fight.

Make sure and demand that they fill out all blocks on your prescription. Especially the value for Pupillary Distance. That's the one they like to leave off most.

Better yet, if you wish to get your prescription to shop around like a smart customer and save HUNDREDS on eyeglasses, don't get your eyes checked at BAYSHORE EYECARE. Swing in somewhere else where they'll be happy to do honest business with you.

As an aside, if you're interested in a list of reputable websites who sell eyeglasses DIRT CHEAP, write to chestr@bestmail.us and I'll hook you up. Yes - these are the exact same brands BAYSHORE EYECARE has for hundreds of dollars. Same brands and same lenses. Better service too. I won't just give you one website link, I'll give you a whole list.

I even checked them out with the BBB and RipoffReport. I've already done your homework for you

I ordered 2 pairs and some tinted ones for prescription sunglasses (so actually 3) and still came out ahead. As a matter of fact, I'm wearing them right now. Titanium memory anti-bend frames, UV protection, shock protection, the works. Tough crap, BAYSHORE EYECARE. You should have treated me like a free American.

 

[Chestr]

My second Raw Deal came at THE TACKLE BOX. If you want to buy or transfer a firearm and you need it to be shipped, the law requires you to have your firearms shipped through a Licensed Firearms Dealer with the proper certifications from the government. This leaves consumers with a limited (for SOMD it's VERY limited) set of options.

I called THE TACKLE BOX (since they're the only GUN DEALER within 50 miles) and asked them how I could go about getting some firearms shipped to the store. Hey, I'm a law abiding citizen, right? Damn right I am!

The man speaking for THE TACKLE BOX, who's name I'll politely leave out of this review, said that the official store policy was a little trickier than that. The man told me that THE TACKLE BOX would OUTRIGHT REFUSE a firearms transfer if the make and model could theoretically have been purchased at THE TACKLE BOX.

Yes, you heard that right. They'll try to FORCE you to buy your firearms from them, at whatever price they feel like charging. And while I'm at it, they do overcharge on firearms. In a fair business model, the AMERICAN thing to do is to competitively lower prices and increase quality of service to match your competition - NOT BLACKMAIL YOU INTO BUYING FROM THEM.

This is unhealthy for consumers and bad for the community. Did you hear that, THE TACKLE BOX? Your business policy is bad for the community.

If you gun owners want better priced firearms and more selection, don't shop at THE TACKLE BOX. Maybe that'll encourage them to rethink their current strategy or encourage some much needed competition in the local area.

There is a WHOLE WORLD OF FIREARMS on the internet at your disposal and YES there ARE ways to get them transferred here even though THE TACKLE BOX is trying to FORCEFULLY prevent it. Just write to me at chestr@bestmail.us and I'll give you a list of FFL certified gentlemen under the radar who would be more than happy to transfer your firearm for you at a reasonable price.

On the other hand, if you're a FFL certified person and you are interested in doing transfers, I can't stop you from posting below with your contact information and prices. Now is a good time to get your name out. Don't let the opportunity slip by. I feel that this thread is going to have a LOT of views.

I find this policy to be decidedly foul and definitely an unfair business practice.

Be warned! If you buy a firearm and need it shipped, you had better make sure you couldn't have purchased it from THE TACKLE BOX first or they WILL NOT ACCEPT THE TRANSFER! You had better be prepared to make other arrangements. These kinds of corporate railroading and blocking make me run the other way in a heartbeat. Something American in me makes me want to fight back. So that's what I'm doing now.

 

[Chestr]

I anticipate a massive flaming for this post. Therefore I feel it is necessary to establish my position preemptively in anticipation of attacks from loyal fans of these establishments. That having been said, my number one position is this - I have an opinion and you are allowed to have yours, so tough crap. Suck it up. Your negative comments will not only look suspicious but they will not make this comprehensive review dissapear either. Furthermore, facts don't lie. The ones I've listed here can be independently verified.

Now, I'm sure some of you will say you have had good experiences at these places. That's fine. But an unethical business practice is what it is. A snake is still a snake. Greed is still greed.

I'm sure some of you will say you have friends working at these places or know people who have friends there. That's fine. But an unethical business practice is what it is. It's that simple.

Defending your friends at these places is, in the end, bad for YOU and bad for the future of Southern Maryland. Take it how you will. That's fine by me. If you don't understand the big picture then too bad. I do. That's exactly what they're counting on. A smile on the face and a friendly attitude while they stab you in the back.

I'm sure some of you will say you'd do the same thing if you were in their shoes or that you DO. That's fine. But an unethical business practice is what it is.

I'm sure some of you will say that I'm complaining or slandering these businesses. Well, word of mouth is what keeps businesses alive. It's a powerful tool (afforded to us by the 1st Amendment and God bless the Bill of Rights!) that consumers CAN AND SHOULD use to protect themselves from businesses that should be avoided. I'm sorry people but that's how it works. Reputation is everything. The customer is always right, etc. Some businesses pride themselves on their reputation and some just want your money and will do anything to screw you and lie to you to get it. Used car salesmen come to mind here.

That having been said, I feel compelled to educate some of you on the methods and INTENT of free commerce. In this country we are free to purchase (or not purchase) goods and services from whoever we choose. The competition (theoretically) keeps cost down and demands greater standards in the interest of competitive business.

THIS IS GOOD FOR THE CONSUMER AND GREAT FOR ADVANCEMENTs IN SCIENCE AND TECHNOLOGY, EFFICIENCY IN MANUFACTURING, AND MANY OTHER AREAS!

When a business uses a method (whatever that method may be) to PREVENT or attempt to PREVENT a consumer from using other venues, this is unfair and it goes against the idea and intent of a free, competitive business structure. It's what the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA was founded on.

Just look at the electric company here. They're charging us out the ass for electricity. Why? Because there is NO COMPETITION. Any business practice that is aimed at cornering the consumer into a corral SHOULD BE AVOIDED.

HICKORY HILLS APPARTMENTs did the same thing when they cut off everyone's internet, television, and telephone lines and forced residents to either view the outside world through their paid service or not at all. From what I understand, it didn't work out too well for them either. The residents got MAD. REAL MAD. Many left. Thats free commerce at work. It's a beautiful thing when it works right and it's an aspect of this country that many of you abuse or take for granted! I love my country!

For example, imagine there were two businesses, one behind the other, who had signs up selling the same merchandise so you could see the signs from the road. If the business in the front built a wall across it's property specifically higher than the other businesses sign so as to intentionally hide the competing businesses sign from going motorists, this COULD BE considered and unfair business practice and SHOULD be met with hostility. If that was a little confusing, read it again.

Just remember this. When you're about to purchase something, the business you give your money to may not have the customer at heart. Once he has your money in his greedy little palms there's no telling what he may do. Also, if YOU, the customer, knowingly give him your money anyway, you are also part of the problem. You are a sheep. Businessmen LOVE sheep. They also love lazy people. If you are a sheep you should be ashamed.

It is my earnest hope that at least a few of you will read this and avoid the pitfalls I made and the research I did and avoid these places for another, more ethical place to give your money to.

If you work at either of these businesses or you shop there, and you learn that they have changed these policies, let me know and I will change this review accordingly to reflect it. Until then I hope you business owners figure out that this kind of thing hurts the community and eventually takes food off your plate too. With the power of the information superhighway, consumers are smarter than ever before. Treat us right, business owners, and we'll keep on coming back. In an area like this you can't afford to loose repeat business.

Lastly, for the lawyers, every word and punctuation in this review is a story about me and reflects my personal opinion and should be treated as such. I do not own, represent, or intend to own or represent competitive companies or services mentioned in this review.

If you've gotten this far, thanks for reading!

 

[blacklabman]

You might want to get your facts straight before you post excessively long threads.

The Tackle Box is not the only gun dealer within 50 miles. There is one in Great Mills, just to mention only one.

 

[BadGirl]

I had a very similar experience at Bayshore Eyecare. I'll never return there, either.

 

[aps45819]

I think that if I asked for my prescription and didn't receive it, I wouldn't pay them

 

[EmptyTimCup]

GunBroker.com has a list of FFL's ... who will do transfers


IIRC several are in "SOMD"



Gunbroker MD

 

[Baja28]

Very well written and informative posts.

As for the Tackle Box, they didn't blackmail anyone. I have no problem with them refusing to transfer a gun that you didn't buy from them. That's like taking a hot dog to McDonalds and asking them to cook it for you. I'd refuse too. It's their right.

 

[Merlin99]

I anticipate a massive flaming for this post. Therefore I feel it is necessary to establish my position preemptively in anticipation of attacks from loyal fans of these establishments. That having been said, my number one position is this - I have an opinion and you are allowed to have yours, so tough crap. Suck it up. Your negative comments will not only look suspicious but they will not make this comprehensive review dissapear either. Furthermore, facts don't lie. The ones I've listed here can be independently verified.

Contrary to some opinions I doubt you'll get flamed for this That being said I agree 100% with your first post, you paid for a service there's no excuse for them to not provide you with what you paid for. As for the second post, I don't see anything unethical about this, they told you ahead of time what their policy was.

 

[Aerogal]

Wouldn't wilfull withholding of patient personal medical information for profiteering fall under malpractice? If you go to an optometrist(sp?) for a prescription wouldn't that fall under that umbrella?
Don't know too much about gun transfers, but seems fair practice to refuse service since it's their business. You can chose not to do business there or not.
Different people have different ethics. American way.

 

[Chestr]

Very well written and informative posts.

As for the Tackle Box, they didn't blackmail anyone. I have no problem with them refusing to transfer a gun that you didn't buy from them. That's like taking a hot dog to McDonalds and asking them to cook it for you. I'd refuse too. It's their right.

No. YOU ARE RIGHT. It is their right to do so. They are well within their rights. Being "within legal limits" does not mean that is is NOT harmful or unethical. I believe their policy is against the spirit of free commerce and the American way. Sometimes just because something is within the law doesn't make it ETHICAL.

The intent of the policy is clear. To force the consumer to reject other sources as a choice and UNETHICALLY eliminate competition.

This becomes important because THE LAW REQUIRES AN FFL DEALER TO BE INVOLVED to ship a firearm. The LAW says I am 100% dependent upon the MERCY of dealers like THE TACKLE BOX and their store policy.

If the law said I could use my own means and had the FREEDOM to choose my route then it would not be unethical for them. However, they developed that policy because they KNOW we are at their mercy. That is what makes this policy an effect money making tactic.

Your hot dog analogy is sound and legal. You are 100% correct, sir. But it is just the same as taking my eyeglass prescription to another store to check out glasses in my most humble opinion. Furthermore it speaks VOLUMES about exactly how this business FEELS about their customers. The feeling I'm getting is not good. That is why they have the luxury to charge what they do for firearms. It is a perfect example of a failure of free commerce such as my example of the electric company (above) only it is forced upon the customer by store policy WHICH AIN'T COOL IN MY BOOK.

They should instead RAISE THE BAR on prices and service. This is the benefit of the progressive nature of free commerce in a society that includes freedom of choice. We're not shopping at Hugo Chavez store here. We're Americans. It's too bad THE TACKLE BOX doesn't treat us like we are.

To be 100% clear as mud here, I am not talking bad about their employees. I'm talking about whoever came up with that policy and whoever has the pocket the money is going into. In my mind, he is a crook.

Do you see what I'm saying?

Wouldn't wilfull withholding of patient personal medical information for profiteering fall under malpractice? If you go to an optometrist(sp?) for a prescription wouldn't that fall under that umbrella?

You are correct. 100%. Up above I did mention a call to the ophthalmology board and legal action. This is the means I had to use to get my full prescription in order to shop around like a real American. I told them (in writing)that it was illegal to withhold my patient medical records and gave them twenty some days to mail them to me.

My point is that it shouldn't be that way for customers to be treated within the INTENT of the law.

You do not have to bring your high powered attorney squad to Wal-Mart to make the lady at the cash register give you your change back. It is implied that Businesses like BAYSHORE EYECARE will obey the law and the intent for which it was written.

At first, to my face, BAYSHORE EYECARE refused to accept my written request. The poisonous lady wouldn't even touch it with her hands. After that I told them that it served as their legal notice and I would leave it on the desk anyways and that the choice to comply or ignore it would be theirs. Thirty some days later, I got my records in a stamped self addressed envelope! JUSTICE!

I believe that the ophthalmology board may also have had a hand in helping. But I will never know for sure. I can tell you that they are now aware of suspicious activities from BAYSHORE EYECARE and I'm sure that doesn't bode well for whoever owns the business.

+1 win for the customer, wouldn't you say?

You might want to get your facts straight before you post excessively long threads.

First, this is a small peanut that you proudly "nailed" me on compared to the overwhelming majority of the topic of my thread.

I do have my facts straight.

Second, and I'm not trying to start a flame war or pick on you but that guy on Great Mills road is only open a few hours a week and is hard to get a hold of. It is my understanding that he works part time. He has nowhere near the volume or publicity of THE TACKLE BOX nor does he intend to. I am not knocking him in any way either. The common, unarmed (in the knowledge sense) shopper or consumer wouldn't even know that he existed.

Again, no offense blacklabman

 

[preselector]

IRT Bayshore Eyecare, I won't disagree with your assessment but, in their defense, a number of eyeglass providers including Walmart make the Pupillary Distance(PD) measurement as part of the fitting/sales process and don't routinely include the PD on the prescription. Many internet providers provide instructions on measuring PD. All you need is a ruler in millimeters and a mirror. Not a big deal.

IRT The Tackle Box, unethical (althought a handling fee would be reasonable) and maybe illegal. Try alerting the NRA. I doubt our elected representatives would be sympathetic.

 

[Chestr]

IRT Bayshore Eyecare, I won't disagree with your assessment but, in their defense, a number of eyeglass providers including Walmart make the Pupillary Distance(PD) measurement as part of the fitting/sales process and don't routinely include the PD on the prescription. Many internet providers provide instructions on measuring PD. All you need is a ruler in millimeters and a mirror. Not a big deal.

IRT The Tackle Box, unethical (althought a handling fee would be reasonable) and maybe illegal. Try alerting the NRA. I doubt our elected representatives would be sympathetic.

These statements about BAYSHORE EYECARE are very true. However unethical is unethical. The line in the sand is drawn by the law and whether it is a "big deal" or not to the consumer, it is still unethical. It would have been a HUGE DEAL for my 82 year old grandmother had I not been there to protect her rights. No offense intended toward your comment.

And as for THE TACKLE BOX, I'm leaning toward the fact that their policy is perfectly legal. Greedy? Yes. Unethical? Yes. Specifically against the law? Probably not.

UPDATE: I'm not a lawyer but your comment intrigued me. I looked it up and from my unprofessional standpoint THE TACKLE BOX company policy is perfectly described under a term called "BARRIER TO ENTRY." In layman's terms, it is a deliberate attempt to block a competitor from entering a certain market, IE: Southern Maryland. So yes IT IS MY OPINION ONLY that their official policy is clearly on the "illegal" side of the line of the law.

Is it in the customer's best interests? ABSOLUTELY NOT.

I hope both businesses read this at some point or are alerted and strive for a higher standard.

I would like to see them make a pledge to uphold the customer's rights and take the customer's interests at heart. I am inviting them to do so here in public view for all to see.

If they did, I would consider shopping there again and I'm sure so would many of you.

Reality says they probably already have read this and just don't give a damn.

 

[aps45819]

And as for THE TACKLE BOX, I'm leaning toward the fact that their policy is perfectly legal. Greedy? Yes. Unethical? Yes. Specifically against the law? Probably not.

UPDATE: I'm not a lawyer but your comment intrigued me. I looked it up and from my unprofessional standpoint THE TACKLE BOX company policy is perfectly described under a term called "BARRIER TO ENTRY." In layman's terms, it is a deliberate attempt to block a competitor from entering a certain market, IE: Southern Maryland. So yes IT IS MY OPINION ONLY that their official policy is clearly on the "illegal" side of the line of the law.

If you don't like their policy, why don't you get you own FFL license?

 

[Pushrod]

For FFL transfers, there is also Accurate Guns and Ammo in Loveville and Southern Maryland Firearms on St. Andrews Church Road. I understand why Tackle Box is doing what they are doing, it is no big deal to me. They will just loose my money on Transfer fees and some other FFL or shop will get it, so it is the Tackle Box's loss in the end.

 

[Baja28]

The intent of the policy is clear. To force the consumer to reject other sources as a choice and UNETHICALLY eliminate competition. You are not being "forced" to use the Tackle Box. As mentioned in this thread, there are other dealers within a 15 minute drive.

If the law said I could use my own means and had the FREEDOM to choose my route then it would not be unethical for them. See above, you do have the freedom.

They should instead RAISE THE BAR on prices and service. This is the benefit of the progressive nature of free commerce in a society that includes freedom of choice. You do have the freedom of choice. Go somewhere else and have the guns transfered.

Do you see what I'm saying? Not at all. I'm beginning to think you are too lazy to look around.

Second, and I'm not trying to start a flame war or pick on you but that guy on Great Mills road is only open a few hours a week and is hard to get a hold of. It is my understanding that he works part time. He has nowhere near the volume or publicity of THE TACKLE BOX nor does he intend to. I am not knocking him in any way either. The common, unarmed (in the knowledge sense) shopper or consumer wouldn't even know that he existed.
This is why I think you're lazy. Look harder. Do a google search for gun dealers in southern, MD then spend an hour on the phone talking to them..

UPDATE: I'm not a lawyer but your comment intrigued me. I looked it up and from my unprofessional standpoint THE TACKLE BOX company policy is perfectly described under a term called "BARRIER TO ENTRY." In layman's terms, it is a deliberate attempt to block a competitor from entering a certain market, IE: Southern Maryland. So yes IT IS MY OPINION ONLY that their official policy is clearly on the "illegal" side of the line of the law. And your opinion is wrong. There is no barrier anywhere. No one is blocking anyone from anything. You have several gun dealer choices all within an hours drive. You just won't research it and I'm not going to do it for you.

So according to you, the Toyota dealer in California is blocking other Toyota dealers and blocking you from your freedom of choice and that is an absolutely absurd idea.

 

[SG_Player1974]

I am not in any way familiar with gun shipping or the likes however, I find it hard to believe that if an establishment has filed, been approved for, and received the license to ship firearms that there is no where in that licensing agreement that states "You may refuse to ship or accept shipment of a firearm as long as you sell such firearm."
I would think that being it is a Federal license that there are stipulations and rules that need to be followed up to and including the services that MUST be provided.
Just seems to me that somewhere in that license it would say that an approved agent CANNOT refuse a transfer as long as the guidelines have been followed and ALL laws/rules have been adhered to.

 

[Merlin99]

I am not in any way familiar with gun shipping or the likes however, I find it hard to believe that if an establishment has filed, been approved for, and received the license to ship firearms that there is no where in that licensing agreement that states "You may refuse to ship or accept shipment of a firearm as long as you sell such firearm."
I would think that being it is a Federal license that there are stipulations and rules that need to be followed up to and including the services that MUST be provided.
Just seems to me that somewhere in that license it would say that an approved agent CANNOT refuse a transfer as long as the guidelines have been followed and ALL laws/rules have been adhered to.

So you are of the opinion that a government agency should be allowed to tell a private individual how they should run a business? Why? Do you think it's a good idea to tell shoppers what to sell? how about a doctor what procedures he must perform?

 

[Baja28]

So you are of the opinion that a government agency should be allowed to tell a private individual how they should run a business? Why? Do you think it's a good idea to tell shoppers what to sell? how about a doctor what procedures he must perform?

Damn, you and I think a lot alike on many things... scary.

 

[Baja28]

I am not in any way familiar with gun shipping or the likes however, I find it hard to believe that if an establishment has filed, been approved for, and received the license to ship firearms that there is no where in that licensing agreement that states "You may refuse to ship or accept shipment of a firearm as long as you sell such firearm."
I would think that being it is a Federal license that there are stipulations and rules that need to be followed up to and including the services that MUST be provided.
Just seems to me that somewhere in that license it would say that an approved agent CANNOT refuse a transfer as long as the guidelines have been followed and ALL laws/rules have been adhered to.

• So you think you can take your muffler to Meineke or Midas and they have to install it?
• So you think you can take your hamburger to Wendys and they have to cook it?
• So you think you can take your dough and ingredients to Domino's and they have to make you a pizza?