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Thread: Freddie Gray/Charges

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Homesick View Post
    Disagree. She was hard to listen to. I do not trust her..she has an axe to grind towards officers because she blames them for the loss of a family member.

    She also has ties with the Gray family...more will come out about this..
    I guess its' only you and I who are uncomfortable about this presser.

    I heard her say" I heard your call for Justice and I am going to prosecute 6 officers to get your peace."

    If I were the defense attorney I would play this speech in the trial.

    She should have just stated the charges and not gone into soothing the angry citizens. Her statement was almost as dumb as the one the Mayor said when she gave them room to destroy.

    Mean while if I were a Baltimore Police Officer, I would be sending my resume' to other police Departments looking for a job, anything to get out of Baltimore.
    Last edited by Hijinx; 05-01-2015 at 01:04 PM.

  2. #22
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    I hope the bus was properly inspected before the officers were thrown under it.

  3. #23
    Registered User Midnightrider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by b23hqb View Post
    They threw the book at the cops. Anything they could possibly think of.There is no way they will be tried on anywhere near all those charges. Will the rabble allow the process to carry out, or demand lynching right now?

    Has anybody seen pictures of the cops yet, i.e., racial breakdown? Should be interesting.
    why would that matter? at least one of the cops is alledged to be black. So what, no one has said Gray was killed because he was black, not that i have heard anyway

    Quote Originally Posted by Hijinx View Post
    I guess its' only you and I who are uncomfortable about this presser.

    I heard her say" I heard your call for Justice and I am going to prosecute 6 officers to get your peace."

    If I were the defense attorney I would play this speech in the trial.

    She should have just stated the charges and not gone into soothing the angry citizens. Her statement was almost as dumb as the one the Mayor said when she gave them room to destroy.

    Mean while if I were a Baltimore Police Officer, I would be sending my resume' to other police Departments looking for a job, anything to get out of Baltimore.
    now its your turn to have faith in the justice system. The DA brought these charges based on the facts as presented by the police. Just because you dont like the result you are claiming some sort of unfairness, just like you all claimed the protestors would if they didn't get a result they like.....
    "once in a while you can get shown the light in the strangest of places if you look at it right"-TGD

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Inkd View Post
    I hope the bus was properly inspected before the officers were thrown under it.
    If those officers are simply being scapegoated....then what caused the death of one Freddie Gray? Why are tales of "rough riding" people put in the back of those vans so prevalent?

    I'm seeing plenty of indications that this could be an all-too-common case of "routine rough 'em up..ha ha ha " gone horribly awry. I hope it all comes out eventually and we'll see.
    You can't be a real country unless you have a beer and an airline. It helps if you have some kind of a football team, or some nuclear weapons, but at the very least you need a beer. -Frank Zappa

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Homesick View Post
    Disagree. She was hard to listen to.
    In what what way was she hard to listen to? She was direct and to the point and the things she said made sense. She was articulate. She didn't indulge hyperbole or (misplace in this context) emotional rhetoric. She gave a straightforward account of the situation and what was happening. She didn't overstate things and made clear, e.g., that this wasn't an indictment of all Baltimore police officers. She made clear that, even though the information they currently have justified the filling of charges, the officers involved are innocent until proven guilty. She appealed to the community to, for lack of a better term, behave itself. She basically said, we in government are doing our job - we are going to get justice, whatever that is; this isn't going to be swept under the rug and be forgotten about; government actors will be held accountable to the extent they have behaved illegally - so you need to do your part and maintain the peace. I thought she hit all the points that needed to be hit and little else. Her tone was exactly what it should have been.

    Do you just think it's wrong that they officers were charged or that they were charged with certain things? I don't know enough to know for sure that all of the charges are justified, but I also don't have a basis to assert that any of them aren't. Do you?

    Quote Originally Posted by Homesick View Post
    I do not trust her..she has an axe to grind towards officers because she blames them for the loss of a family member.

    She also has ties with the Gray family...more will come out about this..
    I don't know anything about those issues, but they don't have much to do with what I said. I was commenting on what she said today and how she said it, that was the first time I'd heard from (or about) her.

    That said, I guess my gut reaction to such suggestions is... so the smear campaign against her has already started? I have no idea if those particular suggestions have merit, but quite often people can find ties between parties involved in these kinds of things, that's the nature of life. The issue is, is she right about charges being justified? Do you have reason to believe she was outright lying about what the investigation had revealed?

    So much that's happened in this situation screams of some police officers knowing that they did wrong - that they ####ed up royally and there's a good chance they aren't going to get away with it - and trying to cover up or distract from that reality. The notion that she's biased and only doing this because she has an axe to grind. The leaking of that horse#### search warrant application, but not leaking any documents which might tend to implicate the officers. The switchblade BS. The not initially reporting one of the stops. I mean, we don't have all the facts yet of course - but this is one of those situations where having a decent sense of smell gives pretty strong indication of what likely happened. One basic narrative makes sense, it rings true; the other, well it doesn't pass the smell test. Sometimes a good sense of smell is as helpful as being able to carefully and logically work through all the facts. We'll see what further facts come out, and I wouldn't be ready to convict these officers if I was in a court of law, but from what we do know there's good reason to think they behaved atrociously and illegally. It's pretty hard to explain this situation in a way that doesn't include, at a minimum, malfeasance on the part of some officers.
    Nearly all success in electoral politics boils down to convincing people that you recognize that they are not the problem, that someone or something else is.

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by PsyOps View Post
    And this comment from her sort of eludes to this:


    She shouldn't be responding to 'no justice, no peace' from people that don't have any shred of facts. She should answering to the facts.
    What was wrong with that statement? She methodically walked through what (the investigation revealed) happened and what charges were being filed, as well as what this all did or didn't mean. Then, I thought, she hit the rhetorical nail on the head with that statement. She was telling the people of Baltimore (or whoever else might be involved) that they needed to behave themselves. She was saying, we - the government - are doing and going to do our job, you - the people - need to hold up your end of the bargain. We are going to get justice, whatever that is - and she had already indicated that the officers were innocent until proven guilty - so you need to maintain peace. I thought that line, that turn of phrase, was nearly perfectly crafted. It said what needed to be said, and it did so in a very simple way that is hard to argue with. You said no justice no peace, and your government heard you and is working to effectuate justice, so you owe peace in return - that was the deal you offered.
    Nearly all success in electoral politics boils down to convincing people that you recognize that they are not the problem, that someone or something else is.

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by b23hqb View Post
    They threw the book at the cops. Anything they could possibly think of.There is no way they will be tried on anywhere near all those charges. Will the rabble allow the process to carry out, or demand lynching right now?

    Has anybody seen pictures of the cops yet, i.e., racial breakdown? Should be interesting.
    That's what prosecutors often do. They charge all kinds of things - some that might be difficult to make out; it's the plus the kitchen sink strategy. Later they can negotiate down from that heap of threats or take them to trial and see which ones a jury will bite on. It's one of the unseemly aspects of how we tend to enforce our laws.
    Nearly all success in electoral politics boils down to convincing people that you recognize that they are not the problem, that someone or something else is.

  8. #28
    Oldtimer Ken King's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tilted View Post
    That's what prosecutors often do. They charge all kinds of things - some that might be difficult to make out; it's the plus the kitchen sink strategy. Later they can negotiate down from that heap of threats or take them to trial and see which ones a jury will bite on. It's one of the unseemly aspects of how we tend to enforce our laws.
    And gives room to plea them out to a lesser charge or to get them to flip on one of the others.

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Gilligan View Post
    If those officers are simply being scapegoated....then what caused the death of one Freddie Gray? Why are tales of "rough riding" people put in the back of those vans so prevalent?

    I'm seeing plenty of indications that this could be an all-too-common case of "routine rough 'em up..ha ha ha " gone horribly awry. I hope it all comes out eventually and we'll see.
    Yeah, we can't know yet what exactly did happen. But it's hard to explain this situation without at least some small bit of misbehavior on the part of some officers. There's some kind of malfeasance here, it's just a question of how much - how bad. Was it intentional? Was it careless? Was it carelessness motivated by ill will? Was it routinely accepted carelessness? From what the State's Attorney said about what the investigation has revealed, it seems as though it's likely more than just minor - perhaps somewhat excusable - bad behavior. Time, and more details coming out, will hopefully tell.
    Nearly all success in electoral politics boils down to convincing people that you recognize that they are not the problem, that someone or something else is.

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilligan View Post
    If those officers are simply being scapegoated....then what caused the death of one Freddie Gray? Why are tales of "rough riding" people put in the back of those vans so prevalent?

    I'm seeing plenty of indications that this could be an all-too-common case of "routine rough 'em up..ha ha ha " gone horribly awry. I hope it all comes out eventually and we'll see.
    Since I've posted I have read a couple of other articles that have a bit more information, not much, than what I have already read. It seems they are saying that a protruding bolt may have cause an injury to his head, should be easy to figure that out. Also, apparently the individual that was in the wagon was interviewed and he said that Gray was not throwing himself around in the wagon, just kicking and thrashing a bit.

    Do the "rough rides" happen? Probably so. Was this the case, who knows? Since there was another person in the back of the wagon that should shed some light on at least part of the ride. If he says that Gray was moving around, at least after he got put in the van, would that mean his spine was still intact?

    I would be much more comfortable with these charges if the city was not burning and if the Prosecutor did not make comments on race in her speech. If the determination is made that the cops did in fact cause the injury, then they should go down for it.

    I have no real basis for feeling the way I do and usually try to be more objective. But, in this case I'm going to go a bit sideways and say that to me it feels like they were thrown under the bus to appease the animals and keep the city from burning any further.

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