Exodus 33 Leave before I do something

[seekeroftruth]

Exodus 33:1 Then the Lord said to Moses, “Leave this place, you and the people you brought up out of Egypt, and go up to the land I promised on oath to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, saying, ‘I will give it to your descendants.’ 2 I will send an angel before you and drive out the Canaanites, Amorites, Hittites, Perizzites, Hivites and Jebusites. 3 Go up to the land flowing with milk and honey. But I will not go with you, because you are a stiff-necked people and I might destroy you on the way.”

4 When the people heard these distressing words, they began to mourn and no one put on any ornaments. 5 For the Lord had said to Moses, “Tell the Israelites, ‘You are a stiff-necked people. If I were to go with you even for a moment, I might destroy you. Now take off your ornaments and I will decide what to do with you.’” 6 So the Israelites stripped off their ornaments at Mount Horeb.​

This is from the easy English commentary.

The LORD would do what he had promised to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. He would lead their people to the country, where there was plenty of food. He would remove all the groups of people who lived in the country already. But the Israelites were such proud people, and often they refused to obey God. So actually, he would not be present with them along the way.

The Israelites removed their precious gold rings and other things. They did that as a sign that they realised their sin. When people were sad, they did not wear those things for a time. But that became a permanent rule in Israel. They must remember that they had given the gold rings from their ears to Aaron. And he had used them wrongly to make the gold image. Now they gave all their precious things to Moses in order to make God’s special tent and its contents (Exodus 35:22).​

The loss of 3000 souls was horrible. That slaughter wasn't ordered by God. That slaughter was ordered by Moses.

God didn't want to loose it. Sodom and Gomorrah are perfect examples of what happens when God looses it. The flood is a perfect example of what happens when God decides humans are just horrible horrible creations.

The last thing they needed was the sparkle of gold to remind them of the calf.

So it's logical that they should take off the sparkling reminders and get on the way.

We've seen how people felt about idols. Remember, back in Genesis 31, Rachel [Jacob's wife] took her father's idols. Laban [Rachel's father] tracked them down and confronted Jacob because they were stolen from him.

Nothing is supposed to be more important than God. Nothing.... Remember, God created everything and everybody.... so God is bigger and badder than everything and everybody.... nothing is more important than God.

 

[ProximaCentauri]

Quite unfortunate isn't it... that the ‘one true god’ and ‘creator of the universe’ displays the most vile of all human emotions…anger, viciousness, vindictiveness…and even worse, is unable to control these emotions. A god out of control with rage.

If you were to exhibit these emotions in an uncontrollable manner resulting in murder, you would likely be found to be a homicidal psychopath.

HC, this should be a clear indication that this god Yaweh was made in the image of man. In the image of men that led the violent nomadic tribes of the ancient Israelites.

Killing in the name of this god, would of course be used for control of this, difficult to control, bronze-age tribal society. Societal control is the primary motivation for the formation of laws. The ten commandments and the many other tribal laws you've been 'studying' here are prime examples...

Laws laid down by a mythical god. A violent, homicidal god, not fully in control of his emotions. The tribe could understand this as they were violent. What better way to control them?

 

[seekeroftruth]

Quite unfortunate isn't it... that the ‘one true god’ and ‘creator of the universe’ displays the most vile of all human emotions…anger, viciousness, vindictiveness…and even worse, is unable to control these emotions. A god out of control with rage.

If you were to exhibit these emotions in an uncontrollable manner resulting in murder, you would likely be found to be a homicidal psychopath.

HC, this should be a clear indication that this god Yaweh was made in the image of man. In the image of men that led the violent nomadic tribes of the ancient Israelites.

Killing in the name of this god, would of course be used for control of this, difficult to control, bronze-age tribal society. Societal control is the primary motivation for the formation of laws. The ten commandments and the many other tribal laws you've been 'studying' here are prime examples...

Laws laid down by a mythical god. A violent, homicidal god, not fully in control of his emotions. The tribe could understand this as they were violent. What better way to control them?

Actually, ProximaCentauri, you have proven the Bible to be true!

Genesis 1:27 So God created mankind in his own image,
in the image of God he created them;
male and female he created them.​

Yes, I do serve the one and only True God.

Yes, He can wipe out cities with a swipe of His mighty hand.

Yes, He does control His anger.

Even though He can be angered, even though He can wipe us out, He has a gentle kind spirit as well.

When He sent His Son to earth, He didn't send His Son as a Warrior..... He sent Him as a Healer who fed the hungry and healed the sick.

One of the reasons we are still debating all this is because the Jews wanted a Warrior King to ascend and instead Christ was born in a manger and taught peace and love.

God has a plan for our eternal life. His Son taught extensively about it.

His Son will come again, only this time he will ascend as a Warrior King and He'll make our attempts at war look like child's play.​

Is that the point you are trying to make?

 

[ProximaCentauri]

Actually, ProximaCentauri, you have proven the Bible to be true!

Genesis 1:27 So God created mankind in his own image,
in the image of God he created them;
male and female he created them.​

Yes, I do serve the one and only True God.

Yes, He can wipe out cities with a swipe of His mighty hand.

Yes, He does control His anger.

Even though He can be angered, even though He can wipe us out, He has a gentle kind spirit as well.

When He sent His Son to earth, He didn't send His Son as a Warrior..... He sent Him as a Healer who fed the hungry and healed the sick.

One of the reasons we are still debating all this is because the Jews wanted a Warrior King to ascend and instead Christ was born in a manger and taught peace and love.

God has a plan for our eternal life. His Son taught extensively about it.

His Son will come again, only this time he will ascend as a Warrior King and He'll make our attempts at war look like child's play.​

Is that the point you are trying to make?

HC, obviously your reading comprehension leaves something to be desired. Your dogma induced haze distorts what you see on the page to make it fit with your alternate reality.

You’re so proud of your out-of-control cruel, sadistic, and megalomaniacal god…just as the Muslims are of theirs. You do realize it’s the same god...

Essentially, Allah is the Muslim version of Yahweh. Of course, the Muslims do not believe in Jesus's divinity and they are just as certain in their beliefs as you are in yours, even though not a shred of evidence exists for either. Sorry to break it to you, but the writings of barbarous desert tribes in the middle east does not qualify as evidence.

Yes enjoy your god, your maniacal bully of a deity. But just realize you and your prototypical Muslim sister have much in common. You both devote yourself to a violent god. You both boast about his power. You both are intolerant of each other's beliefs. You both believe the other is going to 'hell'. As women, you are both marginalized by your respective misogynistic religions. And you both perpetuate your irrational belief systems, by teaching them to your children.

 

[littlelady]

HC, obviously your reading comprehension leaves something to be desired. Your dogma induced haze distorts what you see on the page to make it fit with your alternate reality.

You’re so proud of your out-of-control cruel, sadistic, and megalomaniacal god…just as the Muslims are of theirs. You do realize it’s the same god...

Essentially, Allah is the Muslim version of Yahweh. Of course, the Muslims do not believe in Jesus's divinity and they are just as certain in their beliefs as you are in yours, even though not a shred of evidence exists for either. Sorry to break it to you, but the writings of barbarous desert tribes in the middle east does not qualify as evidence.

Yes enjoy your god, your maniacal bully of a deity. But just realize you and your prototypical Muslim sister have much in common. You both devote yourself to a violent god. You both boast about his power. You both are intolerant of each other's beliefs. You both believe the other is going to 'hell'. As women, you are both marginalized by your respective misogynistic religions. And you both perpetuate your irrational belief systems, by teaching them to your children.

Good grief! You seem to have no tolerance, at all. So, where do you get off? What gets you through your life? Believing only in yourself? First of all, you have no reason to be involved in religion. Your posts say that you don't believe in anything, really. Second of all, seeker has been battling cancer for years, but chooses to still believe in God. You really are a snot, and have no business commenting in a Bible study. You should start your own thread. I know seeker personally, and she is wonderful. Leave her alone, and let her continue to enlighten forum members every day. God bless and keep you if you are so lucky. Are you secretly a radical Muslim infiltrating our midst? Just wondering.

One more thing. What is your alternative to believing? You haven't mentioned that. And what kind of sense did this part of your post make?

'Yes enjoy your god, your maniacal bully of a deity. But just realize you and your prototypical Muslim sister have much in common. You both devote yourself to a violent god. You both boast about his power. You both are intolerant of each other's beliefs. You both believe the other is going to 'hell'. As women, you are both marginalized by your respective misogynistic religions. And you both perpetuate your irrational belief systems, by teaching them to your children'

First of all, Christians don't kill their offspring (after they are born) or anyone that doesn't conform to their beliefs. Second of all, women are not marginalized in the US. Third of all, whose irrational beliefs are you talking about? You are really off the hook. Seek help. Again, God bless you.

 

[seekeroftruth]

HC, obviously your reading comprehension leaves something to be desired. Your dogma induced haze distorts what you see on the page to make it fit with your alternate reality.

That might be so. If I'm wrong.... well I had a better life because I believe. If I'm right.... I go to Heaven and have the opportunity to sit beside a translucent river in true peace. What have I lost?

You’re so proud of your out-of-control cruel, sadistic, and megalomaniacal god…just as the Muslims are of theirs. You do realize it’s the same god...

Actually the One True God is in control. Everything is on His timeline. If God weren't in control, anyone who spoke against Him would not utter another word.

Essentially, Allah is the Muslim version of Yahweh. Of course, the Muslims do not believe in Jesus's divinity and they are just as certain in their beliefs as you are in yours, even though not a shred of evidence exists for either. Sorry to break it to you, but the writings of barbarous desert tribes in the middle east does not qualify as evidence.

I'm not so sure that my God is the same as Allah. I've tried to google it many times. I know people who believed the results found on wikipedia concerning the truthfullness of the presidential candidates. If I were to use the same source, they are not the same. There are compelling discussions on both sides of that question.

The difference in my life is Jesus the Messiah.

Yes enjoy your god, your maniacal bully of a deity. But just realize you and your prototypical Muslim sister have much in common. You both devote yourself to a violent god. You both boast about his power. You both are intolerant of each other's beliefs. You both believe the other is going to 'hell'. As women, you are both marginalized by your respective misogynistic religions. And you both perpetuate your irrational belief systems, by teaching them to your children.

There are women all over this world who don't enjoy the good life I have. My heart goes out to them. I actually lived through hell myself. My mother was an abusive woman. She told the ER doctors that my bruised and battered baby brother fell down the stairs, we lived in a home with no steps, let alone stairs. When I went to the teachers about it, they told my mother what I had confided and sent me home with her to suffer the consequences. The only way I made it through was my faith in Christ. I was homeless with three kids and no family to turn to. The only way I made it through was my faith in Christ. My children were kidnapped during a routine visitation with their father. The only way I made it through was my faith in Christ. Getting through cancer has been a piece of cake compared to other trials in my life. These are only a couple of the trials in my life. Without the hope offered in the Bible, I would never have made it. Without the love of Jesus the Messiah to attempt to emulate I wouldn't have had anything to depend on and work toward.

I'm not here to change your vision ProximaCentauri. This forum isn't here to convert you. My Bible study is not meant to change anyone. It's a way for me to journal my study. It's an open forum that keeps me in the Word. It's an open forum where others can follow along if they so choose. This is always the first site I go to when I turn my computer on in the morning.

I appreciate it when someone like you comes along.... it reminds me where I would be without the Word. Hang in there....

 

[littlelady]

The difference in my life is Jesus the Messiah.

There are women all over this world who don't enjoy the good life I have. My heart goes out to them. I actually lived through hell myself. My mother was an abusive woman. She told the ER doctors that my bruised and battered baby brother fell down the stairs, we lived in a home with no steps, let alone stairs. When I went to the teachers about it, they told my mother what I had confided and sent me home with her to suffer the consequences. The only way I made it through was my faith in Christ. I was homeless with three kids and no family to turn to. The only way I made it through was my faith in Christ. My children were kidnapped during a routine visitation with their father. The only way I made it through was my faith in Christ. Getting through cancer has been a piece of cake compared to other trials in my life. These are only a couple of the trials in my life. Without the hope offered in the Bible, I would never have made it. Without the love of Jesus the Messiah to attempt to emulate I wouldn't have had anything to depend on and work toward.

 

[ProximaCentauri]

That might be so. If I'm wrong.... well I had a better life because I believe. If I'm right.... I go to Heaven and have the opportunity to sit beside a translucent river in true peace. What have I lost?

You will have lost your chance to have lived a decent life motivated simply by the willingness to help others. Your legacy instead, will be that you espoused an intolerant belief system. One that’s harmful, not helpful to humanity.

I'm not so sure that my God is the same as Allah. I've tried to google it many times. I know people who believed the results found on wikipedia concerning the truthfullness of the presidential candidates. If I were to use the same source, they are not the same. There are compelling discussions on both sides of that question.

You owe it to yourself to be more studied when it comes to other religions, especially Islam and Judaism - the other two Abrahamic religions. A study of all the major world religions - at least to a working knowledge level - would not hurt.

The difference in my life is Jesus the Messiah.

The meek and mild jesus who believes in torture....so does Trump...hmmm. The only difference being jesus's torture is perpetual. Guess you couldn't expect him to let an earthly tyrant outdo him. Personally, I think you can find better deities and humans to emulate.

There are women all over this world who don't enjoy the good life I have. My heart goes out to them. I actually lived through hell myself. My mother was an abusive woman. She told the ER doctors that my bruised and battered baby brother fell down the stairs, we lived in a home with no steps, let alone stairs. When I went to the teachers about it, they told my mother what I had confided and sent me home with her to suffer the consequences. The only way I made it through was my faith in Christ. I was homeless with three kids and no family to turn to. The only way I made it through was my faith in Christ. My children were kidnapped during a routine visitation with their father. The only way I made it through was my faith in Christ. Getting through cancer has been a piece of cake compared to other trials in my life. These are only a couple of the trials in my life. Without the hope offered in the Bible, I would never have made it. Without the love of Jesus the Messiah to attempt to emulate I wouldn't have had anything to depend on and work toward.

I appreciate you sharing that and I’m sorry you had to endure it. Just know that people have endured worse, without the need for dependency on a religious belief system or a mythical deity. Desperate people will often cling to the dominant religion of their culture or the religion they were taught as a child. Had you been born a Muslim, you would have found solace in the Qur'an and Allah.

I'm not here to change your vision ProximaCentauri. This forum isn't here to convert you. My Bible study is not meant to change anyone. It's a way for me to journal my study. It's an open forum that keeps me in the Word. It's an open forum where others can follow along if they so choose. This is always the first site I go to when I turn my computer on in the morning.

HC, perpetrating intolerant belief systems help no one. Humanity needs tolerant secular beliefs, not intolerant religious beliefs that always result in more human suffering. You're right, it's an open forum, not a private bible study so you should expect replies to your OPs

I appreciate it when someone like you comes along.... it reminds me where I would be without the Word. Hang in there....

Happy to oblige. And I’m reminded of why Gandhi said “I like your Christ, I don’t like your Christians.” Don’t worry about me HC, I’ll be just fine. Worry about yourself. I think you would agree that false beliefs do no one any good. They can hurt you and others in a multitude of ways. You unwittingly hurt people by espousing a belief system that is intolerant and violent at its core.

 

[littlelady]

You will have lost your chance to have lived a decent life motivated simply by the willingness to help others. Your legacy instead, will be that you espoused an intolerant belief system. One that’s harmful, not helpful to humanity.



You owe it to yourself to be more studied when it comes to other religions, especially Islam and Judaism - the other two Abrahamic religions. A study of all the major world religions - at least to a working knowledge level - would not hurt.



The meek and mild jesus who believes in torture....so does Trump...hmmm. The only difference being jesus's torture is perpetual. Guess you couldn't expect him to let an earthly tyrant outdo him. Personally, I think you can find better deities and humans to emulate.



I appreciate you sharing that and I’m sorry you had to endure it. Just know that people have endured worse, without the need for dependency on a religious belief system or a mythical deity. Desperate people will often cling to the dominant religion of their culture or the religion they were taught as a child. Had you been born a Muslim, you would have found solace in the Qur'an and Allah.



HC, perpetrating intolerant belief systems help no one. Humanity needs tolerant secular beliefs, not intolerant religious beliefs that always result in more human suffering. You're right, it's an open forum, not a private bible study so you should expect replies to your OPs



Happy to oblige. And I’m reminded of why Gandhi said “I like your Christ, I don’t like your Christians.” Don’t worry about me HC, I’ll be just fine. Worry about yourself. I think you would agree that false beliefs do no one any good. They can hurt you and others in a multitude of ways. You unwittingly hurt people by espousing a belief system that is intolerant and violent at its core.

Are you THE_GOVERNOR? Or related? You seem very similar. Just wondering.

 

[This_person]

You will have lost your chance to have lived a decent life motivated simply by the willingness to help others. Your legacy instead, will be that you espoused an intolerant belief system. One that’s harmful, not helpful to humanity.

You owe it to yourself to be more studied when it comes to other religions, especially Islam and Judaism - the other two Abrahamic religions. A study of all the major world religions - at least to a working knowledge level - would not hurt.

The meek and mild jesus who believes in torture....so does Trump...hmmm. The only difference being jesus's torture is perpetual. Guess you couldn't expect him to let an earthly tyrant outdo him. Personally, I think you can find better deities and humans to emulate.

I appreciate you sharing that and I’m sorry you had to endure it. Just know that people have endured worse, without the need for dependency on a religious belief system or a mythical deity. Desperate people will often cling to the dominant religion of their culture or the religion they were taught as a child. Had you been born a Muslim, you would have found solace in the Qur'an and Allah.
Many people have found great healing in their beliefs, too. What is the point in discussing how a person did it without it? What is the value added to the conversation?

HC, perpetrating intolerant belief systems help no one. Humanity needs tolerant secular beliefs, not intolerant religious beliefs that always result in more human suffering. You're right, it's an open forum, not a private bible study so you should expect replies to your OPs

Happy to oblige. And I’m reminded of why Gandhi said “I like your Christ, I don’t like your Christians.” How tolerant Don’t worry about me HC, I’ll be just fine. Worry about yourself. I think you would agree that false beliefs do no one any good. They can hurt you and others in a multitude of ways. You unwittingly hurt people by espousing a belief system that is intolerant and violent at its core.

Gonna need some links to back up your claims (bolded) that, on their face, have no justification. After all, a purely secular belief system (one not based in the fairness of Judeo-Christian belief systems) would be "survival of the fittest" and would justify horrible (as evaluated by a Christian, for example) actions for survival of the self. Purely secular beliefs (not based on the moral codes ingrained in Judeo-Christian religions) are terrible, and would only harm the weak.