Sanctuary churches

[Monello]

JV has lived in the US of A for 20 years, yet still needs an interpreter. Think about that for a moment. 20 years. 240 months. 1040 weeks. 7,300 days and still no speeka da inglish.

The churches are breaking the law by abetting felons. I hope any supporter of the church that is anti illegal immigration will let the leaders know that they disapprove. The leaders need to be held accountable for any crimes they commit.

How ####ty a country is Mexico that these people fear going there to live?

Jeanette Vizguerra walked into a Colorado church on Wednesday — and into the forefront of a possible clash between Donald Trump and sanctuary churches across the country.Vizguerra has lived in the U.S. since 1997. She has four children, three of them born here. Vizguerra was due to check in with Immigration and Customs Enforcement. Instead, she took sanctuary inside the First Unitarian Society of Denver.
"I did not make this decision lightly," Vizguerra said through an interpreter during a news conference at the church. "I was thinking about it for weeks. But I think that I made the right decision in coming here, instead of going to the immigration office today."
Vizguerra may be the first immigrant to seek sanctuary in a church since the Trump administration took office, but she likely won't be the last. Across the country, dozens of churches and other faith communities say they're preparing to offer sanctuary to immigrants who are in the country illegally.
Vizguerra pleaded guilty to using a fake ID in order to work in 2009. ICE officials say they've already granted her six stays of removal, and declined to issue another. That's when Vizguerra sought refuge in the church rather than face deportation to Mexico.

adios

 

[tommyjo]

JV has lived in the US of A for 20 years, yet still needs an interpreter. Think about that for a moment. 20 years. 240 months. 1040 weeks. 7,300 days and still no speeka da inglish.

The churches are breaking the law by abetting felons. I hope any supporter of the church that is anti illegal immigration will let the leaders know that they disapprove. The leaders need to be held accountable for any crimes they commit.

How ####ty a country is Mexico that these people fear going there to live?



adios

So not speaking English is abhorrent to you?

How many Italians, Germans, Russians, Poles, Greeks and slavs came to American in the early 1900s and spoke only their native language till the day they died?

So you are against churches serving as sanctuaries, too?

What country do you live in? It sure isn't this one.

 

[Gilligan]

So not speaking English is abhorrent to you?

How many Italians, Germans, Russians, Poles, Greeks and slavs came to American in the early 1900s and spoke only their native language till the day they died?

So you are against churches serving as sanctuaries, too?

What country do you live in? It sure isn't this one.

How many illegal immigrants have you taken in and provided for? Bet it's a pretty impressive number, right?

When you get a free moment, provide some links to the places in the Constitution or our body of state and Federal laws that spells out how churches are granted exceptions to the following of laws. Take your time.

 

[b23hqb]

So not speaking English is abhorrent to you?

How many Italians, Germans, Russians, Poles, Greeks and slavs came to American in the early 1900s and spoke only their native language till the day they died?

So you are against churches serving as sanctuaries, too?

What country do you live in? It sure isn't this one.

I'm still trying to figure out what gibberish you speak - it continuously makes no sense, but it always shines a light on your ignorance..

This is a tough issue, but churches are obligated to follow the law like everybody else is. If they are doing this willingly and flaunting it or not, they should be looked into by the authorities.

 

[NextJen]

So not speaking English is abhorrent to you?

How many Italians, Germans, Russians, Poles, Greeks and slavs came to American in the early 1900s and spoke only their native language till the day they died?

So you are against churches serving as sanctuaries, too?

What country do you live in? It sure isn't this one.

I'll take a stab at this:

Not speaking English-
Immigrants that want to come to this country for a better life and to raise their children here are doing themselves a disservice by not trying to at least learn rudimentary English - which I think is required to become a citizen (except under a few circumstances). If they don't want to become a citizen, maybe they shouldn't be staying for 20 years.

1900's immigrants not speaking English-
I'm sure you are correct that some didn't speak English up until their dying day. Many of the original immigrants clung to their culture, but they impressed on their children to learn and speak English, and to meld into the US culture. There are illegal immigrants that come today that not only want to hang onto their culture, but they do not want to assimilate - even to the point of wanting to fly their own flags over the American flag and to bad mouth this country.

Churches as sanctuaries-
A church should be a sanctuary for people to get spiritual help, or to get physical needs met, but that does not mean that God's house should be used to protect criminals (you know, those people that broke the law to get into the United States). Even though God set up some cities of refuge in the Old Testament, those were to protect people who had accidentally killed someone, not people that intentionally killed someone or broke other laws.

Then the Lord said to Joshua: 2 “Tell the Israelites to designate the cities of refuge, as I instructed you through Moses, 3 so that anyone who kills a person accidentally and unintentionally may flee there and find protection from the avenger of blood. 4 When they flee to one of these cities, they are to stand in the entrance of the city gate and state their case before the elders of that city. Then the elders are to admit the fugitive into their city and provide a place to live among them. 5 If the avenger of blood comes in pursuit, the elders must not surrender the fugitive, because the fugitive killed their neighbor unintentionally and without malice aforethought. 6 They are to stay in that city until they have stood trial before the assembly and until the death of the high priest who is serving at that time. Then they may go back to their own home in the town from which they fled.”

 

[kwillia]

I'll take a stab at this:

Not speaking English-
Immigrants that want to come to this country for a better life and to raise their children here are doing themselves a disservice by not trying to at least learn rudimentary English - which I think is required to become a citizen (except under a few circumstances). If they don't want to become a citizen, maybe they shouldn't be staying for 20 years.

1900's immigrants not speaking English-
I'm sure you are correct that some didn't speak English up until their dying day. Many of the original immigrants clung to their culture, but they impressed on their children to learn and speak English, and to meld into the US culture. There are illegal immigrants that come today that not only want to hang onto their culture, but they do not want to assimilate - even to the point of wanting to fly their own flags over the American flag and to bad mouth this country.

Matches my family history...

 

[Kev_Russell]

JV has lived in the US of A for 20 years, yet still needs an interpreter. Think about that for a moment. 20 years. 240 months. 1040 weeks. 7,300 days and still no speeka da inglish.

The churches are breaking the law by abetting felons.[/URL]

Being here without authorization is a civil offense, not a criminal, and certainly not a felonious one. You should really try to keep your emotions in check.

 

[terbear1225]

"ICE officials say they've already granted her six stays of removal, and declined to issue another."

This to me is the salient point of the article. This is not a woman who was unaware of the ramifications of her actions. This is a woman who had already been given SIX chances to rectify her immigration status and did not do so. You cannot tell me that in the 20 years she was her in violation of the law she couldn't have found someone to take her on as a pro bono client to get her green card/ citizenship.

 

[b23hqb]

Being here without authorization is a civil offense, not a criminal, and certainly not a felonious one. You should really try to keep your emotions in check.

That is correct, but not the whole enchilada. That by itself: “Illegal presence” as the offense is called, is not a violation of the U.S. criminal code. A person cannot be sent to prison for being here without authorization from immigration authorities. It is, however, a violation of civil immigration laws, for which the federal government can impose civil penalties, namely deportation".

But go back to how that "alien" got into the country in the first. If the alien entered legally and overstayed their visa, that is civil. If that alien entered this way, then the federal criminal law applies no matter when they were apprehended: “Improper entry by an alien” as it is called, is a violation of Title 8 of the U.S. criminal code punishable by a fine of between $50 and $250 and/or a maximum of six months in jail.

Get whatever money we can from, her, then deport her. Harsh, but necessary.

 

[Hijinx]

As a resident of St Mary's County I encounter people nearly every day who wish to stick to their culture.
They speak a foreign language, and have done soe for years, But they also speak English.
I speak of course of the Mennonite and amish Community here in St. Marys.

Wanting to maintain ones culture is no excuse for living in America and not speaking English.

 

[Hijinx]

I liked this one

How many Italians, Germans, Russians, Poles, Greeks and slavs came to American in the early 1900s and spoke only their native language till the day they died?

I don't know, Do you? You got a link?

So you are against churches serving as sanctuaries, too?

The little I know about Church sanctuary I learned watch the Hunchback of Notre Dame with Charles Laughton.
I believe the rule was in order to claim Sanctuary you had to remain in the Church, if you stepped outside you were fair game.
Now if these Church's want to feed and house these folks inside the Church, while giving them sanctuary I have no problem with it.

 

[black dog]

So not speaking English is abhorrent to you?

How many Italians, Germans, Russians, Poles, Greeks and slavs came to American in the early 1900s and spoke only their native language till the day they died?

So you are against churches serving as sanctuaries, too?

What country do you live in? It sure isn't this one.

My family came to the US in 1704 from Germany, my family learned English and assimilated within a few short years. All my elders ( My dad's father and his 12 brothers and sisters were bilingual ) German was alive and well on the family farm even when I was a kid. But outside the farm and church English was the only language spoken.
If my family could assimilate everyone else can.

 

[black dog]

Being here without authorization is a civil offense, not a criminal, and certainly not a felonious one. You should really try to keep your emotions in check.

Your RIF skills are very poor,
What Is Illegal Entry?

The immigration law actually uses the term "improper entry," which has a broad meaning. It’s more than just slipping across the U.S. border at an unguarded point. Improper entry can include:
entering or attempting to enter the United States at any time or place other than one designated by U.S. immigration officers (in other words, away from a border inspection point or other port of entry)
eluding examination or inspection by U.S. immigration officers (people have tried everything from digging tunnels to hiding in the trunk of a friend’s car)
attempting to enter or obtain entry to the United States by a willfully false or misleading representation or willful concealment of a material fact (which might include, for example, lying on a visa application or buying a false green card or other entry document).
(See Title 8, Section 1325 of the U.S. Code (U.S.C.), or Section 275 of the Immigration and Nationality Act (I.N.A.) for the exact statutory language - www.uscis.gov/laws/immigration-and-nationality-act.)
Criminal Penalties

For the first improper entry offense, the person can be fined (as a criminal penalty), or imprisoned for up to six months, or both. For a subsequent offense, the person can be fined or imprisoned for up to two years, or both. (See 8 U.S.C. Section 1325, I.N.A. Section 275.)
But just in case that isn’t enough to deter illegal entrants, a separate section of the law adds penalties for reentry (or attempted reentry) in cases where the person had been convicted of certain types of crimes and thus removed (deported) from the U.S., as follows:
(1) People removed for a conviction of three or more misdemeanors involving drugs, crimes against the person, or both, or a felony (other than an aggravated felony), shall be fined, imprisoned for up to ten years, or both.
(2) People removed for a conviction of an aggravated felony shall be fined, imprisoned for up to 20 years, or both.
(3) People who were excluded or removed from the United States for security reasons shall be fined, and imprisoned for up to ten years, which sentence shall not run concurrently with any other sentence.
(4) Nonviolent offenders who were removed from the United States before their prison sentence was up shall be fined, imprisoned for up to ten years, or both.
What’s more, someone deported before a prison sentence was complete may be incarcerated for the remainder of the sentence of imprisonment, without any reduction for parole or supervised release.
(See 8 U.S.C. Section 1326, I.N.A. Section 276.)
Civil Penalties

Entry (or attempted entry) at a place other than one designated by immigration officers carries additional civil penalties. The amount is at least $50 and not more than $250 for each such entry (or attempted entry); or twice that amount if the illegal entrant has been previously fined a civil penalty for the same violation. (See 8 U.S.C. Section 1325, I.N.A. Section 275.)
Immigration Consequences of an Improper Entry

A person who comes to the US without permission of the immigration authorities is inadmissible. To learn more about inadmissibility, see Who Can't Get Into The United States?
In practice, that usually means that if the person became eligible for a green card or other immigration status, he or she would be ineligible to adjust status within the United States. By leaving the U.S. and applying from overseas, the inadmissibility problem could be solved – unless the person had already stayed in the U.S. for six months or more without a right to be there. In that case, he or she would run into a separate ground of inadmissibility, based on "unlawful presence" in the United States. (For more on how that affects your possibilities of obtaining a green card, see Legal Options for an Undocumented Immigrant to Stay in the U.S.)
If a person was removed from the U.S. (deported) on the basis of a conviction for an aggravated felony (other than illegal entry or reentry), then the improper entry itself is considered to be an aggravated felony. (See 8 U.S.C. § 1101(a)(43)(O).) Having one of more aggravated felonies on one’s record is a huge problem, because aggravated felonies bar a person from virtually all immigration benefits, and are a grounds of deportability (under 8 U.S.C. 1227, I.N.A. Section 237

 

[LightRoasted]

If I may ...

So not speaking English is abhorrent to you? Absolutely! Damn right! Sure is! Legal immigrants must learn English! Why not some wetback after 20 years!

"The actual civics test is NOT a multiple choice test. During the naturalization interview, a USCIS officer will ask you up to 10 questions from the list of 100 questions in English."

How many Italians, Germans, Russians, Poles, Greeks and slavs came to American in the early 1900s and spoke only their native language till the day they died? Who gives a sh*t! Anyone can look up old newspapers stories of the day and see that those immigrants were damn grateful to be allowed entry. And they were patriotic to America! They still had to learn and know some English.

So you are against churches serving as sanctuaries, too? You are god damn right I'm against churches serving as sanctuaries for criminals. Churches are already sanctuaries for pedophiles in the Catholic Church, don't need anymore added to that list.

What country do you live in? It sure isn't this one. We live in the mother f**king United States of America. A country of laws you dumb bitch!

Whew, sorry, back on my leash.

 

[PrchJrkr]

If I may ...



Whew, sorry, back on my leash.

It's truly sad that people like TJ don't get it, and probably never will.

My grandparents decided to drop their native language at home, when my eldest uncle started grade school. It seems he wanted to "roll" his Rs, a teacher called him on it, and his legal immigrant parents wouldn't stand for it.

They were Americans and had to learn proper English. It's called assimilation...

 

[officeguy]

"ICE officials say they've already granted her six stays of removal, and declined to issue another."

This to me is the salient point of the article. This is not a woman who was unaware of the ramifications of her actions. This is a woman who had already been given SIX chances to rectify her immigration status and did not do so. You cannot tell me that in the 20 years she was her in violation of the law she couldn't have found someone to take her on as a pro bono client to get her green card/ citizenship.

There may not be any legal avenue for her to receive a greencard. Laws changed in the 80s and 90s pretty much restrict adjustment of status for illegal immigrants to those who marry a citizen.

 

[This_person]

Being here without authorization is a civil offense, not a criminal, and certainly not a felonious one. You should really try to keep your emotions in check.

What about the felonious ID theft?

 

[SamSpade]

When I worked construction in Boston back in the early 80's, I was amazed at how many people lived in these ethnic enclaves and spoke no English.

And they were *BORN* here. Lemme say that again - BORN here.

That's right, born in North End or Chelsea and only spoke Italian or Spanish and a few that only spoke Gaelic. Freakin' Gaelic. How many people outside Ireland speak Gaelic?

I *get* the whole preserving your culture but at the turn of the last century when waves of people came from Poland, and Ireland and Italy - I lived in a town almost exclusively those three groups - they learned English, because the society wasn't going to wipe their butt for them if they didn't make an effort.

I lived in towns where Grandpa only spoke Italian or Polish - but his kids and grandkids spoke English. They had to - and he wanted them to.
I remember my first job many, many years ago, I worked with a second generation American born Chinese woman - (she would say "ABC"). And her English was *better* than mine, and I speak better than most Americans.
She said her father - who was straight from China - told his family they were not to speak Chinese at home at all. He wanted his children to succeed in their new nation.
And one way was to be sure they knew English VERY well.

When my family hosted and cared for a Panamanian family escaping Noriega - they spoke very little English. I often had to learn a few Spanish words or use gestures to talk to them.
Years later at my parent's anniversary celebration, they were there (as they had always kept in touch). One of the guys spoke to me with no trace of an accent "I speak English a LOT better NOW, huh?".
We all laughed.

I don't get why people come here if they don't plan to learn English. I would never move to a new nation and NOT learn the culture, the language, the customs.