Trump’s attack on environmental laws won’t save coal miners’ jobs

[nhboy]

 

[This_person]

That makes sense. Eliminating the reason coal plants were put in layup (waiting to be restarted) means that the plants still won't be restarted and there will be no need for more coal. That makes perfect sense (to an idiot).

 

[Gilligan]

Boy believes that the previous 6 or 7 high cycles of global temps were also caused by human activity, so...

 

[Chris0nllyn]

I'd like to assume not many people, especially Trump voters, believed that Trump was going to bring back coal jobs or even manufacturing jobs.

 

[This_person]

I'd like to assume not many people, especially Trump voters, believed that Trump was going to bring back coal jobs or even manufacturing jobs.

I don't think he's going to do a damned thing about jobs, except try and limit those at the federal government level. I do think he is doing some things (not much, but some) to help with the regulatory environment that may have as a result a change in the job market.

 

[Gilligan]

I'd like to assume not many people, especially Trump voters, believed that Trump was going to bring back coal jobs or even manufacturing jobs.

I'm OK with him simply rolling back what those rogue and overreaching agencies had done and let things sort themselves out naturally from there. Changing the corporate and personal tax situation could have a bigger impact. And there certainly are some types of manufacturing jobs that will remain, or originate, in the US and even expand. Not the classic "smokestack" sectors, of course, or heavy industry like shipbuilding either. India, China, Tawian, etc have got all of that.

 

[Gilligan]

Boy's stupid cartoon also illustrates well a classic logical fallacy that the left are employing on practically a daily basis now in response to Trump's actions. The false dilemma; the false premise that stopping and rolling back, to some extent, gross Federal overreach, will immediately result in the complete and total reversal of literally EVERYTHING that came before it. Scrap some recently and very hastily, at last minute, imposed Clean Air regulations and we'll all be wearing portable breathing aparati to get to work tomorrow. Cut back on the funding to Chesapeake Bay groups and the bay will become a toxic cesspool within a week. And so on... Those on the left are not very smart, and it shows.

 

[black dog]

Boy's stupid cartoon also illustrates well a classic logical fallacy that the left are employing on practically a daily basis now in response to Trump's actions. The false dilemma; the false premise that stopping and rolling back, to some extent, gross Federal overreach, will immediately result in the complete and total reversal of literally EVERYTHING that came before it. Scrap some recently and very hastily, at last minute, imposed Clean Air regulations and we'll all be wearing portable breathing aparati to get to work tomorrow. Cut back on the funding to Chesapeake Bay groups and the bay will become a toxic cesspool within a week. And so on... Those on the left are not very smart, and it shows.

Rumor I heard this morning was, all three coal burners in Maryland were shutting down the new scrubbers and putting the old smokestacks back on line. Get ready for the old Southern Maryland acid rain again.

 

[itsbob]

Rumor I heard this morning was, all three coal burners in Maryland were shutting down the new scrubbers and putting the old smokestacks back on line. Get ready for the old Southern Maryland acid rain again.

I thought many of them converted to Natural Gus production..

and since today, Natural Gas is the still the cheapest per kWh, why would they go back to coal??

 

[This_person]

I thought many of them converted to Natural Gus production..

and since today, Natural Gas is the still the cheapest per kWh, why would they go back to coal??

Coal is still very profitable:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/loca.../gJQAB5LDQX_story.html?utm_term=.5da6cb11c9ff

https://www.adn.com/uncategorized/a...-plants-allow-timely-replacement-/2011/05/05/

“The large number of coal-fired generator retirements is primarily because of the implementation of the Environmental Protection Agency’s Mercury and Air Toxics Standards (MATS) this year, although some units have been granted extensions to operate through April 2016.

“MATS requires large coal- and oil-fired electric generators to meet stricter emissions standards by incorporating emissions control technologies in existing generating facilities. Some power plant operators have decided that retrofitting units to meet the new standards will be cost-prohibitive and are choosing to retire units instead,” the EIA report said.

....

The EIA’s Annual Energy Outlook 2015 makes it pretty clear. “Coal-fired capacity declines from 304 GW in 2013 to 260 GW in 2040 in the Reference case, as a result of retirements and very few new additions. A total of 40 GW of coal capacity is retired from 2013 to 2040 in the Reference case, representing both announced retirements and those projected on the basis of relative economics, including the costs of meeting environmental regulations and competition with natural gas-fired generation in the near term.

“As a result of the uncertainty surrounding future greenhouse gas legislation and regulations and given its high capital costs, very little unplanned coal-fired capacity is added across all the AEO2015 cases,” the EIA concludes.

 

[black dog]

I thought many of them converted to Natural Gus production..

and since today, Natural Gas is the still the cheapest per kWh, why would they go back to coal??

Well Bob, Morgantown and Dickerson don't have Natural Gas lines to feed them, Chalk Point does but only for the gas turbines on top of the hill.
All were designed to warm-up on #2 or #6 and shift to coal. Certainly when we start mining coal like we used to the raw costs will drop. If it already wasn't profitable do you think they would still be running.

 

[Gilligan]

Rumor I heard this morning was, all three coal burners in Maryland were shutting down the new scrubbers and putting the old smokestacks back on line. Get ready for the old Southern Maryland acid rain again.

That does not stand any credibility test. The "new" scrubbers were installed to comply with older requirements and have been on line for some time now. All the new requirements that were going to kill the plants were since then put in place by the Child King, some right near the end of his reign and rendered the new scrubbers inadequate.