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Thread: Heres the ugly truth that critics of Trumps tax plan need to face

  1. #1
    INGSOC GURPS's Avatar
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    Heres the ugly truth that critics of Trumps tax plan need to face

    That's because the only real solution to our debt and cost of running the government is to make spending cuts. And the reason why we keep hearing about raising more revenue and not focusing on real cuts and spending reform is because both the Republicans and Democrats in Congress are too cowardly to make those cuts and reforms. Besides, getting on their high horses about how the Trump plan is fiscally irresponsible is a lot easier than being taken to task for getting us into this budget mess and never doing anything meaningful to fix it for all the decades before Donald Trump was even a candidate.

    We know this because Uncle Sam keeps breaking records for tax revenue. Washington hauled in a record $1.08 trillion in tax revenues in the first 4 months of this current fiscal year. The Treasury is bursting at the virtual seams, and still that debt keeps growing. Tax cuts aren't the issue, it's the spending. It's always been the spending.

    But wait. Even if we can all agree that cuts should be made a priority, won't reducing incoming tax revenue at least make the problem worse? From a purely mathematical side, that's basically true as less money coming in would grow the deficits. But first, we also know that after a short waiting period of a year or so, previous tax cuts made by the Harding, Kennedy, Reagan, and George W. Bush administrations did lead to growing revenue in the end.


    Heres the ugly truth that critics of Trumps tax plan need to face
    Were tempted to suggest a conspiracy here but its just liberals agreeing yet again that conservatives have hidden, evil motives, because modern liberals simply cant conceive of any other reason to disagree with the liberal consensus.

  2. #2
    That's because the only real solution to our debt and cost of running the government is to make spending cuts.
    The solution? That means our debt and cost of running gummint is a problem. It does not explain how so.

    Where's the problem?
    ADHD; Interdisciplinary

  3. #3
    So let's have so fun shall we???

    [QUOTE]
    Quote Originally Posted by GURPS View Post
    That's because the only real solution to our debt and cost of running the government is to make spending cuts.
    Umm...no. Unless of course you are going to gut Medicare and Medicaid...they are the true holes in the budget...and Social Security (that hole in the budget is coming)...and defense.


    And the reason why we keep hearing about raising more revenue and not focusing on real cuts and spending reform is because both the Republicans and Democrats in Congress are too cowardly to make those cuts and reforms.
    As spending reform goes, that is basically true. However, there is no plan...let me repeat that for the stupid....there is NO plan of tax cuts only and no plan of tax increases ONLY that will solve our problems. Not if you want to keep supporting our aging population that is.


    Besides, getting on their high horses about how the Trump plan is fiscally irresponsible is a lot easier than being taken to task for getting us into this budget mess and never doing anything meaningful to fix it for all the decades before Donald Trump was even a candidate.
    This is irrelevant. The Trump plan is beyond idiotic...this back of the napkin doodle that is being portrayed as Trump's tax plan would blow a hole in a budget with a surplus.

    We know this because Uncle Sam keeps breaking records for tax revenue. Washington hauled in a record $1.08 trillion in tax revenues in the first 4 months of this current fiscal year.
    Jesus...who is this written for and by??? 3rd graders? The first 4 months of the year are always big revenue times...record breaking revenue based on dollars really isn't the point...the budget is an annual beast...taxes are collected all year long...spending happens all year long.


    The Treasury is bursting at the virtual seams, and still that debt keeps growing. Tax cuts aren't the issue, it's the spending. It's always been the spending.
    Um...dumbass...tax cuts under Mr. Bush 43 put us in this hole...that is getting deeper and deeper due to the demographic changes occurring in this country. Not hard to figure out...not hard to see...

    But wait. Even if we can all agree that cuts should be made a priority, won't reducing incoming tax revenue at least make the problem worse?
    so what...this guy is taking both sides of the issue...how Presidential!

    From a purely mathematical side, that's basically true as less money coming in would grow the deficits.
    Umm...yeah...the math is the point everyone else is making. Cut taxes = increasing deficit. No need to qualify it as "from a purely mathematical side"...

    But first, we also know that after a short waiting period of a year or so, previous tax cuts made by the Harding, Kennedy, Reagan, and George W. Bush administrations did lead to growing revenue in the end.
    Christ....NO! Tax cuts don't eventually lead to growing revenue. Inflation and a growing economy eventually lead to growing revenue. Inflation, a growing economy and an aging population also lead to increased spending (oh and so does a recession caused by a financial/credit crisis...but the author conveniently forgets that bit of recent history)

  4. #4
    [QUOTE=tommyjo;5763918]So let's have so fun shall we???


    Umm...no. Unless of course you are going to gut Medicare and Medicaid...they are the true holes in the budget...and Social Security (that hole in the budget is coming)...and defense.


    As spending reform goes, that is basically true. However, there is no plan...let me repeat that for the stupid....there is NO plan of tax cuts only and no plan of tax increases ONLY that will solve our problems. Not if you want to keep supporting our aging population that is.


    This is irrelevant. The Trump plan is beyond idiotic...this back of the napkin doodle that is being portrayed as Trump's tax plan would blow a hole in a budget with a surplus.

    Jesus...who is this written for and by??? 3rd graders? The first 4 months of the year are always big revenue times...record breaking revenue based on dollars really isn't the point...the budget is an annual beast...taxes are collected all year long...spending happens all year long.


    Um...dumbass...tax cuts under Mr. Bush 43 put us in this hole...that is getting deeper and deeper due to the demographic changes occurring in this country. Not hard to figure out...not hard to see...

    so what...this guy is taking both sides of the issue...how Presidential!

    Umm...yeah...the math is the point everyone else is making. Cut taxes = increasing deficit. No need to qualify it as "from a purely mathematical side"...

    Christ....NO! Tax cuts don't eventually lead to growing revenue. Inflation and a growing economy eventually lead to growing revenue. Inflation, a growing economy and an aging population also lead to increased spending (oh and so does a recession caused by a financial/credit crisis...but the author conveniently forgets that bit of recent history)
    Chrissakes that was fun, TJ!! Almost as much fun as that time I dumped 4 gallons of Wesson oil in the kiddy pool and you and I jumped in.
    You can't be a real country unless you have a beer and an airline. It helps if you have some kind of a football team, or some nuclear weapons, but at the very least you need a beer. -Frank Zappa

  5. #5
    [QUOTE=Gilligan;5763934]
    Quote Originally Posted by tommyjo View Post
    So let's have so fun shall we???



    Chrissakes that was fun, TJ!! Almost as much fun as that time I dumped 4 gallons of Wesson oil in the kiddy pool and you and I jumped in.
    "Pain heals. Chicks dig scars. Glory... lasts forever." - Shane Falco

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by stgislander View Post

    Did he do that at the Tiki bar?

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by DoWhat View Post
    Did he do that at the Tiki bar?
    Damn,,,,, you just ruined the video in my head of the " Tiki Bar ".
    Originally Posted by littlelady View Post
    I just reported you. You are one scary individual.

  8. #8
    So, here we yet another example of how much we all have in common.

    The reason we 'need' to cut carbon emissions; CO2. We can't afford more!

    Vague references to what it was in the past as some sort of evidence of what it should be now. No argument as to why or why not MORE spending and debt may well be good. All sorts of meaningless numbers tossed around like rising CO2 levels, accelerated rise in CO2 levels. No context. No proof. Just certainty that it MUST come down.

    Same thing with spending. Just the same human emotion based arguments.
    ADHD; Interdisciplinary

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Larry Gude View Post
    So, here we yet another example of how much we all have in common.

    The reason we 'need' to cut carbon emissions; CO2. We can't afford more!

    Vague references to what it was in the past as some sort of evidence of what it should be now. No argument as to why or why not MORE spending and debt may well be good. All sorts of meaningless numbers tossed around like rising CO2 levels, accelerated rise in CO2 levels. No context. No proof. Just certainty that it MUST come down.

    Same thing with spending. Just the same human emotion based arguments.
    In all my years here, I have decided that you are a politician trapped in an everyday man's body. You need to run for something. I think it will help you. I will vote for you. Uh, let me think about that a little longer.
    ​​Like I said. JMO, yo! - Roman
    If you ignore the trolls, they starve. - Wishbone

  10. #10
    I just discovered this thread. Funny, because I was just thinking about the fact that over the years - with only a few exceptions - tax revenues just keep getting higher. There have been about a handful of intervals where the revenue went down, and they correspond exactly to deep recessions. Even when adjusted for inflation - we still increase the revenue even in years where there are big tax cuts.

    Now you'd THINK that huge tax cuts would MASSIVELY increase the deficit, but it doesn't seem to do that.

    The reasonable conclusion is that taxation is a constraint on the ability of the country to make money. Kind of like allowing the plants to get more sun and water.

    Obviously, there's an optimal place for taxation if the government still wants to run - you can't take all of the money or there's nothing to take the next year - and no incentive to make it either - and you can't take none of it or the government can't operate - and the engines of commerce DO need a minimum of government to run.

    But the optimal place isn't going to be "more taxation than we have now".

    And that optimum will fluctuate with time.
    Good intentions will always be pleaded for every assumption of authority. It is hardly too strong to say that the Constitution was made to guard the people against the dangers of good intentions. There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to govern. They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters.".Daniel Webster

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