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Thread: I'm Thinking A Net Loss .........

  1. #11
    The company says their next generation turbine can produce twice the power.

    Like Bob said, it's an enormous untapped resource. People need water. Hopefully the comapny moves on to wastewater next.
    Crybaby Cripplecrow Hanging on a Monkey's Toe Club

  2. #12
    Once fully operational, the installation is expected to generate $2,000,000 worth of renewable energy capacity over twenty years, based on “an average of 1,100 megawatt hours of energy per year, enough electricity to power up to 150 homes.

    Like Gilligan states earlier, just with the pressure loss in spinning the turbines it can only be used in certain environments. A 20 psi pressure loss in a community is huge.
    Lots of communitys have under 45 psi already, take away 20 and folks will be adding a pukp and bladder tank in there homes, kinna negatively affecting the turbines.
    To overcome this the options are to build taller water towers to increase head pressure.
    Just to help put things in order, if I remember correctly Chalk Point with both coal burners running during high demands it can produce around a million dollars a day.

    .Maybe a better place would be in the water discharge side of hydro-electric plants.

    This truly is a pipe dream.
    Proud to be a cereal comma user.

  3. #13
    INGSOC GURPS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by black dog View Post
    Once fully operational, the installation is expected to generate $2,000,000 worth of renewable energy capacity over twenty years .....

    This truly is a pipe dream.


    that was my thought, but I wanted others opinions .....
    having to provide additional 'pressure' or flow to compensate fro a loss even if the turbine is only on a down hill slope
    Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity.
    - Robert J. Hanlon.

    “There is a deeply anti-democratic undercurrent to much of the criticism of the new president, borne aloft by an assumption that democracy is too important to be left to the voters.”

  4. #14
    #*! boat! Gilligan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by black dog View Post
    Once fully operational, the installation is expected to generate $2,000,000 worth of renewable energy capacity over twenty years, based on “an average of 1,100 megawatt hours of energy per year, enough electricity to power up to 150 homes.

    Like Gilligan states earlier, just with the pressure loss in spinning the turbines it can only be used in certain environments. A 20 psi pressure loss in a community is huge.
    Lots of communitys have under 45 psi already, take away 20 and folks will be adding a pukp and bladder tank in there homes, kinna negatively affecting the turbines.
    To overcome this the options are to build taller water towers to increase head pressure.
    Just to help put things in order, if I remember correctly Chalk Point with both coal burners running during high demands it can produce around a million dollars a day.

    .Maybe a better place would be in the water discharge side of hydro-electric plants.

    This truly is a pipe dream.
    To be fair...I interpreted that 20 psi parasitic loss to be occurring over a section of the system where the fall distance creates an excess head anyway. Some of those pipelines do cover some major elevation changes along their way.

    Our home in Norway, like many rural homes in the fjords, was powered by a small water turbine that was situated about 100 meters up the side of the mountain above our home. The water for the house came directly from the same catch basin that fed the turbine; straight gravity feed. The catch basin was something we built around a "step" in a waterfall/stream that came from some 1000 meters farther up the side of the mountain. The turbine generator was around 20 kw as best I recall and old...1950s vintage. But it got the job done.

    And we heated the house entirely with wood, except for heat strips under the stone and tile floors in bathroom and laundry room that were electric.

    Totally off grid. Loved it.

    The stream that we tapped..pic taken at the bottom where it crosses under the road and empties in the fjord. What the view looks like from the top of the mountain..and our house.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Last edited by Gilligan; 05-25-2017 at 03:08 PM.
    You can't be a real country unless you have a beer and an airline. It helps if you have some kind of a football team, or some nuclear weapons, but at the very least you need a beer. -Frank Zappa

  5. #15
    INGSOC GURPS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilligan View Post
    To be fair...


    I take all this 'Green Energy' / Free Energy Cheering with heavy skepticism ...... at least it is privately funded


    Solyndra and that battery company were supposed to be such great companies
    Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity.
    - Robert J. Hanlon.

    “There is a deeply anti-democratic undercurrent to much of the criticism of the new president, borne aloft by an assumption that democracy is too important to be left to the voters.”

  6. #16
    I bowl overhand itsbob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris0nllyn View Post
    The company says their next generation turbine can produce twice the power.

    Like Bob said, it's an enormous untapped resource. People need water. Hopefully the comapny moves on to wastewater next.
    All new technology has to start somewhere.. and generally once the first prototype is fielded, more people will find ways to refine and make it better.

    They may make it twice as efficient, somebody else will beat them to the next jump, and the jump after.
    Nero played the fiddle, Obama danced the Tango.

    Quote Originally Posted by BadGirl
    Bob is the bestest lookin and smartest man I've ever met.

  7. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by black dog View Post
    Once fully operational, the installation is expected to generate $2,000,000 worth of renewable energy capacity over twenty years, based on “an average of 1,100 megawatt hours of energy per year, enough electricity to power up to 150 homes.

    Like Gilligan states earlier, just with the pressure loss in spinning the turbines it can only be used in certain environments. A 20 psi pressure loss in a community is huge.
    Lots of communitys have under 45 psi already, take away 20 and folks will be adding a pukp and bladder tank in there homes, kinna negatively affecting the turbines.
    To overcome this the options are to build taller water towers to increase head pressure.
    Just to help put things in order, if I remember correctly Chalk Point with both coal burners running during high demands it can produce around a million dollars a day.

    .Maybe a better place would be in the water discharge side of hydro-electric plants.

    This truly is a pipe dream.
    The pipes are over pressurized, typically. Hence the need for a PRV. Dropping it 20psi isn't doing much as the pipe pressure is typically above household pressure anyway.

    Nothing is providing extra pressure since it's overpressurized anyway.

    It's not generating power to save the world, and it's not an end-all, be-all solution. It is a start and geared to an industry that typically uses a metric ####ton of energy.
    Crybaby Cripplecrow Hanging on a Monkey's Toe Club

  8. #18
    #*! boat! Gilligan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris0nllyn View Post
    The pipes are over pressurized, typically. Hence the need for a PRV. Dropping it 20psi isn't doing much as the pipe pressure is typically above household pressure anyway.

    Nothing is providing extra pressure since it's overpressurized anyway.

    It's not generating power to save the world, and it's not an end-all, be-all solution. It is a start and geared to an industry that typically uses a metric ####ton of energy.
    Reminds me somewhat of the tidal/current undersea turbine R&D one of my engineers - a brilliant hydrodynamicist - was involved in a few years back. Big machines proposed..itty bitty output. But put enough of 'em on the sea floor, and...
    You can't be a real country unless you have a beer and an airline. It helps if you have some kind of a football team, or some nuclear weapons, but at the very least you need a beer. -Frank Zappa

  9. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Gilligan View Post
    Reminds me somewhat of the tidal/current undersea turbine R&D one of my engineers - a brilliant hydrodynamicist - was involved in a few years back. Big machines proposed..itty bitty output. But put enough of 'em on the sea floor, and...
    Yea those things look cool. They'd be especially helpful along the eastern seaboard (like Maine) where the tides are crazy.
    Crybaby Cripplecrow Hanging on a Monkey's Toe Club

  10. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Chris0nllyn View Post
    The pipes are over pressurized, typically. Hence the need for a PRV. Dropping it 20psi isn't doing much as the pipe pressure is typically above household pressure anyway.

    Nothing is providing extra pressure since it's overpressurized anyway.
    .
    Over pressurized really?

    When you over pressurize pipe and have fluid go faster say for water 18 to 20 ft per second, you enter the danger zone of doing huge damage to the pipe and fittings. You get things like hammering and blowing fittings and increased wear and failures in the system.
    All this stuff is nothing new... In most cases you can't take away from Peter to pay Paul.

    .It's like why no new hydro electric on a big scale,,,,,, because they knew 60 years ago that all the rivers that truly make it worthwhile, have generation plants on them already.
    Proud to be a cereal comma user.

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