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Thread: Police Officer arrests Nurse.

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by black dog View Post
    200 grand per probe..... That's some high end anal...
    depends on whether you are giving or receiving.

  2. #32
    Oldtimer Ken King's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by officeguy View Post
    The scotus decision points out that in a situation with an unconscious driver or an exigency situation different standard applies. They just said that in the three cases before the court the government didn't make a compelling case that they could demand this without a warrant ans under the threat of prosecution.
    Yes it does, and what the decision states is
    It is true that a blood test, unlike a breath test, may be administered to a person who is unconscious (perhaps as a result of a crash) or who is unable to do what is needed to take a breath test due to profound intoxication or injuries. But we have no reason to believe that such situations are common in drunk-driving arrests, and when they arise, the police may apply for a warrant if need be.
    The need being that if the driver wasn't under arrest then there would be no exigent need and a warrant would be required.

  3. #33
    Visualize whirled peas Merlin99's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by officeguy View Post
    He operated a motor vehicle, the 'implied consent' law cited above does not require an arrest. When a cop can ask for a test is governed by agency protocol, involvement in a fatal motor vehicle crash can be a reason to require a chemical test (even if the 'involvement' at first glance is as the victim of the crash).

    You have very few rights once you get behind the wheel of a motor vehicle, even less if like the truck-driver you have a CDL.

    In the end, Salt Lake PD is going to have to eat this. The detective and his LT are going to see discipline and the nurse will walk away with a nice chunk of money.
    In the first paragraph you say that the cops are right, then in the last you're admitting they're wrong. What's wrong with picking a side and running with it.
    ‎"I've learned that pleasing everyone is impossible, but pissing everyone off is a piece of cake"

  4. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Merlin99 View Post
    In the first paragraph you say that the cops are right, then in the last you're admitting they're wrong. What's wrong with picking a side and running with it.
    All the internet lawyering nonwithstanding, he may have been within his rights to demand access to the patient to obtain a blood sample. I simply dont know the answer to that question, between implied consent and an exigency issue it is possible that the the police had a right to obtain that sample.

    What he most definitely didn't have a right to do was to detain someone who was simply arguing with him.

    They are two separate issues and I can say 'I dont know' about one and 'I do know' about the other.

  5. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by officeguy View Post
    All the internet lawyering nonwithstanding, he may have been within his rights to demand access to the patient to obtain a blood sample. I simply dont know the answer to that question, between implied consent and an exigency issue it is possible that the the police had a right to obtain that sample.
    Neither implied consent nor exigency apply here. Consent was required. This is evident with nothing more than a perfunctory read of what's already been posted to this thread in both Utah State Law for implied consent and the SCOTUS in Birchfield v North Dakota. By all reports of this, the truck driver wasn't suspected of being under the influence of any substance. Therefore, this was an illegal order by the detective and as such, so was the arrest of this nurse.

    What he most definitely didn't have a right to do was to detain someone who was simply arguing with him.
    LEOs always have this right as long as they are giving a lawful order and someone disobeys/argues/whatever. In this case, it wasn't a lawful order.

  6. #36
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    LEOs are the government and the government does not have rights, they may have the authority. Just a pet peeve on wording.

  7. #37
    Happy Creepy Ass Cracka Lurk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeoplesElbow View Post
    The blood draw in itself is stupid because it is clear from the video that the truck driver did nothing to cause the accident other that occupying space. The police chasing the guy in the pickup are more to blame for this than the truck driver that was minding his own business. If a blood draw was demanded of the perusing police I bet they would have objected.
    There is just too little information to make a solid argument either way. Too many have assumed the blood was drawn solely to test for chemicals and that is a stupid assumption to make in the E.R. Too many assume the nurse was being bitchy and obstructive. The video is too edited to allow anyone to sort it out.

    However, it appears the officer was detailed to the E.R. (different uniform than the other officers in the video, taken off the blood-draw unit, etc.) and there may have been discussions/arguments among the E.R. staff prior to this episode. When the truck driver was brought into the E.R. it was an opportunity for the parties to act on what their previous bias or belief dictated. A vial of blood became the target of the argument, not the rights of the driver or authority of the nurse or the officer.

    In the wash of this episode, it will be stated the blood of the "innocent" truck driver had to be taken to clear him of any culpability so the "guilty" automobile driver cannot use the possibility the truck driver was somehow at fault. The nurse will argue that the truck driver's rights were hers to protect from an over zealous Nazi jack-booted police officer. The administrator of the hospital should have been called, the blood sample placed in a fridge, and calmer heads should have been making decisions. Didn't happen. This stupidity will happen numerous times and nothing will be resolved. It's human nature.
    Last edited by Lurk; 09-04-2017 at 11:24 AM.
    “In times of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act” - Geo Orwell

  8. #38
    Visualize whirled peas Merlin99's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lurk View Post
    There is just too little information to make a solid argument either way. Too many have assumed the blood was drawn solely to test for chemicals and that is a stupid assumption to make in the E.R. Too many assume the nurse was being bitchy and obstructive. The video is too edited to allow anyone to sort it out.

    However, it appears the officer was detailed to the E.R. (different uniform than the other officers in the video, taken off the blood-draw unit, etc.) and there may have been discussions/arguments among the E.R. staff prior to this episode. When the truck driver was brought into the E.R. it was an opportunity for the parties to act on what their previous bias or belief dictated. A vial of blood became the target of the argument, not the rights of the driver or authority of the nurse or the officer.

    In the wash of this episode, it will be stated the blood of the "innocent" truck driver had to be taken to clear him of any culpability so the "guilty" automobile driver cannot use the possibility the truck driver was somehow at fault. The nurse will argue that the truck driver's rights were hers to protect from an over zealous Nazi jack-booted police officer. The administrator of the hospital should have been called, the blood sample placed in a fridge, and calmer heads should have been making decisions. Didn't happen. This stupidity will happen numerous times and nothing will be resolved. It's human nature.
    I think you've made a couple of erroneous assumptions. In the first paragraph "Too many assume the nurse was being bitchy and obstructive", I don't think that's anyone's but possibly officeguys belief. Everyone else thought the cop went full on stormtrooper for no reason. In the last you've inferred that they wanted the blood to clear the truck driver of fault, the majority believes it was much more likely to help provide cover for the persuing police for their inevitable lawsuit.
    ‎"I've learned that pleasing everyone is impossible, but pissing everyone off is a piece of cake"

  9. #39
    Registered User PeoplesElbow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lurk View Post
    There is just too little information to make a solid argument either way. Too many have assumed the blood was drawn solely to test for chemicals and that is a stupid assumption to make in the E.R. Too many assume the nurse was being bitchy and obstructive. The video is too edited to allow anyone to sort it out.

    However, it appears the officer was detailed to the E.R. (different uniform than the other officers in the video, taken off the blood-draw unit, etc.) and there may have been discussions/arguments among the E.R. staff prior to this episode. When the truck driver was brought into the E.R. it was an opportunity for the parties to act on what their previous bias or belief dictated. A vial of blood became the target of the argument, not the rights of the driver or authority of the nurse or the officer.

    In the wash of this episode, it will be stated the blood of the "innocent" truck driver had to be taken to clear him of any culpability so the "guilty" automobile driver cannot use the possibility the truck driver was somehow at fault. The nurse will argue that the truck driver's rights were hers to protect from an over zealous Nazi jack-booted police officer. The administrator of the hospital should have been called, the blood sample placed in a fridge, and calmer heads should have been making decisions. Didn't happen. This stupidity will happen numerous times and nothing will be resolved. It's human nature.
    The video clearly shows that the semi was in it's lane when the pickup hit it. There is no need to prove oneself innocent, the police were just fishing for someone else to blame.

    If you are ever in an accident with a cop and it is their fault you will understand.
    If what I say offends you then you really don't want to hear what I keep to myself.

  10. #40
    #*! boat! Gilligan's Avatar
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