Cuba

vraiblonde

Board Mommy
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The book I'm currently reading (The Cuban Affair by Nelson DeMille) takes place in...wait for it...Cuba. DeMille's description makes Havana sound highly unappealing, and yet throngs of celebretards say it's a "worker's paradise" - whatever that means - and speak glowingly of their visit. So I decided to get some other opinions from travel bloggers, etc.

The general consensus is that Cuba, which of course is Socialist, is a #### hole...UNLESS you're the type of person who enjoys poverty porn tours. And yes, those people exist. I saw a #### ton of them last night. Basically gawking at poor people who are under extreme government control makes them feel great about their own situation. "I came away with such a sense of gratitude..." "It was soooo authentic!" "See it before it becomes commercialized..." Yes, if only we could go back in time to slavery days and visit an authentic plantation and watch an authentic auction and cat-hauling. You know, before they become modern and all. :rolleyes: These are the type of tourists who treat other countries like a human zoo - "Look! A Cuban is his natural habitat....behind bars!"

Cuba does not have nice things for themselves, therefore they cannot provide that to tourists. There's a reason why Cubans jump on rafts and risk their lives trying to escape to the US. Most of us know this, of course, but there is still a large segment of our population that thinks Socialism is super cool because...free stuff!! They don't seem to understand that that "stuff" in fact has a very high price tag.

I don't really understand Americans who vacation in third-world countries. Why? Do they just enjoy filth, crime, and degradation? Is reading about conditions in these countries not good enough, and they need to go gawk for themselves?
 

Gilligan

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I don't really understand Americans who vacation in third-world countries. Why? Do they just enjoy filth, crime, and degradation? Is reading about conditions in these countries not good enough, and they need to go gawk for themselves?

Having worked on ships at many of the Caribbean islands over the years, I'd have to say the majority of them are sh!thole third-world countries. But I see all that because I'm working there and not staying at the lovely and very sequestered resorts that dot all those islands. I doubt most tourists staying in Guadeloupe, for example, ever see the dingy cardboard shacks the locals live in because they are kept well away from the resorts and any "tourist" trinket gathering spots. Even Cuba has some very nice tourist resorts that Non-American tourists (Europeans mostly) have been going to for years and years.
 

vraiblonde

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Oh, and another thing that annoys me:

Americans, please do not go to impoverished third world countries and haggle with the locals to save a couple of bucks. If the lady says the ankle bracelet is $5, pay the five and shut up. Haggling with her might save you a whole whopping dollar, which is nothing to you but is a lot of money to her. Imagine if you were selling something you made to try and scrape together money to feed your family, and Bill Gates came along and demanded a discount. That's how you look to Bahamians, Jamaicans, Mexicans, and Cubans.
 

MR47930

Member
I don't really understand Americans who vacation in third-world countries. Why? Do they just enjoy filth, crime, and degradation? Is reading about conditions in these countries not good enough, and they need to go gawk for themselves?

IMG_1103.jpg
Tell me where I can get this view and I'll stop going to 3rd world countries. Yea 99% of the country is a ####hole but the tourist areas are heavenly. Usually travel to the Caribbean once a year.

Edit: You think they're bad now, what do you think they would look like if people stopped going?
 
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MR47930

Member
All along the Gulf coast. They don't have the Sandals logo because they don't need to be gated guarded resorts to be beautiful and safe, but the view of the Gulf and the white sand beaches are the same.

What about the pitons, and the guy walking around bringing me drinks non-stop and the endless amount of food? My wife and I can go here for the week, all-inclusive (including airfare) for the same price as 4-5 nights in some ghetto OCMD hotel.
 

vraiblonde

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What about the pitons, and the guy walking around bringing me drinks non-stop and the endless amount of food? My wife and I can go here for the week, all-inclusive (including airfare) for the same price as 4-5 nights in some ghetto OCMD hotel.

So go. :shrug:

I presume someone vacations in a foreign country to actually, um, see that country. If all you're doing is staying at your resort, eating buffet, and drinking on the beach, your cultural exposure is low. That's not what my thread was about.
 

luvmygdaughters

Well-Known Member
We went to Jamaica last year. The ride from the airport to our resort was eye opening!!! Shacks, no roads to speak of, trash all over the place. The resort was beautiful, but, going for excursions, it was terrible. I like to think that tourism helps these countries by creating jobs. When we went to Cancun...completely different atmosphere, beautiful countryside and friendly people at the resort. I have no desire to visit Cuba, I still dont understand what the draw is for going to Cuba!!
 

luvmygdaughters

Well-Known Member
What about the pitons, and the guy walking around bringing me drinks non-stop and the endless amount of food? My wife and I can go here for the week, all-inclusive (including airfare) for the same price as 4-5 nights in some ghetto OCMD hotel.

We did all inclusive in Cancun...Loved it, we're thinking about going back next year!
 

black dog

Free America
Having worked on ships at many of the Caribbean islands over the years, I'd have to say the majority of them are sh!thole third-world countries. But I see all that because I'm working there and not staying at the lovely and very sequestered resorts that dot all those islands. I doubt most tourists staying in Guadeloupe, for example, ever see the dingy cardboard shacks the locals live in because they are kept well away from the resorts and any "tourist" trinket gathering spots. Even Cuba has some very nice tourist resorts that Non-American tourists (Europeans mostly) have been going to for years and years.

Yep, I did giggle when I read loves post " We went to Jamaica "
 

MR47930

Member
We did all inclusive in Cancun...Loved it, we're thinking about going back next year!

We've been to Jamaica 4x, Dominican Republic & St Lucia. St Lucia was my favorite but also the most expensive. Jamaica is our go-to for the money. Southwest flies direct to Montego Bay from BWI and you can be there in 3 1/2 hours.
 

luvmygdaughters

Well-Known Member
We've been to Jamaica 4x, Dominican Republic & St Lucia. St Lucia was my favorite but also the most expensive. Jamaica is our go-to for the money. Southwest flies direct to Montego Bay from BWI and you can be there in 3 1/2 hours.

If you ever go to Cancun, I highly recommend the Riu Pennisula!!!!! We looked at St. Lucia, a little to expensive for us. We also want to go back to Aruba, stopped there during a cruise and fell in love with it!!
 

vraiblonde

Board Mommy
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I like to think that tourism helps these countries by creating jobs.

My idea would be to overthrow their oppressive government and introduce them to the joys of capitalism and free market. Then they could have their own nice country instead of all the good stuff being reserved for tourists. :yay:
 

Gilligan

#*! boat!
PREMO Member
Oh, and another thing that annoys me:

Americans, please do not go to impoverished third world countries and haggle with the locals to save a couple of bucks. If the lady says the ankle bracelet is $5, pay the five and shut up. Haggling with her might save you a whole whopping dollar, which is nothing to you but is a lot of money to her. Imagine if you were selling something you made to try and scrape together money to feed your family, and Bill Gates came along and demanded a discount. That's how you look to Bahamians, Jamaicans, Mexicans, and Cubans.

In many open air markets that I've been to around the world, richer and poorer, haggling is expected..it's standard procedure. In some cases, you would be looked at like you have two heads if you decided not to haggle over a price. I've been to some higher-end craft and decorative item markets in China, for example, where they provide a nice private place to sit and a cup of tea in your hand before all parties proceed to haggle over the price of an item.

Most amusing haggling exchange I can recall was with an old Korean woman in an open-air market in some remote Korean town. She had a full slab of good beer..don't recall what brand now. I wanted the whole thing. She couldn't wrap her head around that and my hand gestures were not getting my intent across at all. LOL..she finally caught on and after a few exchanges of counting fingers we arrived at a mutually agreed price and I walked off with my slab of beer on my shoulder.
 
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vraiblonde

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In many open air markets that I've been to around the world, richer and poorer, haggling is expected..it's standard procedure.

I don't care, I'm still not doing it to people who live in poverty, and I think it makes those who do look like cheap bastages.
 

black dog

Free America
I don't care, I'm still not doing it to people who live in poverty, and I think it makes those who do look like cheap bastages.

Then you yourself have poor exposure of different cultures, many cultures its a insult not to haggle with all venders and salemen.
It's no different than the flea markets across America..
 

b23hqb

Well-Known Member
PREMO Member
Then you yourself have poor exposure of different cultures, many cultures its a insult not to haggle with all venders and salemen.
It's no different than the flea markets across America..

True dat. Same way in Costa Rica in some places. It's also an insult to not accept an offer for something to drink. That country is something else - perhaps the best, most stable economy in CA, with five star malls surrounded with barbed wire fences, guard towers manned by the police with M-4's, checkpoints getting in and out of the parking lot, while just across the creek you see cardboard and corrugated steel shanties dug into the mountain side that tend to wash away during rainy season. Complete sections of towns and seaside resorts that have nothing but villages, I guess, that have home owners from one country living in their little enclaves.
 

black dog

Free America
True dat. Same way in Costa Rica in some places. It's also an insult to not accept an offer for something to drink. That country is something else - perhaps the best, most stable economy in CA, with five star malls surrounded with barbed wire fences, guard towers manned by the police with M-4's, checkpoints getting in and out of the parking lot, while just across the creek you see cardboard and corrugated steel shanties dug into the mountain side that tend to wash away during rainy season. Complete sections of towns and seaside resorts that have nothing but villages, I guess, that have home owners from one country living in their little enclaves.

Gotta love Costa Rica, awesome offshore fishing and great people.
I have though about retiring there.
 

vraiblonde

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Then you yourself have poor exposure of different cultures, many cultures its a insult not to haggle with all venders and salemen.
It's no different than the flea markets across America..

Then they're just going to have to be insulted because I'm not going to haggle over $2 with someone who supports a family on less per day than what I spend on a margarita.
 

vraiblonde

Board Mommy
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perhaps the best, most stable economy in CA, with five star malls surrounded with barbed wire fences, guard towers manned by the police with M-4's, checkpoints getting in and out of the parking lot

Um....

Thanks for the heads up. I'll be skipping Costa Rica, too.
 
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