German Bible Goes Politically Correct

Penn · May 20, 2006

http://www.dw-world.de/dw/article/0,2144,2023998,00.html
A new German translation of the Bible is aimed at ridding the Holy Scriptures of their misogynist and anti-Semitic traits as well as flashing out the relationship between the poor and the privileged.

JPC, Sr. · May 21, 2006

Democrats Rock!

Penn said:
http://www.dw-world.de/dw/article/0,2144,2023998,00.html
A new German translation of the Bible is aimed at ridding the Holy Scriptures of their misogynist and anti-Semitic traits as well as flashing out the relationship between the poor and the privileged.

It was the Germans that produced Martin Luther and the Germans that discovered,

"The Synoptic Problem", starts a couple inched down this webpage.

so since it is German then do not discard the info too easily. :howdy:

bcp · May 21, 2006

JPC said:
It was the Germans that produced Martin Luther and the Germans that discovered,

"The Synoptic Problem", starts a couple inched down this webpage.

so since it is German then do not discard the info too easily.

I think the Bible is just fine the way it was written, no need to change it to try and force political correctness on the world.

besides, didnt the germans also give us that outstanding monarch of civil rights Hitler also?

Bustem' Down · May 21, 2006

bcp said:
I think the Bible is just fine the way it was written, no need to change it to try and force political correctness on the world.

besides, didnt the germans also give us that outstanding monarch of civil rights Hitler also?

Hey, everyone has a bad seed once in a while.

bcp · May 21, 2006

Bustem' Down said:
Hey, everyone has a bad seed once in a while.

Ah yes, those very words that JPCs mother heard so many times over the years after giving birth to him.

Bustem' Down · May 21, 2006

bcp said:
Ah yes, those very words that JPCs mother heard so many times over the years after giving birth to him.

supersurfer · May 22, 2006

I hope they didn't change this verse. I would hate to think that someone else gets the credit for creating evil. :duh:

Isaiah 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these [things].

Dondi · May 22, 2006

supersurfer said:
I hope they didn't change this verse. I would hate to think that someone else gets the credit for creating evil.

You need to understand the distinction between these two defintions of evil:

e·vil
adjective

Definition:

1. morally bad: profoundly immoral or wrong

2. harmful: deliberately causing great harm, pain, or upset.

Moral evil has to do with sin, like stealing, lying, committing adultery, and the like.

The second definition better fits the verse in question as it deals with destructive forces, such as tornados, earthquakes, fire and brimestone, you know, the wrath of God type afflictions you see in the Old Testament. It is evil in the sense that it is a commenced judgement, not a moral wrong.

I would certainly not want to caught up as a recepient of the latter definition.

Bustem' Down · May 22, 2006

Dondi said:
You need to understand the distinction between these two defintions of evil:

e·vil
adjective

Definition:

1. morally bad: profoundly immoral or wrong

2. harmful: deliberately causing great harm, pain, or upset.

Moral evil has to do with sin, like stealing, lying, committing adultery, and the like.

The second definition better fits the verse in question as it deals with destructive forces, such as tornados, earthquakes, fire and brimestone, you know, the wrath of God type afflictions you see in the Old Testament. It is evil in the sense that it is a commenced judgement, not a moral wrong.

I would certainly not want to caught up as a recepient of the latter definition.

But if he is the creator of all things, he would have had to creat Satan. If were are to have free will there has to be a good and an evil and he would have had to create it, so the first definition would apply. And that's not a bad thing.

Club'nBabySeals · May 22, 2006

bcp said:
besides, didnt the germans also give us that outstanding monarch of civil rights Hitler also?

Actually, he was Austrian. But I agree with your point otherwise. :yay:

bcp · May 22, 2006

Club'nBabySeals said:
Actually, he was Austrian. But I agree with your point otherwise.

I understand he was Austrian, yet it was the Germans that enabled him with the power to do what he did.

JPC, Sr. · May 23, 2006

Democrats Rock!

bcp said:
I understand he was Austrian, yet it was the Germans that enabled him with the power to do what he did.

Hitler considered himself and Austrians and Germans to be of Arian racial decent and thus they were considered as all blood brothers.

Otherwise Germany and Austria are just different Countries. :jameo:

2ndAmendment · May 29, 2006

supersurfer said:
I hope they didn't change this verse. I would hate to think that someone else gets the credit for creating evil.

You are always taking things out of context and choosing the worst of translations. For those interested in the Truth.

Isaiah 45:1-10
 
1Thus says the LORD to Cyrus His anointed,
          Whom I have taken by the right hand,
          To subdue nations before him
          And to loose the loins of kings;
          To open doors before him so that gates will not be shut:
     2"I will go before you and make the rough places smooth;
          I will shatter the doors of bronze and cut through their iron bars.
     3"I will give you the treasures of darkness
          And hidden wealth of secret places,
          So that you may know that it is I,
          The LORD, the God of Israel, who calls you by your name.
     4"For the sake of Jacob My servant,
          And Israel My chosen one,
          I have also called you by your name;
          I have given you a title of honor
          Though you have not known Me.
     5"I am the LORD, and there is no other;
          Besides Me there is no God
          I will gird you, though you have not known Me;
     6That men may know from the rising to the setting of the sun
          That there is no one besides Me.
          I am the LORD, and there is no other,
     7The One forming light and creating darkness,
          Causing well-being and creating calamity;
          I am the LORD who does all these. 

<h5>God's Supreme Power
</h5>    8"Drip down, O heavens, from above,
          And let the clouds pour down righteousness;
          Let the earth open up and salvation bear fruit,
          And righteousness spring up with it.
          I, the LORD, have created it.
     9"Woe to the one who quarrels with his Maker--
          An earthenware vessel among the vessels of earth!
          Will the clay say to the potter, 'What are you doing?'
          Or the thing you are making say, 'He has no hands'?
     10"Woe to him who says to a father, 'What are you begetting?'
          Or to a woman, 'To what are you giving birth?'"

Notice that verse 7 does not translate exactly the way supersurfer "quoted" it.

2ndAmendment · May 29, 2006

Bustem' Down said:
But if he is the creator of all things, he would have had to creat Satan. If were are to have free will there has to be a good and an evil and he would have had to create it, so the first definition would apply. And that's not a bad thing.

God did create satan. Satan is Lucifer, formerly an archangel. God did not create evil. God created the angels and man to have freewill. Man was created to be above the angels. Satan did not like that. Satan and a third of the angels rebelled against God.

The rebellion against the will of God is the creation of evil, so technically, satan created evil. Interesting that satan must have forgotten that God, the Potter, can destroy satan, the pot, at any time.

Mankind are the pawns in the war between God and satan, but as any good chess player knows, the game is in the proper playing of the pawns. We are fighting in a spiritual war and the outcome is already known. It is only our personal outcome that is in our hands, our freewill. Do we rebel, or do we follow God?

The war will only go on for a certain period of time. At some point, God will play the trump and the "game" will end. It's His ball, His rules, His game field. If anyone is in doubt, God wins.

2ndAmendment · May 29, 2006

Penn said:
http://www.dw-world.de/dw/article/0,2144,2023998,00.html
A new German translation of the Bible is aimed at ridding the Holy Scriptures of their misogynist and anti-Semitic traits as well as flashing out the relationship between the poor and the privileged.

Back to the topic. This should not be surprising to Christians. The Bible says it will happen, so it will.

2 Timothy 4:1-4

1I solemnly charge you in the presence of God and of Christ Jesus, who is to judge the living and the dead, and by His appearing and His kingdom:

2preach the word; be ready in season and out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort, with great patience and instruction.

3For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but wanting to have their ears tickled, they will accumulate for themselves teachers in accordance to their own desires,

4and will turn away their ears from the truth and will turn aside to myths.

2 Peter 3:3-9

3Know this first of all, that in the last days mockers will come with their mocking, following after their own lusts,

4and saying, "Where is the promise of His coming? For ever since the fathers fell asleep, all continues just as it was from the beginning of creation."

5For when they maintain this, it escapes their notice that by the word of God the heavens existed long ago and the earth was formed out of water and by water,

6through which the world at that time was destroyed, being flooded with water.

7But by His word the present heavens and earth are being reserved for fire, kept for the day of judgment and destruction of ungodly men.

8But do not let this one fact escape your notice, beloved, that with the Lord one day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years like one day.

9The Lord is not slow about His promise, as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing for any to perish but for all to come to repentance.

Penn · May 29, 2006

2ndAmendment said:
God did create satan. Satan is Lucifer, formerly an archangel. God did not create evil. God created the angels and man to have freewill. Man was created to be above the angels. Satan did not like that. Satan and a third of the angels rebelled against God.

The rebellion against the will of God is the creation of evil, so technically, satan created evil. Interesting that satan must have forgotten that God, the Potter, can destroy satan, the pot, at any time.

Mankind are the pawns in the war between God and satan, but as any good chess player knows, the game is in the proper playing of the pawns. We are fighting in a spiritual war and the outcome is already known. It is only our personal outcome that is in our hands, our freewill. Do we rebel, or do we follow God?

The war will only go on for a certain period of time. At some point, God will play the trump and the "game" will end. It's His ball, His rules, His game field. If anyone is in doubt, God wins.

THAT is one of the best explanations and bits of wisdom, I have ever read in your responses.

Bravo!

When I first joined these forums, that issue was one that we were studying in our Adult Sunday School classes, you said it all in one great passage. :yay:

fttrsbeerwench · May 29, 2006

Gee, another version of the word of God.

What are the odds?

supersurfer · May 30, 2006

2ndAmendment said:
 You are always taking things out of context and choosing the worst of translations.

You have to be an absolute moron. I have taken nothing out of context, and the translation that I used was the good old KJV, how long has it been around? It is translated from the Textus Receptus/Received Text. We can use whatever version of the Bible that you deem appropriate though.

2A said:
For those interested in the Truth. Notice that verse 7 does not translate exactly the way supersurfer "quoted" it.

Once again, semantics, depending on which version you use. The version that you just so happened to choose uses a more pussified word, it really makes no difference.

5"I am the LORD, and there is no other;

Besides Me there is no God

I will gird you, though you have not known Me;

6That men may know from the rising to the setting of the sun

That there is no one besides Me.

I am the LORD, and there is no other,

7The One forming light and creating darkness,

Causing well-being and creating calamity;

I am the LORD who does all these.

In this scripture, "God" is showing his God-head, eternal power, and sovereigty. "He" is saying that EVERYTHING is because of "himself".

What's the opposite of the rising of the sun? Could it be the setting sun?

How about the opposite of Light? Darkness, that's right. Good boy!

Okay, stay with me here, I know it's a stretch, but how about the opposite of Peace.....ooops, I mean well-being. Surely it can't be Evil......doh, I mean "Calamity".

Do you also get the mental picture of the three stooges being formed when God says he created calamity? :lol:

2ndAmendment · May 30, 2006

supersurfer said:
You have to be an absolute moron. I have taken nothing out of context, and the translation that I used was the good old KJV, how long has it been around? It is translated from the Textus Receptus/Received Text. We can use whatever version of the Bible that you deem appropriate though.
Once again, semantics, depending on which version you use. The version that you just so happened to choose uses a more pussified word, it really makes no difference.
In this scripture, "God" is showing his God-head, eternal power, and sovereigty. "He" is saying that EVERYTHING is because of "himself".

What's the opposite of the rising of the sun? Could it be the setting sun?

How about the opposite of Light? Darkness, that's right. Good boy!

Okay, stay with me here, I know it's a stretch, but how about the opposite of Peace.....ooops, I mean well-being. Surely it can't be Evil......doh, I mean "Calamity".

Do you also get the mental picture of the three stooges being formed when God says he created calamity?

Thanks. I think you're a dingbat yourself. Now that we have the insults out of the way ...

Many times when only one verse is quoted, it is out of context. Isaiah 45:7, when quoted with the preceding and following verses is more clear in my opinion.

Yes, the translators of the KJV did choose words that had other meanings that are often more clear that the meaning chosen.

Here is the verse in question from the Amplified Bible.

Isaiah 45:7 (Amplified Bible)

7I form the light and create darkness, I make peace [national well-being] and I create [physical] evil (calamity); I am the Lord, Who does all these things.

Bustem' Down · May 30, 2006

2ndAmendment said:
God did create satan. Satan is Lucifer, formerly an archangel. God did not create evil. God created the angels and man to have freewill. Man was created to be above the angels. Satan did not like that. Satan and a third of the angels rebelled against God.

The rebellion against the will of God is the creation of evil, so technically, satan created evil. Interesting that satan must have forgotten that God, the Potter, can destroy satan, the pot, at any time.

Mankind are the pawns in the war between God and satan, but as any good chess player knows, the game is in the proper playing of the pawns. We are fighting in a spiritual war and the outcome is already known. It is only our personal outcome that is in our hands, our freewill. Do we rebel, or do we follow God?

The war will only go on for a certain period of time. At some point, God will play the trump and the "game" will end. It's His ball, His rules, His game field. If anyone is in doubt, God wins.

But god created satan, so he created evil. It's not a bad thing, if he didn't create evil, we couldn't have free will.

German Bible Goes Politically Correct

Dancing Up A Storm

JPC, Sr.

Guest

In My Opinion

Give Peas a Chance

In My Opinion

Give Peas a Chance

New Member

Dondi

Give Peas a Chance

Where are my pants?

In My Opinion

JPC, Sr.

Guest

Just a forgiven sinner

Just a forgiven sinner

Just a forgiven sinner

Dancing Up A Storm

New Member

New Member

Just a forgiven sinner

Give Peas a Chance