Revolution

[vraiblonde]

I've been reading a thumbnail book about world history - Mental Floss' History of the World, to be exact.

Anyway, looking back through all of the conflicts, government failures, and regime changes throughout history, almost none of them came about because of voting some politician in or out of office. Typically things got bad enough that the citizens staged a revolt and heads rolled. Or some other leader type person came along and slaughtered the existing leadership.

We've been fighting over land, religion, money, power, etc, since time began. And it usually ends with a bunch of dead people and a conquered nation.

So maybe it's inevitable that we are taken over by some hostile force. Maybe 100 years from now, the US will cease to exist and we'll be a Chinese or Muslim territory. And maybe in 1,000 years, our descendants will be reading about us like we read about the Roman Empire.

I have nothing terribly insightful or profound to say, but it struck me how things never change - even over a span of several thousand years.

 

[Vince]

Don't think I'll be around to see it, but it is enevitable, with the current slide into the liberal way of life, that this government with get overthrown by some other power. You can't have a bunch of wimps in charge too long before someone is going to walk in and take it all away from them. :shrug:

 

[Gilligan]

So maybe it's inevitable that we are taken over by some hostile force. Maybe 100 years from now, the US will cease to exist and we'll be a Chinese or Muslim territory. And maybe in 1,000 years, our descendants will be reading about us like we read about the Roman Empire..

If that did not turn out to be the case..it would indeed be a first in the history of human life forms. It's a question of when, not if.

 

[vraiblonde]

You can't have a bunch of wimps in charge too long before someone is going to walk in and take it all away from them.

That, or the folks get fed up and storm the Bastille. That happened a lot when governments tried to over-control their citizenry.

 

[philibusters]

If that did not turn out to be the case..it would indeed be a first in the history of human life forms. It's a question of when, not if.

Pretty much, but with humans it does seem all things eventually come to an end. The last 1000 years have been dominated by the thoughts and ideas that originated in Western Europe--who derived a lot of their ideas from the earlier western tradition in the mediterrean. The Muslims had their day and at various times different civilizations have been the most advanced civilization of their time. Even in the last 1000 years some Islamic societies were very advanced and there was a brief time, maybe two or three generations where Mongul empire was the advanced military and economic empire in the world (most military though, through the military patrolling and policing trade routes they were advanced economically too).

 

[vraiblonde]

What'd be cool is if the Israelis came in, kicked our asses, and took us over. They've been hanging in there for all these years, despite practically every other nation in the world trying to eradicate them throughout history. Hell, even we try to weaken them enough so some Arab country can wipe them off the face of the map.

So I'm rooting for the Jews!

 

[PsyOps]

So maybe it's inevitable that we are taken over by some hostile force.

"We cannot continue to rely on our military in order to achieve the national security objectives that we've set. We've got to have a civilian national security force that's just as powerful, just as strong, just as well-funded." - Barack Obama

:shrug:

 

[Larry Gude]

Don't think I'll be around to see it,

Why do you think that?

China is currently our banker. Our military is frazzled. Our troops are hostages in three places to nuclear weapons; Korea, A'stan (Pakistan) and Iraq (Iran) to nations that can not touch us otherwise.

Our economy is a wreck with the loss of some 7-10 million manufacturing jobs the last decade. We make less and less.

Our people are fat, lazy and diabetic.

Our kids want to be an American Idle (voted to the top, not earn it).

Our government is in a position to exert ever more control over the people including proposals to control the internet.

More and more people are dependent on government for their livelihoods.

We are an energy dependent. We do not exploit our own resources on anywhere near the scale we need to.

We've taught the Chinese how to fly missiles straight, are making enemies around the world rich off our gasoline dollars and we paid for Iran's bomb.

Our culture is fractured, no longer a melting pot, with clear delineations in language and national association.

And Obama says France...FRANCE...is our number one ally.

Other than that, things are fine but, still, why do you think you won't see it?

 

[vraiblonde]

:shrug:

Well, he's full of crap. No dictator wants a civilian security force - they want troops that THEY control. So he's just saying that because he's stupid, or he's hoping we're stupid enough that we'll think he means it. I'm pretty sure the last thing any of those tyrants want is an armed citizenry taking matters into their own hands.

 

[jetmonkey]

Pretty much, but with humans it does seem all things eventually come to an end. The last 1000 years have been dominated by the thoughts and ideas that originated in Western Europe--who derived a lot of their ideas from the earlier western tradition in the mediterrean. The Muslims had their day and at various times different civilizations have been the most advanced civilization of their time. Even in the last 1000 years some Islamic societies were very advanced and there was a brief time, maybe two or three generations where Mongul empire was the advanced military and economic empire in the world (most military though, through the military patrolling and policing trade routes they were advanced economically too).

werd?

 

[PsyOps]

Well, he's full of crap. No dictator wants a civilian security force - they want troops that THEY control. So he's just saying that because he's stupid, or he's hoping we're stupid enough that we'll think he means it. I'm pretty sure the last thing any of those tyrants want is an armed citizenry taking matters into their own hands.

Really? The storm troopers, and SS of Hitler? With every dictator, they have some form of militant backing. There is no way otherwise to force their way.

What is your vision of what this "Civilian National Security Force" will look like? What makes you think they wont be some sort of uniformed security/military force? What makes you think he doesn't already have loyal followers at the ready; well armed and funded. Try to remember there is still about half of that stimulus money hanging out there as Obama's personal slush fund.

 

[vraiblonde]

Really? The storm troopers, and SS of Hitler? With every dictator, they have some form of militant backing. There is no way otherwise to force their way.

And that's what I'm saying. He doesn't want a true civilian security force - he wants "security" that he controls. Like Hitler controlled his "civilian" security forces.

He gets dummies all rah-rahed up about civilians helping to protect our nation, so they won't think about protecting themselves against our elected leadership. If Obama really wanted a civilian security force, he'd be funding and supporting the Border Patrol.

 

[Merlin99]

And that's what I'm saying. He doesn't want a true civilian security force - he wants "security" that he controls. Like Hitler controlled his "civilian" security forces.

He gets dummies all rah-rahed up about civilians helping to protect our nation, so they won't think about protecting themselves against our elected leadership. If Obama really wanted a civilian security force, he'd be funding and supporting the Border Patrol.

Or a particular union full of thugs that are available at a moments notice.

 

[somdwatch]

Timing

It's possible (I think) to start a draft for DHS. That slush fund you mention could just be waiting for that disaster they don't want to waste.
The excuse would be DHS needs recruits because we have just become an uncivil society that needs policing from within.

 

[PsyOps]

It's possible (I think) to start a draft for DHS. That slush fund you mention could just be waiting for that disaster they don't want to waste.
The excuse would be DHS needs recruits because we have just become an uncivil society that needs policing from within.

If it were to be for the purpose of a coup of our current form of government it would have to be loyal followers. I don't think you will get this in any existing government agency. It would fall under the guise of funding groups like SEIU or ACORN that bring the appearance of working for the 'social good'.

 

[vraiblonde]

The excuse would be DHS needs recruits because we have just become an uncivil society that needs policing from within.

See, NOW you're thinking like a dictator

And the example they can use will be this Tucson shooting, which is being overplayed so hard in the media you have to be suspicious of their motives. This administration and its acolytes are unprecedented in their hysteria and finger-pointing toward their opponents, to the point that they want to shut down oppositional news reporting.

And make no mistake, this so-called "civilian force" will not be civilians at all. They will indeed be government employees.

They called Bush Hitler, but it appears someone needs to bone up on their history a bit.

 

[Toxick]

easy 4 u sidelinerz 2 rant & summize!

and by sidelinerz you mean "citizenz"?


r u sayin dat unless u r in a elected offiz u shud keep ur opinion to urself?




u will mayk a xellent despot somedayz. ftw!!!

 

[vraiblonde]

and by sidelinerz you mean "citizenz"?


r u sayin dat unless u r in a elected offiz u shud keep ur opinion to urself?




u will mayk a xellent despot somedayz. ftw!!!

You engage homeless people talking to themselves on the street, don't you?

Because if Lance and his quoters take over this thread, I will delete it because it will cease to be interesting.

 

[LC_Sulla]

I've been reading a thumbnail book about world history - Mental Floss' History of the World, to be exact.

Anyway, looking back through all of the conflicts, government failures, and regime changes throughout history, almost none of them came about because of voting some politician in or out of office. Typically things got bad enough that the citizens staged a revolt and heads rolled. Or some other leader type person came along and slaughtered the existing leadership.

We've been fighting over land, religion, money, power, etc, since time began. And it usually ends with a bunch of dead people and a conquered nation.

So maybe it's inevitable that we are taken over by some hostile force. Maybe 100 years from now, the US will cease to exist and we'll be a Chinese or Muslim territory. And maybe in 1,000 years, our descendants will be reading about us like we read about the Roman Empire.

I have nothing terribly insightful or profound to say, but it struck me how things never change - even over a span of several thousand years.

Like you said, things change, but are essentially the same. Old boss = New boss. Do you ever wonder why it has to be so? Is this one of the reasons you are not a big on faith?

 

[vraiblonde]

Do you ever wonder why it has to be so?

I wonder why people are so stupid that they don't learn from history they were taught in jr high and high school. Or even from modern day examples. It's just incredibly frustrating, which is why I've given up on the news and such and started watching the Kardashians and Wife Swap. At least that's somewhat entertaining.

Is this one of the reasons you are not a big on faith?

I think religious faith passes the buck. It says that what you do in your life doesn't matter because it's all in someone else's hands anyway - not a whole lot different than the various gods our ancestors worshiped. If you appease your god(s), they won't let bad things happen to you, which we know realistically is bunk.

That's another thing that hasn't changed over thousands and thousands of years: our insistence on worshiping various gods. Throughout history, whenever we can't explain something rationally or scientifically, we say it's God.