steppinthrax
Active Member
Non-Waldorf like?
How long do you guys think the Calvert Area will remain.....
- Thread starter steppinthrax
- Start date
NorthBeachPerso
Honorary SMIB
If you look at the growth and Comprehensive Plans, and they're followed, it will never ne "Waldorf like". Prince Frederick kind of got away from them for awhile but it's been pretty much reined in.
Growth has to be directed to the Town Centers, that's also in Plan Maryland, where sewer and water service controls growth.
What happened was that growth controls were put in place back in the late 1980s but there was a lag time before they took effect. Every property owner or developer filed sub-division plats during that lag. That was what was being built until about 10 years ago. Those sub-divisions are pretty much built out now so those controls enacted back then have really taken hold.
Outside Town Centers sewer and water availability is going to govern growth, especially sewer. The County has been divided into 4 tiers: Tier 1 is where sewer and water is now in place; Tier 2 is where it's planned to go in the future; Tier 3 is never going to get it and Tier 4 is Resource Conservation where no building can go.
Tier 3 development is controlled by disallowing septic systems in developments with more than 9 or 10 lots. They have to be connected to or have a sewer facility constructed. That means that there will be very little development in those areas.
Growth has to be directed to the Town Centers, that's also in Plan Maryland, where sewer and water service controls growth.
What happened was that growth controls were put in place back in the late 1980s but there was a lag time before they took effect. Every property owner or developer filed sub-division plats during that lag. That was what was being built until about 10 years ago. Those sub-divisions are pretty much built out now so those controls enacted back then have really taken hold.
Outside Town Centers sewer and water availability is going to govern growth, especially sewer. The County has been divided into 4 tiers: Tier 1 is where sewer and water is now in place; Tier 2 is where it's planned to go in the future; Tier 3 is never going to get it and Tier 4 is Resource Conservation where no building can go.
Tier 3 development is controlled by disallowing septic systems in developments with more than 9 or 10 lots. They have to be connected to or have a sewer facility constructed. That means that there will be very little development in those areas.
kom526
They call me ... Sarcasmo
Calvert has done a good job in sticking to its comprehensive plan, St. Mary's eh, not so much. Not all of Charles County is Waldorf. Just saying. The north end of St. Mary's is up for review soon and that is why the big issue in this year's elections here is the keep waldorf in waldorf crap. There is a lot more to it than that fear mongering.
aps45819
24/7 Single Dad
Unless we get a cruise line terminal at Solomons
Beta
Smile!
Don't be so sure (about the jobs part). Government employees get a much higher bang for their buck in Southern Maryland than they do in the DC area. Better housing opportunities and better commutes. How is that less desirable than more expensive areas, making the same wages, in the majority of metro DC?
St. Mary's did just fine as well. Everything was stuffed into the Lexington Park district - which just happens to sprawl up RT 235.
What's made it Waldorf like is that each developement project was done on it's own, meaning seperate entrances / exits.
You have one road serving both commuters AND commerical traffic.
We have harranged about the traffic patterns around the Kohls/Dicks strip center, think about the impact of the Hickory Hills strip center.
To go north on leaving the center you have to quickly traverse the right turn lane AND three traffic lanes to get to the farthest left turn lane to make the U-turn. I include the right turn lane because people are not using it to just make turns, it's the express lane between WalMart and Chancellors run road. I selected Hickory Hills because it's the closest to the light which makes getting over to make the U-turn all that more difficult.
But say for instance you live south and want to go to Plaza Tolteca for a meal, you have to go to the next light and make a U-turn.
Typically people making U-turns take more time to complete than a simple left. Plus you have to compete to get into the express lane to make the right.
A number of these centers existed, more have been added, but the Waldorf (301) mess in St. Mary's is completely to "plan".
They just forgot the plan about moving vehicles in and out of these locations. (Well techincally not, since that's what FDR Blvd was suppose to do, interconnect these centers. But nobody wants that built).
CrashTest
Well-Known Member
It depends on what you mean by "waldorf like." Are you referring to the traffic/congestion? Perhaps its the out of control crime and mayhem? Maybe its the urban sprawl you referring to?
Well I would imagine that as long as Calvert and St. Mary's keep putting dampers on who and how things can develop they can keep "Waldorf" out for the next 10 years. Of course your going to have houses where multiple families move in and pool the money together to expand their horizons, but due to the lack of massive amounts of low income housing, I don't see an influx of DC vouchers coming to Calvert County. Waldorf also has become a choke point for people traveling from King George to DC during their commute, and other parts, which Calvert/St. Mary's doesn't deal with. So as far as the roads/congestion or urban sprawl, its not happening.
As far as the crime is concerned, Calvert/St. Mary's needs to get a handle on their drug problem and start hitting the doors of these dealers and fiends. If they are all locked up, it will bring down the burglaries and robberies that are driven by addiction. Calverts chase policy keeps many of thug far north in PG and West in Waldorf, as they know that the Calvert Sheriffs will chase you, ram you, and destroy you if you come there to commit high crimes and misdemeanors in Calvert County. Thugs know that their already suspended license and odor of alcohol on their breath will earn them a year in jail, which is far greater than the 3 days in time out they are used to in DC/PG. As long as the criminal justice system stays strong and doesn't bow the liberal philosophies of "let em go" and "don't chase them" then things will stay the way they aught to be in Calvert County.
The reason Prince Frederick is becoming a cesspool is because not only did the low income housing go unchecked there, but some genius opened "treatment" and "addiction" centers. This imported crime from DC/PG as the fiends and addicts got released and soon found Prince Frederick to be a target rich environment (law abiding unarmed citizens). The one thing Calvert does have going for it is many cops live down there. DC, PG, Anne Arundel, and alot of their own sheriffs/troopers live down there, as the county provides good schools, relatively lower crime than say Charles or PG counties, and a states attorneys office that doesn't prosecute homeowners for defending their homes using firearms.
So provided your politicians don't sell out to developers like they did in Charles, I see Calvert remaining that quiet community for the next 10 years, with the most exciting thing on the police blotter is a few thefts, some vandalisms, and DUI/Drug arrests, a stark contrast from the murders and armed robberies north of the line.
Well I would imagine that as long as Calvert and St. Mary's keep putting dampers on who and how things can develop they can keep "Waldorf" out for the next 10 years. Of course your going to have houses where multiple families move in and pool the money together to expand their horizons, but due to the lack of massive amounts of low income housing, I don't see an influx of DC vouchers coming to Calvert County. Waldorf also has become a choke point for people traveling from King George to DC during their commute, and other parts, which Calvert/St. Mary's doesn't deal with. So as far as the roads/congestion or urban sprawl, its not happening.
As far as the crime is concerned, Calvert/St. Mary's needs to get a handle on their drug problem and start hitting the doors of these dealers and fiends. If they are all locked up, it will bring down the burglaries and robberies that are driven by addiction. Calverts chase policy keeps many of thug far north in PG and West in Waldorf, as they know that the Calvert Sheriffs will chase you, ram you, and destroy you if you come there to commit high crimes and misdemeanors in Calvert County. Thugs know that their already suspended license and odor of alcohol on their breath will earn them a year in jail, which is far greater than the 3 days in time out they are used to in DC/PG. As long as the criminal justice system stays strong and doesn't bow the liberal philosophies of "let em go" and "don't chase them" then things will stay the way they aught to be in Calvert County.
The reason Prince Frederick is becoming a cesspool is because not only did the low income housing go unchecked there, but some genius opened "treatment" and "addiction" centers. This imported crime from DC/PG as the fiends and addicts got released and soon found Prince Frederick to be a target rich environment (law abiding unarmed citizens). The one thing Calvert does have going for it is many cops live down there. DC, PG, Anne Arundel, and alot of their own sheriffs/troopers live down there, as the county provides good schools, relatively lower crime than say Charles or PG counties, and a states attorneys office that doesn't prosecute homeowners for defending their homes using firearms.
So provided your politicians don't sell out to developers like they did in Charles, I see Calvert remaining that quiet community for the next 10 years, with the most exciting thing on the police blotter is a few thefts, some vandalisms, and DUI/Drug arrests, a stark contrast from the murders and armed robberies north of the line.
HeavyChevy75
Podunk FL
It depends on what type of work that you do for the good jobs.
I think people think about the congestion along 301 when they are talking about development.
So in a way, the idea of putting everything into a "town center" is forcing a "Waldorf" like appearance.
By law they cannot exclude development, they can control it within reason. By "can't", I mean property owners will sue the government if the restrictions are such that the governement destroys the exonomic benefit of their property. Courts have allowed governements to restrict, within reason, development. But they have also been sensitive to out right exclusion.
Unfortunately the "plan" in the state of Maryland is to allow for development, but to not "encourage it" by denying the infastructure needed - the biggest one being roads, water and sewer.
So in St. Mary's we jammed everything into the "dump" district - Lexington Park. Without regard to the impact to the main N/S corridor in the county.
So in a way, the idea of putting everything into a "town center" is forcing a "Waldorf" like appearance.
By law they cannot exclude development, they can control it within reason. By "can't", I mean property owners will sue the government if the restrictions are such that the governement destroys the exonomic benefit of their property. Courts have allowed governements to restrict, within reason, development. But they have also been sensitive to out right exclusion.
Unfortunately the "plan" in the state of Maryland is to allow for development, but to not "encourage it" by denying the infastructure needed - the biggest one being roads, water and sewer.
So in St. Mary's we jammed everything into the "dump" district - Lexington Park. Without regard to the impact to the main N/S corridor in the county.
steppinthrax
Active Member
Where are you getting this Tier information from, I'm curious.....
steppinthrax
Active Member
What do you mean by Somd? Your talking everything (waldorf, laplata, white plains, calvert????)... Most of the people I know who live in SoMd work in DC, as well as those who live in NoVa and PG county, so I don't know what you mean!!!! Amenities, I could care less there is no mall in my county!!!!
NorthBeachPerso
Honorary SMIB
When did that change in attitude take place?
NorthBeachPerso
Honorary SMIB
Start with Plan Maryland and work down:
http://www.plan.maryland.gov/
http://www.co.cal.md.us/index.aspx?NID=1340
acommondisaster
Active Member
I hear there's no shortage of heroin users there. So in that way, it's already like Waldorf.
Speaking of upscale retail ..grocery stores, shops, restaurants...............malls should close...everywhere
I don't see SM as an attractive area for expansion ...thus far, those retailers don't either. Northern Virginia is full of it. It's nice to have options.
there is one thing about a well run mall, everything is in one spot, you don't have to drive up and down the road into separate parking lots.
Had a nice, upscale mall near my plant. We use to run down once or twice a week for lunch. Food court offered something for everyone, like those that had a sandwich could just buy soda or fries.
Then we would head off and run a quick errand (card store, book store, radio shack, etc.) then back to the plant.
At Christmas you could comparison shop when looking for gifts. Saved on gas, just foot power.
But I agree, SM could not or would not support a decent mall, we prefer Walmart to Nordstrom
steppinthrax
Active Member
I hate malls.....
1. Congestion (esp during holidays).
2. Attracts teenyboppers.
3. Attracts other bad elements (gangs, etc..)
4. A place where my wife spends my money.