Is Gun Ownership a Right?

GURPS

INGSOC
PREMO Member
What does the Second Amendment say? Is gun ownership a right for all Americans? Or just for a small militia? Eugene Volokh, Professor of Law at UCLA, explains what the Founding Fathers intended.





What Should We Do About Guns?

Would stricter gun laws reduce gun violence? Could gun control measures in places like Australia work in America? Nicholas Johnson, professor of Law at Fordham University, explains.


 

glhs837

Power with Control
So I read a review of Prager U videos a short while back in a left leaning outlet. Tone was admiring, actually. They explained what it is, and how it works, and most importantly, how it does NOT work, how it makes very sure to not appear to be a shouting screaming outlet for conservative rage. They point out that it makes very sure to stick to verifiable facts, and give sources, and that it looks to be the best way out there to counter the liberal lean to the modern edu-industrial complex. They pointed out the goal seems to be not so much converting liberals, or confirming things conservatives already know, but rather to start now with high school and college kids to seed the next generation of conservatives before they get too "imprinted" by that same edu-industrial complex. At least let the kids know there are other ways of looking at problems.
 

GURPS

INGSOC
PREMO Member
:yay:

the fact YouTube has attempted demonetize their videos tells me all I need to know
 

vraiblonde

Board Mommy
PREMO Member
Patron
I don't need to watch a video or listen to anyone else's opinion. I can simply refer the the United States Constitution, to wit:

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

Note that "the right of the people" part.

If anyone is still confused, there's the good old dictionary:

mi·li·tia
məˈliSHə/
noun
noun: militia; plural noun: militias

a military force that is raised from the civil population to supplement a regular army in an emergency.


Note that "civil population" part.

Unless you're retarded, the 2A clearly states that the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed, which means that gun ownership is indeed a right of all Americans.
 

glhs837

Power with Control
I don't need to watch a video or listen to anyone else's opinion. I can simply refer the the United States Constitution, to wit:

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

Note that "the right of the people" part.

If anyone is still confused, there's the good old dictionary:

mi·li·tia
məˈliSHə/
noun
noun: militia; plural noun: militias

a military force that is raised from the civil population to supplement a regular army in an emergency.


Note that "civil population" part.

Unless you're retarded, the 2A clearly states that the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed, which means that gun ownership is indeed a right of all Americans.



And thats fine, but just repeating that over and over, if discussing this with someone who doesnt get that doesnt help you make any headway, it helps to be able to counter the arguments they make simply and factually. I'm engaged with an engineer I know, non-gun owner, who, from what he sees in the press and a lot on FB, thinks the 2nd amendment supporters have no case to make beyond "Mah Second Amendment, your arguments are invalid". He views that as not very helpful. I took the time to talk to him about the real things that 2nd Amedment proponents actually think might help mitigate the "gun violence", and he was very receptive.
 

Starman

New Member
Surely gun ownership is NOT a right. Rights cannot be taken away by government, but privileges can.

If you believe otherwise then you are saying that our rights are derived from government and not our humanity, i.e., our Creator.
 

PsyOps

Pixelated
Surely gun ownership is NOT a right. Rights cannot be taken away by government, but privileges can.

If you believe otherwise then you are saying that our rights are derived from government and not our humanity, i.e., our Creator.

Then life is not a right since it can be taken away from you. Life is only a privilege.

The operative word you leave out of this is: LEGALLY. The government is legally forbidden to infringe on these rights. There are limitations, but they cannot, under American law, just arbitrarily take these rights away from us.

It is clearly defined, both in the constitution and documented words of our founders, that we have a right to keep and bear arms. Only until due process has been run through on someone that committed a crime can the government repeal your rights.
 

vraiblonde

Board Mommy
PREMO Member
Patron
Surely gun ownership is NOT a right. Rights cannot be taken away by government, but privileges can.

If you believe otherwise then you are saying that our rights are derived from government and not our humanity, i.e., our Creator.

Good little Hitler Youth fascist. :patpat: Keep gobbling up your propaganda. Nom nom nom.
 

LightRoasted

If I may ...
If I may ...

On the matter of “military weapons,” the Supreme Court ruled that:

The Second Amendment’s guarantee of the “right to bear arms” pertains to individuals and not, as some insist, to militia.
The Second Amendment’s prefatory clause [a “well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State“] may include citizens’ right to bear military weapons because today’s military has sophisticated weapons that government didn’t have in the 18th century. To ban individual right to such weapons would effectively render meaningless the prefatory clause’s “well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State”.

“We also recognize another important limitation on the right to keep and carry arms. Miller [United States v. Miller, 307 U. S. 174] said . . . that the sorts of weapons protected were those ‘in common use at the time.’ 307 U. S., at 179. We think that limitation is fairly supported by the historical tradition of prohibiting the carrying of ‘dangerous and unusual weapons.’ […] It may be objected that if weapons that are most useful in military service—M-16 rifles and the like—may be banned, then the Second Amendment right is completely detached from the prefatory clause [a “well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State”]. But as we have said, the conception of the militia at the time of the Second Amendment’s ratification was the body of all citizens capable of military service, who would bring the sorts of lawful weapons that they possessed at home to militia duty. It may well be true today that a militia, to be as effective as militias in the 18th century, would require sophisticated arms that are highly unusual in society at large. Indeed, it may be true that no amount of small arms could be useful against modern-day bombers and tanks. But the fact that modern developments have limited the degree of fit between the prefatory clause and the protected right cannot change our interpretation of the right.” (pp. 58-59)
 
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Sapidus

Well-Known Member
I don't need to watch a video or listen to anyone else's opinion. I can simply refer the the United States Constitution, to wit:

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

Note that "the right of the people" part.

If anyone is still confused, there's the good old dictionary:

mi·li·tia
məˈliSHə/
noun
noun: militia; plural noun: militias

a military force that is raised from the civil population to supplement a regular army in an emergency.


Note that "civil population" part.

Unless you're retarded, the 2A clearly states that the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed, which means that gun ownership is indeed a right of all Americans.



You are missing the "well regulated" part since there is no education, or in other words regulation, part when any idiot can go and buy a gun just because they are 18 in some places and have money.
 

Gilligan

#*! boat!
PREMO Member
You are missing the "well regulated" part since there is no education, or in other words regulation, part when any idiot can go and buy a gun just because they are 18 in some places and have money.

Where did they say that everyone was required to devote any time to training?
 

Sapidus

Well-Known Member
Where did they say that everyone was required to devote any time to training?

Take your time, shortbus.

I guess you don't understand all the words in the sentence

A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.


You seem to understand Infringed and right and necessary. Try looking up well regulated and read all the words together.

You can do it!
 

Gilligan

#*! boat!
PREMO Member
I guess you don't understand all the words in the sentence

A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.


You seem to understand Infringed and right and necessary. Try looking up well regulated and read all the words together.

You can do it!

Where did they say that everyone was required to devote any time to training?

I'll wait.

Here's a hint, shortbus: Every able-bodied man keeping firearms at home or on their person was recognized as a necessary prerequisite for having a militia.
 

vraiblonde

Board Mommy
PREMO Member
Patron
It's kind of scary that there are so many presumably English speaking Americans who have such a hard time with words and their meanings.
 

Gilligan

#*! boat!
PREMO Member
It's kind of scary that there are so many presumably English speaking Americans who have such a hard time with words and their meanings.

What's even scarier is that they can vote. And even scarier than that...some of the most brain dead of them even get elected to public office.
 

PsyOps

Pixelated
You are missing the "well regulated" part since there is no education, or in other words regulation, part when any idiot can go and buy a gun just because they are 18 in some places and have money.

What does "well regulated" mean to you? And what do you think they (the founders) meant by militia?
 
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Sapidus

Well-Known Member
Where did they say that everyone was required to devote any time to training?

I'll wait.

Here's a hint, shortbus: Every able-bodied man keeping firearms at home or on their person was recognized as a necessary prerequisite for having a militia.


Good job. You are really getting close now. You must have your thesaurus out.

You still didn't answer my question. What does well regulated mean to you, gramps?
 

Gilligan

#*! boat!
PREMO Member
You still didn't answer my question. What does well regulated mean to you, gramps?

It only means one thing..to me or anyone else....well..anyone except idiots like yourself, as you continue to miss the point: Every able-bodied man keeping firearms at home or on their person was recognized as a necessary prerequisite for having a militia.

Do you understand what a "precondition" or a "prerequisite" is, shortbus?
 
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