A dagger to the heart of Frist and Ried

[Pete]

The deal just announced made both of those gentlemen look foolish and exstreem. 7 Republicans and 7 Democrats led by McCain have usurped their parties leadership. The pretty much crashes any hopes Frist had at the white house. It also makes Ried vulnerable to be ousted as minority leader.

Now these "centrist" Republicans and Democrats face severe punishment from their parties leadership. I think Frist and Ried had both better temper their wrath because all it would take is for some of these centrists to pull a Jeffords and switch parties and they would be screwed. Collins and Snowe, both considered RINO's are the 2 that come to mind who could swap parties, both are from Maine, a solidly blue state, both very popular and do not fear being outsted in the next ellections.

I applaud these 14 centrists who took a stand and negotiated.

 

[Spoiled]

Finaly, they got over the petty bullsh-t and got something done... well kinda

 

[2ndAmendment]

McCain is the biggest RINO in the Senate. I watch what is going on in Washington and just wonder how long this house of cards can last.

 

[Larry Gude]

This is why I love Byrd so much...

...the vanity and self interest of individual Senators is a thing to behold!

 

[Larry Gude]

Ps...

...Frists Presidential aspirations were done with Schiavo. You can't take the wrong side of such a big issue and become President. This just makes his year worse.

 

[Larry Gude]

This really ought to be fascinating...

...how this plays out.

The groups on the left who were ordering and paying for obstructing these folks can't be happy. Ried looks worse-er and worse-er er.

The folks on the right who were really pushing for them, along with the President, come out smelling like roses because these people ALWAYS had the votes if they could just get to the floor. Bush is un-tarnished. Frist is actually OK because what he needed to get done is going to happen anyway.

Maybe McCain made a deal to sabotage one of them?

I think I'll how this is playing at DUh land...

 

[willie]

Byrd said....."I say thank God," said Sen. Robert Byrd (news, bio, voting record), a West Virginia Democrat. "We have lifted ourselves above politics."

What a partisan jerk.

 

[Pete]

...how this plays out.

The groups on the left who were ordering and paying for obstructing these folks can't be happy. Ried looks worse-er and worse-er er.

The folks on the right who were really pushing for them, along with the President, come out smelling like roses because these people ALWAYS had the votes if they could just get to the floor. Bush is un-tarnished. Frist is actually OK because what he needed to get done is going to happen anyway.

Maybe McCain made a deal to sabotage one of them?

I think I'll how this is playing at DUh land...

I agree the Republicans look much better in the outcome. McCain I believe purposely did this to destroy Frist because 1. He doesn't like the party leadership and 2. he is going to run again and he saw Frist as an obsticle. I do not believe the Schievo deal was the undoing of Frist. He had many on his side, the Schievo story would be 3 years old by the time he ran, and many Republicans IF they still remembered or cared about Scheivo would overlook it because of his stance on more important issues.

Now McCain can come out to the podium in 2007 and say "Look at me, I singlehandedly did what the majority leader could not do. I compromised, reached across the aisle and averted a senatorial/national/constitutional crisis. Senator Frist did not posess the leadshrship ability I did and still do".

McCain and the Senator from NE (name slips my mind) took a burning stick and poked their leaders in the eye with it. their will be hell to pay, but it will have to dished on the low down. Both Frist and Reid will look like total losers if the punish the 14 who bailed on them and the public hears about it.

It will be interesting how it plays out. Unfortunately the party dealinging will be done in back rooms and we will never know.

 

[vraiblonde]

What happened? What deal was made?

I've been busy learning the difference between "div id" and "div class"

 

[willie]

...how this plays out.



I think I'll how this is playing at DUh land...

The DUh's don't like it. It seems that most of them are watching Boxer on C Span and are in love with her. I'm trying to think of something to post about her that they won't ban me but what can a rational (me) person say about Barbara Boxer that is good?
That is a disorganized website, not surprising.

 

[Bruzilla]

Once again... some RINO sold out the party for a couple of beads. The Democrats get everything they want and we get nothing that we wouldn't have gotten anyway.

'Tis a sad day.

 

[willie]

Once again... some RINO sold out the party for a couple of beads. The Democrats get everything they want and we get nothing that we wouldn't have gotten anyway.

'Tis a sad day.

The Democrats wanted obstruction and they didn't get that. Bush wants an up or down vote and he got that. Many of the nominee's will be confirmed now instead of maybe never. That's a big Republican plus. The filabuster has been here forever so it will be a little longer before it's eliminated.

 

[Tonio]

I've been busy learning the difference between "div id" and "div class"

That's what I do for a living. Since you're the Board Mommy, I assumed you already had a solid background in HTML.

 

[Tonio]

...Frists Presidential aspirations were done with Schiavo. You can't take the wrong side of such a big issue and become President. This just makes his year worse.

I agree. I don't think it's necessarily a bad thing that these senators went against the party leadership. The leadership seems too beholden to the narrow special interests like unions and fundamentalists. How many of the GOP centrists are dissatisfied with Bush's initiatives that seem contrary to the traditional Republican philosophy of small government? I see Frist's and Bush's involvment in the Schiavo case as very big-government in principle, regardless of their motives.

 

[Larry Gude]

I never said that...

"I'd give Tonio some money to buy a clue, but there isn't enough money in the world for that." – Larry Gude

I am mis quoted.

 

[Larry Gude]

I'll take it!

Once again... some RINO sold out the party for a couple of beads. The Democrats get everything they want and we get nothing that we wouldn't have gotten anyway.

'Tis a sad day.

The three Sith Lords the Democrats MUST defeat will now help rule the Empire and where there are two, there are four, no more, no less. There is no promise as to what will be done with all but two who can now be filibustered. Bantha fodder. Disposable clones.

Yoda Ried looks as though the Force has completely drained from him. he has nothing left but nonsensical blathering and pained expressions.

Senator Frist gains nor loses.

And through it all, the Dark Lord himself, Darth Byrd, rubs his hands together as visions of Rushmore dance through his not yet enfeebled brain.

And yes, young Annie McCain has given yet another titty twister to both friend and foe. The Force is strong with this one, strong but clouded.

 

[Pete]

The three Sith Lords the Democrats MUST defeat will now help rule the Empire and where there are two, there are four, no more, no less. There is no promise as to what will be done with all but two who can now be filibustered. Bantha fodder. Disposable clones.Yoda Ried looks as though the Force has completely drained from him. he has nothing left but nonsensical blathering and pained expressions.

Senator Frist gains nor loses.

And through it all, the Dark Lord himself, Darth Byrd, rubs his hands together as visions of Rushmore dance through his not yet enfeebled brain.

And yes, young Annie McCain has given yet another titty twister to both friend and foe. The Force is strong with this one, strong but clouded.

I understood that while the fillibuster was still an option, the 7 Democrats who signed on agreed to vote for cloture if it was being used when there was not a significant reason to do so.

Who defines "significant reason" is the fuzzy part.

Compromise is good. I listened to Bennet this morning and he and his guests were livid that the Republicans did not lop off heads and eliminate the Judicial fillibuster. Part of me does as well because it has been used as an obstructionist tool rather than a tool of sincere dissent.

The part of me afraid of eliminating it is the part who looks into the future when the Democrats regain control of the Senate (someday, maybe never but the possibility still exists and is 50-50) and they are voting on a dress wearing gay pride activist judge from the 9th circuit court of appeals to be a Supreme court justice and the Republicans have no way to stop it.

Eliminating the fillibuster is a good move only if there is 100% certainty the Democrats will not regain a majority in the Senate and the way these bufoons look half the time I would say that a Republican majority is not a certainty.

 

[Larry Gude]

Pete...

Who defines "significant reason" is the fuzzy part.

This is clear; it is up to each Senator to decide. You could call an individuals definition of 'significant reason' the fuzzy part or you could call it the half of the loaf they got to give up the oterh half; the agreement to allow W's most cherished to attain the throne.

Who cares about the rule? If it is so easy to change it is just as easy to change back. The fact is this is no 'nucular' option. This is NOTHING new. Orin Hatch laid out yesterday how Bob Byrd himself had done the EXACT same thing numerous times as chair of this very judicial committee back in the late 70's to do the same thing; end filibisters on the committee.

This thing has been blown into something it is NOT. Which is why it is so hilarious watching McCain, Warner, Byrd et al run around as heros for pulling the nation and the Constitution from a burning building that merely was a back yard BBQ.

The fact remains that the Democratic party was trying to run itself off the cliff because they were in the wrong and John McCain and his constiuents, the media, will be having a love fest for awhile for coming to the rescue.

And W got most of his people without staining his shirt.

 

[Pete]

This is clear; it is up to each Senator to decide. You could call an individuals definition of 'significant reason' the fuzzy part or you could call it the half of the loaf they got to give up the oterh half; the agreement to allow W's most cherished to attain the throne.

Who cares about the rule? If it is so easy to change it is just as easy to change back. The fact is this is no 'nucular' option. This is NOTHING new. Orin Hatch laid out yesterday how Bob Byrd himself had done the EXACT same thing numerous times as chair of this very judicial committee back in the late 70's to do the same thing; end filibisters on the committee.

This thing has been blown into something it is NOT. Which is why it is so hilarious watching McCain, Warner, Byrd et al run around as heros for pulling the nation and the Constitution from a burning building that merely was a back yard BBQ.

The fact remains that the Democratic party was trying to run itself off the cliff because they were in the wrong and John McCain and his constiuents, the media, will be having a love fest for awhile for coming to the rescue.

And W got most of his people without staining his shirt.

Ah, Byrd did try but it failed as well. The rule so far has managed to escape intact. Once it is broken then it will flip flop forever and the party who does it first will be tainted.

I thought about what keeps the Republicans from changing the rule, then on the eve of elections change it back, if the election turns out bad they are safe maybe (if they are not in the minority too much) if they stay in the majority change it back again?

I have a feeling that by doing this they would be giving the Democrats a primer on how to screw the country good if they ever get back into power. We all sit and think that the American public is failry solidly Republican, and that goobers on the left fringe could not get elected or stay in office past 1 term but I remind you of Kennedy, Boxer, Feinstien, Frank, Rangel

 

[Bruzilla]

What would have happened if Frist had used the nuclear option:

1. All of Bush's nominees would have gotten a vote, which was all that they wanted to begin with.
2. If Reid followed through on his threats to slow down the Senate to a stop, the Democrats would have looked like crap.
3. The Democrats would look bad because they weren't able to stop any of the judges.
4. Bush would be able to nominate some conservative judges to the Supreme Court, and we wouldn't have to worry about Democrats messing things up.

Now, after the agreement what do we have:

1. Some of the judges will get a vote, but it's pretty clear that not all of them will.
2. Frist looks like a weak leader, while Reid, now that he doesn't have to go through with his threat to slow down the Senate, is being played up in the press as embracing the agreement while Frist is condemning it.
3. Although the Dems will lose some points for letting some of the judges through, they can still claim victory for blocking others.
4. They can still fillibuster on their own terms as they are the ones who decide when the time is right to do so, and you can bet the fillibuster talk will start again once the Supreme Court comes into play.

So, in the end, the Democrats end up with everything they wanted, plus the bonus of fooling many Americans into thinking that the Republicans were the source of all the problems, while the Republicans lose everything... again. Yes, some judges will now get their votes, but we would have had votes on all the judges, so that's not a "win."