Bush Gun Ban Underway

[Bruzilla]

For those of you who have been distracted by Katrina and gas prices, the Bush administration just allowed the first ban of specific firearms since Slick Willie's grab in 1994.

The BATF has now made it illegal to import parts guns for rebuilding into completed firearms. This means that all those cheap AK-47s, H&K G-3s and CETMEs, and L1A1s are now banned. Say goodbye to the $400 assault rife.

Thanks George!

 

[Vince]

And I guess they think that this will stop the criminals from getting these parts and building up assualt weapons. Yeah. Sure. Can you say, "more stupid gun laws."

 

[itsbob]

Do you have a link??

I didn't think it was illegal anymore to import WHOLE Ak-47's... they are just talking about gun parts.. like if you can buy a WHOLE AK-47, then just buy the parts to make it an automatic.. etc...

 

[Bruzilla]

http://www.atf.gov/firearms/081205openletter.pdf

What this states is that if it's illegal to import an entire foreign-made firearm, it is now illegal to import frames, barrels, receivers, etc., that can be assembled, using US-made parts, into legal firearms. The previous requirement was that there had to be some US-made parts in the guns to make them legal, but as of Oct 1 that's no longer the case. Importers who have existing transfers in place can still bring the parts in until Jan 06, and after that all imports are illegal.

 

[2ndAmendment]

You can bet it is a pay back for some liberal support of some Bush program.

 

[Bruzilla]

I want to know why the NRA has been so quiet on this.

 

[Ken King]

Hasn't the ban on these type parts been the law since 1988 and it is just now being enforced with the latest interpretation by the BATF?

 

[dustin]

Say I wanted a new part for my semi-auto AK-47. This part is also shared with the fully auto version. I would not be able to purchase this part because it is also used in the fully auto version? Or any parts for my semi-auto AK-47 period....

 

[Bruzilla]

Hasn't the ban on these type parts been the law since 1988 and it is just now being enforced with the latest interpretation by the BATF?

Almost right. The previous "interpretation" was that any firearm that was minus a frame or receiver was no longer considered a firearm and could be imported. These parts kits could then be legally reassembled into firearms using a US-made receiver and some other US made parts, and they were considered US-made firearms. This led companies like Century Arms to invest in making receivers for Garands, L1A1s, CETME, G-3, and AK-series firearms and mate them with US and foreign-made parts. Under the new interpretation the ban expands from receivers to receivers, frames, and barrels, which essentially eliminates the ability to rebuild the guns in the US unless someone makes a serious investment in tooling up.

 

[Ken King]

Maybe I’m not seeing the problem here. It seems that the intent of the allowable importation in this instance was solely for the repair and replacement of components and not for the creation of new weapons. Those manufacturing new weapons with these parts would already be outside of the scope of the permit that they obtained and as such their activity should be halted.

 

[Bruzilla]

Ken, I think the point that you're missing is in the opening sentence of the referenced paragraph:

3) is of a type that does not fall within the definition of a
firearm as defined in section 5845(a) of the Internal Revenue
Code of 1986 and is generally recognized as particularly suitable
for or readily adaptable to sporting purposes, excluding surplus
military firearms, except in any case where the Attorney General
has not authorized the importation of the firearm pursuant to
this paragraph, it shall be unlawful to import any frame,
receiver, or barrel of such firearm which would be prohibited if
assembled; or

Under that definition, only the receiver of a rifle, or the frame of a handgun, is considered to be a firearm. For example, I can purchase an AR-15 rifle kit that's made in the USA that contains every part for the rifle except the lower receiver, and the kit is not considered to be a firearm. Conversely, if I purchase just the lower receiver, without any additional parts, it is considered to be a firearm and must be transferred as such. Under this definition, the importation of receiver-less kits was not covered by this para because they were not considered as firearms but as just parts. Under the new interpretation gun kits are considered to be firearms and cannot be imported, although I can still get domestic kits with no such restrictions.

 

[Ken King]

Here is the definition:

TITLE 26 > Subtitle E > CHAPTER 53 > Subchapter B > PART I > § 5845

§ 5845. Definitions

For the purpose of this chapter—
(a) Firearm
The term “firearm” means
(1) a shotgun having a barrel or barrels of less than 18 inches in length;
(2) a weapon made from a shotgun if such weapon as modified has an overall length of less than 26 inches or a barrel or barrels of less than 18 inches in length;
(3) a rifle having a barrel or barrels of less than 16 inches in length;
(4) a weapon made from a rifle if such weapon as modified has an overall length of less than 26 inches or a barrel or barrels of less than 16 inches in length;
(5) any other weapon, as defined in subsection (e);
(6) a machinegun;
(7) any silencer (as defined in section 921 of title 18, United States Code); and
(8) a destructive device. The term “firearm” shall not include an antique firearm or any device (other than a machinegun or destructive device) which, although designed as a weapon, the Secretary finds by reason of the date of its manufacture, value, design, and other characteristics is primarily a collector’s item and is not likely to be used as a weapon.
(e) Any other weapon
The term “any other weapon” means any weapon or device capable of being concealed on the person from which a shot can be discharged through the energy of an explosive, a pistol or revolver having a barrel with a smooth bore designed or redesigned to fire a fixed shotgun shell, weapons with combination shotgun and rifle barrels 12 inches or more, less than 18 inches in length, from which only a single discharge can be made from either barrel without manual reloading, and shall include any such weapon which may be readily restored to fire. Such term shall not include a pistol or a revolver having a rifled bore, or rifled bores, or weapons designed, made, or intended to be fired from the shoulder and not capable of firing fixed ammunition.

So what does this mean as it pertains to the discussion? If I can take this useless matter and add a receiver so it now functions is it or isn't it a firearm?

 

[Bruzilla]

So what does this mean as it pertains to the discussion? If I can take this useless matter and add a receiver so it now functions is it or isn't it a firearm?

Before Oct 1 2005 this useless matter was not a firearm, after Oct 1 2005 it is.

 

[Ken King]

Before Oct 1 2005 this useless matter was not a firearm, after Oct 1 2005 it is.

So if I understand all of this (and trust me it's still a little gray around the edges) what BATF is doing is enforcing the laws already on the books that were previously overlooked and not making any new laws, right?

 

[RiverBunny]

Say I wanted a new part for my semi-auto AK-47. This part is also shared with the fully auto version. I would not be able to purchase this part because it is also used in the fully auto version? Or any parts for my semi-auto AK-47 period....

Without turning this into a full blown debate - can I just ask what you would want a personal AK-47 for?

 

[dustin]

Without turning this into a full blown debate - can I just ask what you would want a personal AK-47 for?

Why would one not want an AK-47?

umm..seriously...because I like the weapon.

Why do people like Indian food? It's a matter of taste...

 

[Nickel]

Without turning this into a full blown debate - can I just ask what you would want a personal AK-47 for?

He is starting a militia. We're in charge of snacks for this week's meeting.

 

[AK-74me]

Without turning this into a full blown debate - can I just ask what you would want a personal AK-47 for?

Umm did you not see the aftermath of Katrina?

Why wouldn't a gun owner want one:

Affrordable: check
Reliable: check
Readily Available Cheap Ammo: check
Evil Looking: check
High Capacity: check
Good Versatile Round: Check

And besides all of that it is my 2nd Amendment right

 

[Vince]

Why would one not want an AK-47?
umm..seriously...because I like the weapon.

Pick me. Pick me. I want one too.

 

[Bruzilla]

So if I understand all of this (and trust me it's still a little gray around the edges) what BATF is doing is enforcing the laws already on the books that were previously overlooked and not making any new laws, right?

What they are doing is redefining a bag of parts as a firearm, hence making it applicable to the law. They are not making any new laws, just redefining what constitutes a "firearm", but for imports only. The bag o' parts is still a bag o' parts if it's all made in the USA.

For example, I just bought another L1A1 this week. At some point, this rifle was an FN/FAL rifle somewhere in the World. It was torn down to component parts, the receiver was removed, and it was all stuffed into parts bins with parts from other rifles. These parts were all shipped to the US, along with their barrels and frames, and this was allowed because at the time these parts were not considered to be firearms, and the law was not applicable. The parts were then mated up with a CAI receiver and some other US made parts and made into an L1A1.

With the change of view with the BATF, these parts are now considered to be a "firearm", and now do fall under the law. In fact, okay... kinda fact as I can't document it, I have been told that these parts were often shipped in as "scrap metal", which is technically true.