Court Rules Second Amendment Doesn’t Protect AR-15s

direxpgw

Member
Corrosive primer ammo is supposed to last longer than non corrosive, or so they say. My guess is this is why it was produced in bulk by the Soviets as well as cost. Really not that much more difficult to clean but does require a bit more effort. All WW2 era ammo is corrosive and much will still function fine today. Bottom line is the AK is a much more economical and simple platform and that is why it is used all over the world. Again, not bashing the M16. It is more accurate, is a great gun, can carry more ammo. Def more expensive as well.
 

black dog

Free America
PREMO Member
Corrosive primer ammo is supposed to last longer than non corrosive, or so they say. My guess is this is why it was produced in bulk by the Soviets as well as cost. Really not that much more difficult to clean but does require a bit more effort. All WW2 era ammo is corrosive and much will still function fine today. Bottom line is the AK is a much more economical and simple platform and that is why it is used all over the world. Again, not bashing the M16. It is more accurate, is a great gun, can carry more ammo. Def more expensive as well.
Primers using non-corrosive chemicals were developed in the 1920s, but these were generally used in civilian ammunition only, as the early non-corrosive primers did not last as well in storage as corrosive primers. Due to this, military ammunition tended to use corrosive primers and this was indeed the case for US military ammunition until the early 1950's. We learned what, 30 plus years before them that corrosive primers were not the Shizzle.

And why do you believe that it's cheaper to manufacture and maintain a AK verse's an AR?
 

Gilligan

#*! boat!
PREMO Member
Corrosive primer ammo is supposed to last longer than non corrosive, or so they say. My guess is this is why it was produced in bulk by the Soviets as well as cost. Really not that much more difficult to clean but does require a bit more effort. .
Just to clarify, since I shoot a lot of corrosive ammo (7.62x54r and 7.62 x 25) )...it's not more "effort" that is required so much as it is the immediacy. You need to clean the firearm very soon after firing it and use water or (what I use) Windex to remove the residue, before applying any gun oil. A bore snake makes that easy to deal with in the field. Even though many of the "soviet" weapons have chrome-lines barrels, the corrosion on other affected parts (breech area and any muzzle attachment) will start pretty quickly and you'll be sorry if you put the weapon back in the cabinet without cleaning it and go back a month later.. Ask me how I know this ;-) My son pretty much ruined the bore on what was a pristine 91/30 Mosin that way...I worked the bore over aggressively with wire brushes etc later but the damage was done and bore pitted.
 

Hijinx

Well-Known Member
I would like to stop with the experts here having a discussion on the performances of different weapons and ammunition and get back on track.

IMO the courts, or rather this Judge is wrong, and this should go to a higher court, but what happens in the interim?
How many people lose their rights and their weapons.?
Can this be held in abeyance until a proper court rules on it?
Has anyone filed for a hearing before a real judge.
 

black dog

Free America
PREMO Member
Just to clarify, since I shoot a lot of corrosive ammo (7.62x54r and 7.62 x 25) )...it's not more "effort" that is required so much as it is the immediacy. You need to clean the firearm very soon after firing it and use water or (what I use) Windex to remove the residue, before applying any gun oil. A bore snake makes that easy to deal with in the field. Even though many of the "soviet" weapons have chrome-lines barrels, the corrosion on other affected parts (breech area and any muzzle attachment) will start pretty quickly and you'll be sorry if you put the weapon back in the cabinet without cleaning it and go back a month later.. Ask me how I know this ;-) My son pretty much ruined the bore on what was a pristine 91/30 Mosin that way...I worked the bore over aggressively with wire brushes etc later but the damage was done and bore pitted.
I have seen dozens of AK gas systems in my life glued shut from white and green fungus growing in the barrel and gas system.
Never have seen that happen with the M16 platform, but I have seen a few stop running when they seized from running hot from lack of lubrication.
You gotta run all of them wet..
 

black dog

Free America
PREMO Member
I would like to stop with the experts here having a discussion on the performances of different weapons and ammunition and get back on track.

IMO the courts, or rather this Judge is wrong, and this should go to a higher court, but what happens in the interim?
How many people lose their rights and their weapons.?
Can this be held in abeyance until a proper court rules on it?
Has anyone filed for a hearing before a real judge.
Sure it's wrong, but it will stand. Just like in Maryland, it's gotta be a heavy barrel AR.
 

Merlin99

Visualize whirled peas
PREMO Member
So you have no real life experience with either rifle then..
The Russians used corrosive primers for decades after us, do you think that using corrosive primers did not cause huge maintenance with firearms?
When the gas system and the bolt started growing fungi, it was anything but a reliable rifle.
The M16 platform out preforms the AK in every category, from ease of maintenance, to field repair to accuracy.
That's why the M16 is still in Service with so many Militarys today.
Except for cost of manufacture. A milled receiver is inherently costlier than stamped /folded steel.
 

black dog

Free America
PREMO Member
Except for cost of manufacture. A milled receiver is inherently costlier than stamped /folded steel.
Have you ever seen how fast a four or five axis cnc can mill a lower and a upper?
No huge presses, no multiple stamping dies, welding, rivets, heat treatment ,pressed in barrels with a chunk of hammer forged aluminum. Lock the block of aluminum in the CNC and hit the green button.
I have yet to see a AK lower being sold for 29.99 retail. Anderson and other manufacturers put them on sale often for that.

And let's not forget that the best AK's had a machined receiver.
 

LightRoasted

If I may ...
If I may ...

IMO the courts, or rather this Judge is wrong, and this should go to a higher court, but what happens in the interim.
The courts this and the courts that. F*ck the courts. There have been so many things decided over the course of this Nation as unconstitutional, and yet laws, when, on the face, prima facie, that are obviously, when it comes to firearms, unconstitutional, are deemed to be constitutional. Where, in the broadest sense, when it comes to the 1st, 4th, 5th, and others, court decisions are construed, the vast majority of the time, to favor the people. F*CK the courts. The people can decide themselves what is Constitutional or not.
 

Merlin99

Visualize whirled peas
PREMO Member
Have you ever seen how fast a four or five axis cnc can mill a lower and a upper?
No huge presses, no multiple stamping dies, welding, rivets, heat treatment ,pressed in barrels with a chunk of hammer forged aluminum. Lock the block of aluminum in the CNC and hit the green button.
I have yet to see a AK lower being sold for 29.99 retail. Anderson and other manufacturers put them on sale often for that.

And let's not forget that the best AK's had a machined receiver.
Have you seen the price for the CNC machine, an AK receiver can be punched out with a bearing press and a cheap set of dies.
 

Merlin99

Visualize whirled peas
PREMO Member
never seen an AR Lower that cheap ... even 80% lowers
I'm pretty sure that's what he meant, buying a complete lower is the same as buying a complete gun. Also, the last two lowers I bought were within 50 cents of that price.
 

black dog

Free America
PREMO Member
Have you seen the price for the CNC machine, an AK receiver can be punched out with a bearing press and a cheap set of dies.
It would be tough to run a gun manufacturing business building AK's with a 20 ton bearing press and dies bought off Gun Broker. You gonna setup and drill the holes in the receiver with a piece of paper printed out on a bubble jet and drill them with a Dewalt cordless?

At least the vintage 80% Mac 10 lowers came bent and sometimes had pilot holes drilled.
 

black dog

Free America
PREMO Member
29.99

2 months ago
(58)
76
Primary Arms
Anderson Manufacturing AR-15 Stripped Lower Receiver - $29.99

Brownells had them on sale a month ago for 35.00
 

Gilligan

#*! boat!
PREMO Member
I just saw where a PA representative is floating a semi-automatic rifle ban bill.

With the 10s of millions of such rifles in circulation - and millions on millions of them unmarked and unknown because they were built from 80% lowers - what do these morons really think is going to happen when they "ban" them?
 

black dog

Free America
PREMO Member
I just saw where a PA representative is floating a semi-automatic rifle ban bill.

With the 10s of millions of such rifles in circulation - and millions on millions of them unmarked and unknown because they were built from 80% lowers - what do these morons really think is going to happen when they "ban" them?
I had to dig for it,
Here's a 80% er from back in the dark ages, my first ex ordered it from work so it wouldn't get missed in the mail. I believe it was 25 bucks plus 1.63 shipping then.
It's now worth a few bucks being a Cobray stamped frame.

20180411_162521.jpg

20180411_162533.jpg
 
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