Democrats and republican presidents and deficits

GURPS

INGSOC
PREMO Member
Good. Glad we agree that Trumps economic policies and those of past republican presidents lead to an increased deficit while the policies of Democratic presidents lead to a reduced deficit.


That is a BOLD FACED LIE


All the facts are there.

YOU have yet to POST ANY Facts ...... all you offer is Fantasy, Supposition, Innuendo and Unfounded OPINION
 

Sapidus

Well-Known Member
That is a BOLD FACED LIE




YOU have yet to POST ANY Facts ...... all you offer is Fantasy, Supposition, Innuendo and Unfounded OPINION


Okay. All you have to do is prove your statement which you can’t since I’ve already posted the proof of my argument.

Idiot
 

This_person

Well-Known Member
Okay. All you have to do is prove your statement which you can’t since I’ve already posted the proof of my argument.

Idiot
That is a misstatement, but one that should be understood by you so therefore it is a lie.

You posted a correlation without a bit of causation. You are either so stupid you fell for the dihydrous monoxide prank, or, you are smart enough to understand it and you send it out as truth anyway.

Did you look up to see who had control of Congress for those periods?
 

Sapidus

Well-Known Member
That is a misstatement, but one that should be understood by you so therefore it is a lie.

You posted a correlation without a bit of causation. You are either so stupid you fell for the dihydrous monoxide prank, or, you are smart enough to understand it and you send it out as truth anyway.

Did you look up to see who had control of Congress for those periods?


Do you have any proof to the contrary or just more spit and froth and anger?


Why can’t you prove it untrue if it’s so obvious?
 

This_person

Well-Known Member
Do you have any proof to the contrary or just more spit and froth and anger?


Why can’t you prove it untrue if it’s so obvious?

Well, that's not how "proof" works. One does not prove something untrue. One proves that A causes B. Simply because it is true that B often follows A, that does not mean that A causes B.

For example, all serial killers in the last 300 years have eaten bread, therefore bread causes some people to become serial killers. Those two things correlate at virtually 100%, so serial killers MUST be caused by eating bread.

Of course, that is untrue. But, it is not meant to be true, it is meant to show you the difference between correlation and causation.

You can show that sometimes there are Democrat presidents when deficits fall, and sometimes Republican presidents when deficits rise. Those are correlations. However, that those two things happen in some kind of correlation does not prove a darned thing about the cause of the deficits' trajectories.

To make your point valid, you have to show what specific policies each of those presidents had that had the definitive impact, barring all others, on deficits. For example, every Congressperson must be the same, with the same attitudes and voting histories and influences on other Congress people. The state of the economy which is NOT under presidential control (i.e., all of it) must remain constant. Roughly 1,000,000,000,000 other factors must all remain constant.

What you have is a single piece of information that shows......nothing. Unless and until the president is 100% responsible for the economy and writing/passing/enforcing all aspects of taxation and government spending, you have a correlation without causation.

So, I'm not sure what else I can tell you other than all of this obvious information you should have understood since junior high school. If you still don't get how your claim is woefully invalid, I really can't help you any more. I have explained it to you in excruciating detail, you have to meet me half way at least and think.
:buddies:


BTW, did you look up to see who had control of congress those periods?
 

awpitt

Main Streeter
Excuse me Mr. Spastic, can we cut aide to illegal aliens such as healthcare, apartments, food stamps for unemployables, transgender mutilations for mentally ill humans, whales???

.......
Are undocumented immigrants eligible for federal public benefit programs?

Generally no. Undocumented immigrants, including DACA holders, are ineligible to receive most federal public benefits, including means-tested benefits such as Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program (SNAP, sometimes referred to as food stamps), regular Medicaid, Supplemental Security Income (SSI), and Temporary Assistance for Needy Families (TANF). Undocumented immigrants are ineligible for health care subsidies under the Affordable Care Act (ACA) and are prohibited from purchasing unsubsidized health coverage on ACA exchanges.

Fact Sheet: Immigrants and Public Benefits
 

PsyOps

Pixelated
Actually, presidents AND congress create deficits. One can't do it without the other.

This is largely true, except in the case when the senate passes a veto-proof bill. My point ran along the lines of "congress holds the purse strings". They ultimately determine how spending will occur. The president signing a spending bill is agreeing with it, but not determining it. I place far more responsibility on congress than I do presidents when it comes to spending. The only caveat I might place on that is things like stimulus spending like Bush and Obama signed. I place massive stimulus, that falls outside of budgets, that are designed to save failed economic sectors, squarely on the one person that could say no to it - the president.
 

awpitt

Main Streeter
This is largely true, except in the case when the senate passes a veto-proof bill. My point ran along the lines of "congress holds the purse strings". They ultimately determine how spending will occur. The president signing a spending bill is agreeing with it, but not determining it. I place far more responsibility on congress than I do presidents when it comes to spending. The only caveat I might place on that is things like stimulus spending like Bush and Obama signed. I place massive stimulus, that falls outside of budgets, that are designed to save failed economic sectors, squarely on the one person that could say no to it - the president.

I still have to stand by my statement that one cannot spend money without the other. Presidents do play a role in determining the budget. An equal role. They send their budget request to the Congress followed by negotiations where the president makes clear what he would be willing to sign. Yes, there is the possibility of the house and senate passing identical bills with veto proof majorities but I have about an equal chance of winning the Power Ball lottery.

Bottom line, the president and the congress are equal partners in passing and approving federal spending.
 

awpitt

Main Streeter
That "fact" sheet is lying. Illegal aliens are in fact being housed and fed and their health cared for at American taxpayer expense, and many even receive a stipend for incidentals. You see them on the news all the time - who do you think is paying for that?

I'm sorry but it's not lying. It specifically addresses federal benefits. It also mentions that each of the 50 states make there own decisions on who and who doesn't receive benefits. So, if you see illegals getting benefits, that's an issue that needs to be taken up with the state govt. As far as federal benefits, the information in the fact sheet I posted is truthful.
 

PsyOps

Pixelated
I still have to stand by my statement that one cannot spend money without the other. Presidents do play a role in determining the budget. An equal role. They send their budget request to the Congress followed by negotiations where the president makes clear what he would be willing to sign. Yes, there is the possibility of the house and senate passing identical bills with veto proof majorities but I have about an equal chance of winning the Power Ball lottery.

Bottom line, the president and the congress are equal partners in passing and approving federal spending.

The ironic part of this whole thing is... when something goes wrong, it's Trump's fault. When something goes right - like the economy - Obama gets the credit. I avoid blaming or giving credit to presidents when congress has an equal role (as you say) in just about everything.
 

awpitt

Main Streeter
The ironic part of this whole thing is... when something goes wrong, it's Trump's fault. When something goes right - like the economy - Obama gets the credit. I avoid blaming or giving credit to presidents when congress has an equal role (as you say) in just about everything.

I'm sure you know that this isn't unique to Trump. People have been giving credit and assigning blame based on who is controlling each part of the govt long before either of us were ever around.
 

PsyOps

Pixelated
I'm sure you know that this isn't unique to Trump. People have been giving credit and assigning blame based on who is controlling each part of the govt long before either of us were ever around.

Yeah, and I'm sure you don't see the obsessive attacks against Trump as rather unprecedented.
 

awpitt

Main Streeter
Yeah, and I'm sure you don't see the obsessive attacks against Trump as rather unprecedented.

Like I said, these types of attacks are not unique to Trump. Additionally, with all the p*ssing contests he initiates, he's that last one who should be complaining.
 

PsyOps

Pixelated
Like I said, these types of attacks are not unique to Trump. Additionally, with all the p*ssing contests he initiates, he's that last one who should be complaining.

Are you kidding me? Are you watching what congress is doing? Without citing one crime that Trump has committed, they are pushing to impeach him. It's like the Mueller investigation all over again; have an investigation to find a crime rather than investigate an actual crime that was committed.
There was an interview (I think it was Warren, I'm trying to find it) where she was asked what crime Trump committed, and in her inability to come up with one she simply stated that he's crude and says ugly things and is a racist.

Why can't you anti-Trump types just admit you don't like the guy and those are the grounds in which you demand he be removed from office?
 
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