Since you failed on the bug analogy you delve into the ridiculous. But I guess I’ll entertain it just for the sake of… who knows what?
We’ve had people go into orbit, even at fair distances from earth take photos and return to earth. They have seen it, touched it, and orbited around it. They were able to experience it firsthand.
No one has gone to a black hole, no one has touched it, no one has orbited around one. You’ve only gotten faint photos of objects they claim are reacting to it. Oh, and math to support what those objects are doing. Math that may turn out to be false (mentioned later in this response).
Photos? Those don't count. Photos are two dimensional, God just
made it look like the planet was round. Our imperfect perception of the world around us tricked people into thinking it was round. YOU haven't seen it!
BTW, the evidence we have for what black holes do preclude our visiting one let alone touching or orbiting it. Again, we see objects moving in space, around something we can't see. That something has been named a black hole. No matter what we learn about it later, no matter how wrong our current perceptions of it may turn out to be, it will still be a black hole. We have naming rights.
The one thing physicists and astronomers BELIEVE a black is, is a place in space with massive gravity pulling everything into. So, it’s not something that is merely a name of some undefined event. They believe they KNOW what a black hole is doing.
Just like you atheists like to throw the Flying Spaghetti Monster as a means to show how ridiculous it is to believe in a God, I can easily say that's what you’re seeing way out there is that very same thing… there are thousands, maybe millions of Flying Spaghetti Monsters running around the universe devouring galaxies. I mean we’ve never seen this monster, but devoid of a better explanation, that’s what it HAS to be.
Who believes they know again?
They have
theories and don't presume said
theories to be anything more. We've speculated as to it's nature and that's it. No one is stating anything about the nature of black holes then REFUSING to call their statement wrong in the face of new evidence.
maybe it is, who knows?! If someone provides evidence for what we call a black hole actually having characteristics consistent with a satirical character then I suppose we'll have to re-name it. Whatever it is, whatever we call it, there is still something out there sucking up matter and energy. We're currently calling it a black hole and using the
theory general relativity to presume that the force is gravity. What science is trying to do is to define it's nature, to learn more about it. There is SOMETHING out there doing SOMETHING because we can see things moving and can't figure out why, that's why we came up with the
theory.
And just in case you missed it...
theory...
THEORY.
Read the wiki article on black holes, the word theory (and other forms of the word) is used 45 times, predict is used 13 times, consider is used 3 times. The word fact is used twice and neither time used to describe a black hole rather once WRT the fact that gravitational force of an object does not depend on it size (surface area and gravitational force are not directly proportional) and once WRT a direct, observed measure of entropy increasing.
You asked why I continue to go after black holes as a counter. I ask, why do you continue to go after Christianity (or any other religion) as your target for debate? Why is it so important that you spend so much time trying to discredit it? You chose my faith, I chose certain aspects of science that most people like you believe are absolutely true.
Because I'm in a religious forum? I think...is this a trick question?
I had no idea there had been a survey done...most people "like me" believe we know exactly how black holes work?
(I'm being facetious, I know
)
I did not choose your faith, you did. We could very well be having this debate if you were a Jew, a Muslim or a Hindu. Makes no difference to me :shrug:
The biggest flaw in science right now is physicists like Michio Kaku talk about black holes as if they not only are absolutely what they claim they are, but they are the key to unlocking the ‘mysteries’ of the universe. Real? So humans find one particular phenomenon in space and believe THIS is IT; the big cheese that will reveal everything. As vast and probably billions of corners of the universe not even discovered and we humans think we figured it out?
I don't recall hearing him say that. Maybe he did. And maybe he really does believe that. That doesn't make it true. Nice thing about the scientific community, there isn't a single spokesperson!
(Kaku is a Christian-Buddhist BTW, in case you care to note the irony of you choosing him for your example. He's also a futurist, bit of a different class there, much more philosophical. I'd have gone with Hawking if I were you...you know, the guys to claimed to have figured out black holes and was proven wrong? The guy who is desperately trying to figure the darn things out? The guy who CLAIMED TO DISPROVE THE EXISTENCE OF GOD?!
)
Wait...you said that Kaku "...talk(s) about black holes as if they ... are absolutely what they claim they are..." AND that "...{black hoels) are the key to unlocking the ‘mysteries’ of the universe..."? But if he thought we understood it all already, then they mysteries would already be explained...
Now they are discovering – MAYBE – that neutrinos travel faster than light. This ‘discovery’ aims to blow all of Einstein’s theories out of the water. Theories the scientific community has placed all their efforts on. Everything he claimed could potentially be wrong. And this discovery – as I have tried to point out multiple times – only found here on earth. Who knows what might be discovered in some distant galaxy a few trillion light years away; that there are particles that travel 20X the speed of light. That the dynamics for physics that we have learned here, don’t even come close to applying somewhere else in the universe.
We’re so narcissistic to believe we can unlock the mysteries of things we can’t even come close to calculating in our limited confines.
See, that's what makes science different. It take more than ONE experiment, more than ONE occurrence and more than ONE location. It happened and now they're all trying to figure it out. But seriously, what do you think is more likely...that they goofed the experiment? Or that EVERYTHING IS WRONG?!
Kaku actually spoke on this, you should watch it!
Transcript
What If Einstein Is Wrong? | Michio Kaku | Big Think
I like what he point out at the end:
Michio Kaku said:
So here's the rub. Why should we believe this CERN experiment over a distance of 454 miles when over a distance of tens of thousands of light years neutrinos and light beams hit the earth at the same time? That’s why many physicists believe that they must have made a systematic error someplace and the weak link, the weak link in this whole chain of reasoning is the GPS system, and the GPS system itself is a relativistic system. So in some sense they’re using relativity to defeat relativity and I think there is something circular about that.
Never said that at all Zguy28. That was UNA's "take" on my comments.
Actually the beef is what you have with God for not showing Himself to you personally.
)