Girl, 14, gave birth, then strangled baby

[Baja28]

kinda a waste to have them around when then. It is pretty bad to what extent people will go to to not feel guilty about supporting abortion.

The whole things almost is a B flick horror movie - smashing heads and poking feet.

At least vraiblonde just comes right out an says abort up to 18 years of age. (I think she said that).

You have no concept of how pain receptors work or you wouldn't make such a stupid post. Or maybe you would because god told you to.

 

[withrespect]

You have no concept of how pain receptors work or you wouldn't make such a stupid post. Or maybe you would because god told you to.

 

[PsyOps]

I personally think that many (certainly not all) who are so adamantly "pro-choice" are that way because they have an abortion in their past and they feel deep-seeded guilt from it, and that in many cases they even block it out in a deeply repressed memory that they pretend does not exist, kind of like an adult who was abused as a child. They often deal with this by advocating "choice" for others, so that they feel justified for their deeply rooted shameful act.

 

[nomoney]

I personally think that many (certainly not all) who are so adamantly "pro-choice" are that way because they have an abortion in their past and they feel deep-seeded guilt from it, and that in many cases they even block it out in a deeply repressed memory that they pretend does not exist, kind of like an adult who was abused as a child. They often deal with this by advocating "choice" for others, so that they feel justified for their deeply rooted shameful act.

You're an idiot

 

[RoseRed]

You're an idiot

Hiya stranger!

 

[withrespect]

Kumbayaaaa my Lord.....Kumbaya

 

[Baja28]

I personally think that many (certainly not all) who are so adamantly "pro-choice" are that way because they have an abortion in their past and they feel deep-seeded guilt from it, and that in many cases they even block it out in a deeply repressed memory that they pretend does not exist, kind of like an adult who was abused as a child. They often deal with this by advocating "choice" for others, so that they feel justified for their deeply rooted shameful act. Guilt is kind of like a weed. It seems small and easy to deal with at first. However, no matter how many times you cut it back or try to ignore it, it just keeps growing and eventually becomes unbearable. Many women go through severe depression later in life for that very reason.

Yes you hit it pal! I've had dozens of abortions!

:ihopehehasn'tbredandcan't:

 

[drivingdaisy]

I personally think that many (certainly not all) who are so adamantly "pro-choice" are that way because they have an abortion in their past and they feel deep-seeded guilt from it, and that in many cases they even block it out in a deeply repressed memory that they pretend does not exist, kind of like an adult who was abused as a child. They often deal with this by advocating "choice" for others, so that they feel justified for their deeply rooted shameful act.

I'd think this is BS (though you are certainly entitled to think the opposite). The majority of people I know who are pro-choice have not had an abortion or involvement in an abortion (ie father).
I feel like that's saying you are against or for the death penalty cause you feel guilty over that man you killed in Reno just to watch him die. Plenty of people have opinions on abortions (for or against) who don't have children or who have never been pregnant. Plenty of people have opinions on gun control who have never owned or even held a gun or been affected in them in anyway.

 

[JoeRider]

Maybe I struck a nerve.

You hit the pain receptor

 

[nomoney]

Maybe I struck a nerve.

I've only had seven


You're still an idiot

 

[JoeRider]

You have no concept of how pain receptors work or you wouldn't make such a stupid post. Or maybe you would because god told you to.

Who is god?

Pain Principles (Section 2, Chapter 6) Neuroscience Online: An Electronic Textbook for the Neurosciences | Department of Neurobiology and Anatomy - The University of Texas Medical School at Houston


6.1 Pain Receptors

Pain is termed nociceptive (nocer – to injure or to hurt in Latin), and nociceptive means sensitive to noxious stimuli. Noxious stimuli are stimuli that elicit tissue damage and activate nociceptors.

Nociceptors are sensory receptors that detect signals from damaged tissue or the threat of damage and indirectly also respond to chemicals released from the damaged tissue. Nociceptors are free (bare) nerve endings found in the skin (Figure 6.2), muscle, joints, bone and viscera. Recently, it was found that nerve endings contain transient receptor potential (TRP) channels that sense and detect damage. The TRP channels are similar to voltage-gated potassium channels or nucleotide-gated channels, having 6 transmembrane domains with a pore between domains 5 and 6. They transduce a variety of noxious stimuli into receptor potentials, which in turn initiate action potential in the pain nerve fibers. This action potential is transmitted to the spinal cord and makes a synaptic connection in lamina I and/or II. The cell bodies of nociceptors are mainly in the dorsal root and trigeminal ganglia. No nociceptors are found inside the CNS.

So what is your take?

 

[Bann]

This is a horrible story all around.

Good lord, I hope they throw the book at her.

 

[vraiblonde]

I personally think that many (certainly not all) who are so adamantly "pro-choice" are that way because they have an abortion in their past and they feel deep-seeded guilt from it, and that in many cases they even block it out in a deeply repressed memory that they pretend does not exist, kind of like an adult who was abused as a child. They often deal with this by advocating "choice" for others, so that they feel justified for their deeply rooted shameful act. Guilt is kind of like a weed. It seems small and easy to deal with at first. However, no matter how many times you cut it back or try to ignore it, it just keeps growing and eventually becomes unbearable. Many women go through severe depression later in life for that very reason.

That's some armchair psychology there. For the record, I've never had an abortion, nor would I ever. We give birth and raise our babies in my family, even when they choose an inopportune time to get fertilized.

To me, abortion is purely a practical matter and nothing more. I am not religious or sentimental when it comes to the human race (in case you haven't noticed that ).

 

[JoeRider]

That's some armchair psychology there. For the record, I've never had an abortion, nor would I ever. We give birth and raise our babies in my family, even when they choose an inopportune time to get fertilized.

To me, abortion is purely a practical matter and nothing more. I am not religious or sentimental when it comes to the human race (in case you haven't noticed that ).

Didn't you say you tried to abort them but it failed. They keep coming back to get their clothes washed and scarf down food.

 

[vraiblonde]

Didn't you say you tried to abort them but it failed. They keep coming back to get their clothes washed and scarf down food.

Um, no. My kids left home right after graduation to go pursue their adult lives, and have been successful enough to not need me to wash their clothes and cook for them.

:smellscoffeecupagain:

 

[JoeRider]

Um, no. My kids left home right after graduation to go pursue their adult lives, and have been successful enough to not need me to wash their clothes and cook for them.

:smellscoffeecupagain:

My mistake, sorry.

Gosh, now who was complaining about there kids and wanting to allow abortion up to age 18?

 

[Baja28]

Who is god?

Pain Principles (Section 2, Chapter 6) Neuroscience Online: An Electronic Textbook for the Neurosciences | Department of Neurobiology and Anatomy - The University of Texas Medical School at Houston

6.1 Pain Receptors

Pain is termed nociceptive (nocer – to injure or to hurt in Latin), and nociceptive means sensitive to noxious stimuli. Noxious stimuli are stimuli that elicit tissue damage and activate nociceptors.

Nociceptors are sensory receptors that detect signals from damaged tissue or the threat of damage and indirectly also respond to chemicals released from the damaged tissue. Nociceptors are free (bare) nerve endings found in the skin (Figure 6.2), muscle, joints, bone and viscera. Recently, it was found that nerve endings contain transient receptor potential (TRP) channels that sense and detect damage. The TRP channels are similar to voltage-gated potassium channels or nucleotide-gated channels, having 6 transmembrane domains with a pore between domains 5 and 6. They transduce a variety of noxious stimuli into receptor potentials, which in turn initiate action potential in the pain nerve fibers. This action potential is transmitted to the spinal cord and makes a synaptic connection in lamina I and/or II. The cell bodies of nociceptors are mainly in the dorsal root and trigeminal ganglia. No nociceptors are found inside the CNS.

So what is your take?

My take is this. Everything you copied & pasted is real purty BUT.... if the receptors aren't connected to anything guess what? The fetus feels no pain. So no matter how many times you repeat that 1st & second trimester fetus feel pain, it just plain isn't true.

Fetuses cannot feel pain until at least the 28th week of gestation because they haven't formed the necessary nerve pathways, says Mark Rosen, an obstetrical anesthesiologist at the University of California at San Francisco. He and his colleagues determined that until the third trimester, "the wiring at the point where you feel pain, such as the skin, doesn't reach the emotional part where you feel pain, in the brain." Although fetuses start forming pain receptors eight weeks into development, the thalamus, the part of the brain that routes information to other areas, doesn't form for 20 more weeks. Without the thalamus, Rosen says, no information can reach the cortex for processing.

 

[sockgirl77]

I personally think that many (certainly not all) who are so adamantly "pro-choice" are that way because they have an abortion in their past and they feel deep-seeded guilt from it, and that in many cases they even block it out in a deeply repressed memory that they pretend does not exist, kind of like an adult who was abused as a child. They often deal with this by advocating "choice" for others, so that they feel justified for their deeply rooted shameful act. Guilt is kind of like a weed. It seems small and easy to deal with at first. However, no matter how many times you cut it back or try to ignore it, it just keeps growing and eventually becomes unbearable. Many women go through severe depression later in life for that very reason.

Umm...okay.

 

[puggymom]

I personally think that many (certainly not all) who are so adamantly "pro-choice" are that way because they have an abortion in their past and they feel deep-seeded guilt from it, and that in many cases they even block it out in a deeply repressed memory that they pretend does not exist, kind of like an adult who was abused as a child. They often deal with this by advocating "choice" for others, so that they feel justified for their deeply rooted shameful act. Guilt is kind of like a weed. It seems small and easy to deal with at first. However, no matter how many times you cut it back or try to ignore it, it just keeps growing and eventually becomes unbearable. Many women go through severe depression later in life for that very reason.

I am very pro choice. I have been pregnant only twice my entire life both planned conceptions ending in healthy full term kids.

 

[JoeRider]

Fetuses cannot feel pain until at least the 28th week of gestation because they haven't formed the necessary nerve pathways, says Mark Rosen, an obstetrical anesthesiologist at the University of California at San Francisco. He and his colleagues determined that until the third trimester, "the wiring at the point where you feel pain, such as the skin, doesn't reach the emotional part where you feel pain, in the brain." Although fetuses start forming pain receptors eight weeks into development, the thalamus, the part of the brain that routes information to other areas, doesn't form for 20 more weeks. Without the thalamus, Rosen says, no information can reach the cortex for processing.

Well I guess there are two camps out there. Rosen uses an adult standard to make his conclusion. I would say that a fetus in development would function differently. I also believe what makes life happen is more than the hard wiring and things must take place at a molecular level.

There are groups of doctors that believe that a fetus is able to respond at 20 weeks and there is indication that a fetus can sense something at 8 week -

http://www.doctorsonfetalpain.com/

(2) By eight (8) weeks after fertilization, the unborn child reacts to touch. After twenty (20) weeks, the unborn child reacts to stimuli that would be recognized as painful if applied to an adult human, for example, by recoiling.


So, I think you agree that logically, based on the adult development of the brain, a fetus at 28 weeks feels pain. Are you willing to accept 20 weeks as a compromise since development is in play and the possible exists?


What we do not agree on is that I believe a fetus feels pain at least by 8 weeks. Considering our genetic code may carry the concept of pain as part of our DNA, a fetus might even know pain at conception.

It is unknown and doctors can spout all they want, but they don't know either or there would not be an issue.

Unless you are willing to look outside the box of so called possibilities, you will not make new discoveries, you will just keep refining the same ones, so you get a better solution, but not a revolutionary one.

Consider how many medical breakthrough were made by non-scientific accidents.

See Sir Alexander Fleming

Sir Alexander Fleming - Biography


By the way, my stuff might be more prutty than yours, but I think I have moved the conversation away from some published news reports that you throw out there.