Gun Control Works Again

[Midnightrider]

And going down your list…

• You can possess any mag as long as you owned it prior to 1 Oct 13. If you get pulled over and searched you had better have a receipt showing where and when it was bought or can somehow convince the cop you legally own it. Good luck with that, since so many people have 30 round mags they have owned for a long time.
• Who the heck was for gun confiscation at all?
• I fail to see where the NRA had anything to do with regulating or banning HBARs. My memory on this is legislators didn’t want to touch unregulated, competition-levels firearms. But since all semi-auto rifles are banned, it’s rather moot in that case.

you are wrong on all accounts.
Possession of larger than 10 round mags is in no way illegal, nor is the transport or use. You can buy out of state and bring them home without violating the law
Confiscating EBR was on the table in more than one form.
Semiauto rifles are not banned and specifically HBARs are readily available. The NRA lobbied hard for this one

Do yourself a favor and if you’re going to claim something, at least show evidence of it. I agree the NRA was active in shaping, if not preventing, this horrendous law; but given how the law turned out, I’m seeing they had no influence at all. I would love to see comments from MD lawmakers that said “I made this decision because the NRA convinced me to.”

If the NRA was active in shaping a law then they had to exert some influence. That's what lobbyist do and why the NRA has a dedicated rep for md.

I brought up SB281 to illustrate how the NRA influences laws, even ones they are against. In SB281 they mostly did gun owners a favor by building loopholes into the language. With respect to mental health reporting, instant BCs etc., they haven't. Being able to see the NRAs influence and the realty that they aren't always right doesn't make me a progressive or in favor of gun control, its just recognizing the realty of the situation.

Go read up on the SB 281 deliberations......

 

[Midnightrider]

'OUR' NRA rep? So now you're a card carrying member? I have no strawman. I'm not claiming there is some external evil influence here. You and I are in the same boat, we hate this law. Yet you continue to argue with me about the NRA. You're all over the page dude.

For another couple months, yes, a card carrying member. OUR rep was Shannon Alford if I recall correctly, although she might have moved on since SB 281.

 

[PsyOps]

you are wrong on all accounts.
Possession of larger than 10 round mags is in no way illegal, nor is the transport or use.
Confiscating EBR was on the table in more than one form.
Semiauto rifles are not banned and specifically HBARs are readily available. The NRA lobbied hard for this one


If the NRA was active in shaping a law then they had to exert some influence. That's what lobbyist do and why the NRA has a dedicated rep for md.

I brought up SB281 to illustrate how the NRA influences laws, even ones they are against. In SB281 they mostly did gun owners a favor by building loopholes into the language. With respect to mental health reporting, instant BCs etc., they haven't. Being able to see the NRAs influence and the realty that they aren't always right doesn't make me a progressive or in favor of gun control, its just recognizing the realty of the situation.

Go read up on the SB 281 deliberations......

I didn’t say it was illegal to possess mags larger than 10 rounds or transport it. I said if you get caught with one you will likely have to justify the legality of it. I’m certain a lot of cops will turn a blind eye assuming you wouldn’t have it if you didn’t get it legally and not really worth their time. I carry receipts of everything when I transport my weapons.

Dude, you said confiscation. Can you show me where confiscation of EBRs was discussed as a possibility? I find nothing.

81 semi-auto rifles banned under SB-281. If you owned prior to 1 Oct 13 you own legally. HBARs weren’t touched. You’ve still failed to show where the NRA was any influence in this at all.

IF the NRA was in any way influential in this law, it sure wasn’t admitted by any MD lawmaker. I know full-well they were active in trying to ‘shape’ the law; they were far more active in trying to STOP the law. And now they have pending suits to overturns parts (if not all) of the law. For whatever influence the NRA might have had, I salute them for representing gun owners. For whatever activities they were involved in to influence the law, they failed. Their goal was to stop the law; something you claim to support.

 

[Larry Gude]

IF the NRA was in any way influential in this law, it sure wasn’t admitted by any MD lawmaker. I know full-well they were active in trying to ‘shape’ the law; they were far more active in trying to STOP the law. And now they have pending suits to overturns parts (if not all) of the law. For whatever influence the NRA might have had, I salute them for representing gun owners. For whatever activities they were involved in to influence the law, they failed. Their goal was to stop the law; something you claim to support.

In Maryland, the NRA has very limited influence. The only place they can do much is at the margins in districts with reps who could readily lose to a more pro 2a opponent and there simply aren't enough to matter when it comes to final passage. For most reps in Maryland, NRA opposition is a resume enhancer.

 

[PsyOps]

In Maryland, the NRA has very limited influence. The only place they can do much is at the margins in districts with reps who could readily lose to a more pro 2a opponent and there simply aren't enough to matter when it comes to final passage. For most reps in Maryland, NRA opposition is a resume enhancer.

The only place they can really be effective in blue states is in the courts.

 

[Gilligan]

I didn’t say it was illegal to possess mags larger than 10 rounds or transport it. I said if you get caught with one you will likely have to justify the legality of it. I’m certain a lot of cops will turn a blind eye assuming you wouldn’t have it if you didn’t get it legally and not really worth their time.

?? I don't follow your thought process there. All magazines are legal to possess in Maryland. So why would a LEO be the least bit interested in what yours are. There is no "caught" there...

 

[Midnightrider]

In Maryland, the NRA has very limited influence. The only place they can do much is at the margins in districts with reps who could readily lose to a more pro 2a opponent and there simply aren't enough to matter when it comes to final passage. For most reps in Maryland, NRA opposition is a resume enhancer.

But those reps were part of the writing process and did influence the language. If it weren't for the NRA and other gun rights advocates SB281 could have been a lot worse, and maybe less susceptible to court challenges.

 

[Midnightrider]

I didn’t say it was illegal to possess mags larger than 10 rounds or transport it. I said if you get caught with one you will likely have to justify the legality of it. I’m certain a lot of cops will turn a blind eye assuming you wouldn’t have it if you didn’t get it legally and not really worth their time. I carry receipts of everything when I transport my weapons.

Dude, you said confiscation. Can you show me where confiscation of EBRs was discussed as a possibility? I find nothing.

81 semi-auto rifles banned under SB-281. If you owned prior to 1 Oct 13 you own legally. HBARs weren’t touched. You’ve still failed to show where the NRA was any influence in this at all.

IF the NRA was in any way influential in this law, it sure wasn’t admitted by any MD lawmaker. I know full-well they were active in trying to ‘shape’ the law; they were far more active in trying to STOP the law. And now they have pending suits to overturns parts (if not all) of the law. For whatever influence the NRA might have had, I salute them for representing gun owners. For whatever activities they were involved in to influence the law, they failed. Their goal was to stop the law; something you claim to support.

What you said was mags had to be purchased prior to 10/1/13, that's not at all true
You also said ALL semiauto rifles are banned, again no where close to the truth
You can do your own research on who wanted gun confiscation, I was paying attention back then so I didn't miss it.

And again, if they shaped the law they had influence, and they did.

 

[PsyOps]

?? I don't follow your thought process there. All magazines are legal to possess in Maryland. So why would a LEO be the least bit interested in what yours are. There is no "caught" there...

I was mistaken. I thought the new law banned transfer of 'high capacity' magazines from out of state.

 

[Larry Gude]

But those reps were part of the writing process and did influence the language. If it weren't for the NRA and other gun rights advocates SB281 could have been a lot worse, and maybe less susceptible to court challenges.

Shall I point out the obvious? It passed. A silly, useless bill that will be, repeat, WILL be the precedent for more gun laws, passed. SB 281 should have been soundly and roundly defeated but, the citizens of Maryland, enough of us, are happy with silly, useless bills. We are ONE hi cap incident, ONE death by .308 incident away from the next round.

So, we got a slightly better cabin on the Titanic.

 

[PsyOps]

What you said was mags had to be purchased prior to 10/1/13, that's not at all true
You also said ALL semiauto rifles are banned, again no where close to the truth

I was wrong about the magazines. And I also clarified that with Larry I used 'all' rhetorically. I know all semi-auto rifles aren't banned. I also clarified that with the number that are banned.

You can do your own research on who wanted gun confiscation, I was paying attention back then so I didn't miss it.

In other words, you've got nothing.

And again, if they shaped the law they had influence, and they did.

Even if they did (which they didn't), you're claiming this is a bad thing, even though you claim you're against the law.

 

[Midnightrider]

Shall I point out the obvious? It passed. A silly, useless bill that will be, repeat, WILL be the precedent for more gun laws, passed. SB 281 should have been soundly and roundly defeated but, the citizens of Maryland, enough of us, are happy with silly, useless bills. We are ONE hi cap incident, ONE death by .308 incident away from the next round.

So, we got a slightly better cabin on the Titanic.

You ill get no arguments from me on that. In general it was a terrible and meaningless bill.
But it could have been a lot worse if not for the NRA, MSI, and other gun rights advocates. If the antis who were pushing the law had a clue we wouldn't have gotten the HBAR exception. We are lucky they were ignorant, for now

 

[Midnightrider]

I was wrong about the magazines. And I also clarified that with Larry I used 'all' rhetorically. I know all semi-auto rifles aren't banned. I also clarified that with the number that are banned.



In other words, you've got nothing.



Even if they did (which they didn't), you're claiming this is a bad thing, even though you claim you're against the law.

I was right about the other two issues and you were wrong, who has he better chance of being right about gun Confiscation?

I'm not claiming NRA influence is a bad thing, but it is a thing. It happens on many levels. You can choose to ignore that reality if you want.

 

[PsyOps]

You ill get no arguments from me on that. In general it was a terrible and meaningless bill.
But it could have been a lot worse if not for the NRA, MSI, and other gun rights advocates. If the antis who were pushing the law had a clue we wouldn't have gotten the HBAR exception. We are lucky they were ignorant, for now

Hol ------- eeeeeeee CRAP! You have been railing against the NRA and how they're involvement in these bills was such a bad thing, and now you're saying if it wasn't for them, this law would have been worse.

 

[PsyOps]

I was right about the other two issues and you were wrong, who has he better chance of being right about gun Confiscation?

I'm not claiming NRA influence is a bad thing, but it is a thing. It happens on many levels. You can choose to ignore that reality if you want.

I really don't care at this point. I've done a fair amount of searching and come up empty. So you can claim anything you want. There is no reality in things you cannot prove. Just saying it does not make it so. I have admitted I got some facts wrong; if you provide proof of confiscation and the NRA I will gladly yield.

I, unlike you, am not so arrogant to admit when I get something wrong. I'm not just here to debate things; I'm here to learn. If you're going to try to teach people something, just saying it's so isn't going to fly.

 

[Larry Gude]

You ill get no arguments from me on that. In general it was a terrible and meaningless bill.
But it could have been a lot worse if not for the NRA, MSI, and other gun rights advocates. If the antis who were pushing the law had a clue we wouldn't have gotten the HBAR exception. We are lucky they were ignorant, for now

It is not reasonable, in my view, to assume they were ignorant. At all. They know the issue; "Scary, black rifle thingy that kills little kids in schools!'. That is what they sought. That's what they got. O'Malley could NOT move forward with a draconian bill that put kids out of shooting sports and hunters out of the field. So, let the NRA and the activists fix it for him.

These things don't happen in a vacuum. :shrug:

 

[Midnightrider]

I really don't care at this point. I've done a fair amount of searching and come up empty. So you can claim anything you want. There is no reality in things you cannot prove. Just saying it does not make it so. I have admitted I got some facts wrong; if you provide proof of confiscation and the NRA I will gladly yield.

I, unlike you, am not so arrogant to admit when I get something wrong. I'm not just here to debate things; I'm here to learn. If you're going to try to teach people something, just saying it's so isn't going to fly.

I'm not trying to teach you anything, I am discussing a subject about which I am knowledgeable. I haven't been wrong yet, so I have nothing to admit to being wrong about. :shrug:

 

[GURPS]

I was mistaken. I thought the new law banned transfer of 'high capacity' magazines from out of state.

I thought that was an old law, already on the books ...... nothing larger that a 20 rnd for rifles and 10? for a hand gun

 

[So_what]

For a doctor there is a fine line between reporting a person with mental problems and personal privacy rights. There needs to be a way for doctors to report when they feel there’s something wrong. For firearm ownership perhaps a “cooling off” period if you’ve been reported to have mental health issues. The doctor would report that you’ve been seen and you can’t purchase firearms for a period of time. After that time you’d be good to go unless the doctor again reports problems. :shrug:

 

[PsyOps]

I'm not trying to teach you anything, I am discussing a subject about which I am knowledgeable. I haven't been wrong yet, so I have nothing to admit to being wrong about. :shrug:

Well okay. You win.