Help Me Understand. Good News Or Bad?

Yooper

Up. Identified. Lase. Fire. On the way.

I'm not an economist. So how should I understand this? Good news, bad news, mixed bag, or something else?
The Dow Jones Industrial Average rallied 7.2% this month, notching its best June performance since 1938, when it surged 24.3%.

The S&P 500 posted its best first half of a year since 1997, soaring 17.3% and reaching an all-time high. All 11 of the S&P 500 sectors rose in the first half of the year, with tech rising more than 26% to lead the gains. Energy was the market’s laggard in the first half, rising just 7.1%.

Or this:

The AP article says that even though the economy grew this quarter there's a slow-down up ahead. So is the stock market just profit taking? Or something else?

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transporter

Well-Known Member
It is highly unlikely that Yooper is asking...been waiting for one of you dumbasses to post this news because, as usual, you don't understand.

Regarding the stock market:

Where were we in September of last year? Do you remember? No? Not surprising? Go back and look. Sept 21 to be exact.

Where were we at the end of December? Do you remember? No? Not surprising. Go back and look. Dec 24 to be exact. Oh...and try, I mean really try to understand WHY we were where we were on Dec 24. What caused the precipitous drop from Step 21 to Dec 24...specifically the tumble from Dec 4 to Dec 24....make and effort. (Or don't and just continued to wallow in your own ignorance.)

Where are we today? Now...since you all don't see to understand this part. Compare Sept 21 to today. Notice any meaningful difference? No? Neither does anyone else who actually follows this (you know...like actual economists...people who actually READ the articles and not just the headlines)

Regarding the economy:

So Yooper is new here, it is possible that he doesn't understand how GDP reporting works. So here is a quick primer. The first estimate is released roughly on the last Friday of the month following the quarter's end. Then, that estimate is revised in each of the following two months. Further revisions may follow as the BEA updates how it measures the economy over time.

The report you are getting all hot and bothered about is the third and final estimate of Q2 it is essentially the same as the original estimate (3.2%) that was released in April. You may remember the initial release as all the other ignorati types were just dripping with excitement. None of them, like you, bothered to read the report. None of them bothered to try to understand whether or not the number was solid. They just read the headline number and bleating in unison.

Here is a much better summation than the one you posted:


U.S. economic growth surges in first-quarter, but momentum fizzling

Since you aren't likely to read it, here are the relevant portions:

Excluding trade, inventories and government spending, the economy grew at only a 1.3% rate in the first quarter. That was the slowest rise in this measure of domestic demand since the second quarter of 2013.

So just to make sure you understand what the above says: the trade bump was due to larger amounts of exports going out to beat expected retaliatory tariff hikes, inventory builds are not good signs, govt spending increases are fine IF they are not adding to an already worrisome debt load (which, in case you REALLY aren't paying attention is not what is happening)


When measured from the income side, the economy grew at a tepid 1.0% rate in the last quarter. Gross domestic income (GDI) was previously reported to have increased at a rate of 1.4%. The income side of the growth ledger was curbed by a dip in profits.

After-tax profits without inventory valuation and capital consumption adjustment, which correspond to S&P 500 profits, fell at a 0.2% rate as earnings of domestic nonfinancial corporations decreased.

In case you don't understand this: falling profits is bad.
The economy will mark 10 years of expansion in July, the longest on record. But momentum is slowing, with manufacturing struggling, the trade deficit widening again and the housing sector still mired in a soft patch.

I've told you about the reports coming out of the various Federal Reserve Bank Branches. They are definitely slowing.

While consumer spending appears to have regained speed in the second quarter, business investment in equipment is expected to have contracted further following Wednesday’s weak report on durable goods orders in May. The trade war between Washington and Beijing is hurting both business and consumer confidence.

Consumer confidence took a hit in the latest report from the Conference Board.
“Just as the expansion is set to become the longest in U.S. history, recession fears have increased,” said Scott Hoyt, a senior economist at Moody’s Analytics in West Chester, Pennsylvania. “U.S. businesses appear spooked by the president’s capricious trade policy.”

The Atlanta Fed is forecasting GDP growth to rise at a 1.9% annualized rate in the April-June quarter.

As of Friday, the Atlanta Fed GDP forecast fell to 1.5% due to the weaker data that came out this week. All the stuff you people don't bother to pay attention to. You know like all the actual economists who told you that tax cuts have only temporary impacts on the economy (which is exactly what is happening)...and all the economists who told you that the corporate tax cuts would not be spent on new plants, investments or hires, but instead on stock buybacks and dividend increases (which is exactly what happened)..and that the paltry cuts given to average Americans would not make much of a difference in consumer spending (it hasn't).

Oh...and just to point out what every actual economist actually knows...the US economy would actually be doing better, the US stock market would actually be doing better...if it weren't for Donald Trump and his asinine trade policies. But that is likely another topic you don't understand.
 

GURPS

INGSOC
PREMO Member
It is highly unlikely that Yooper is asking ... been waiting for one of you dumbasses to post this news because, as usual, you don't understand.

I have been waiting for an opportunity to once again show you how intelligent and morally superior I am.

Ad Hominem - You attacked your opponent's character or personal traits in an attempt to undermine their argument.

So Yooper is new here, it is possible that he doesn't understand how GDP reporting works.

Because Yooper's Length of Membership has ANYTHING to do with his Intelligence or how much he reads or what He UNDERSTANDS

You may remember the initial release as all the other ignorati types were just dripping with excitement. None of them, like you, bothered to read the report. None of them bothered to try to understand whether or not the number was solid. They just read the headline number and bleating in unison.

Ad Hominem - You attacked your opponent's character or personal traits in an attempt to undermine their argument.

Since you aren't likely to read it, here are the relevant portions:

Since you are too stupid to understand, let me explain it for you.

Ad Hominem - You attacked your opponent's character or personal traits in an attempt to undermine their argument.

(which, in case you REALLY aren't paying attention is not what is happening)

Hey don't you see how smart I am.

Oh ... and just to point out what every actual economist actually knows ...

Let me arrogantly point out Economists that do not believe what I do are not 'Real Economists'

Remember that post I put up about Narcissists



Anyone or Anything that does not conform to YOUR World View is Either Ignorant, Uneducated or Selfish ..... or a Russian Bot


Every post you make is against anyone or any group that doesn't conform to your propagandist viewpoints.
 

nutz

Well-Known Member
It is highly unlikely that Yooper is asking...been waiting for one of you dumbasses to post this news because, as usual, you don't understand.
, the US stock market would actually be doing better...if it weren't for Donald Trump and his asinine trade policies. But that is likely another topic you don't understand.

Surprised that someone with your self-proclaimed intellect has so much time to waste on the peasants in America.
 

vraiblonde

Board Mommy
PREMO Member
Patron
I'm not an economist. So how should I understand this?

I think I can help with a translation of the AP article:

The economy is growing and looking excellent, but because it's happening under Darth Trump our whole system is going to collapse here in a few minutes because tax cuts are bad, m'kay? And the US getting a fair deal with trade is even badder. So prepare for doom and you dolts deserve it because you didn't elect the kindest, bravest, warmest, most wonderful human being I've ever known in my life. Now open those borders so we can give everyone in the world free health care.
 

Yooper

Up. Identified. Lase. Fire. On the way.
Oh...and just to point out what every actual economist actually knows...the US economy would actually be doing better, the US stock market would actually be doing better...if it weren't for Donald Trump and his asinine trade policies. But that is likely another topic you don't understand.
As such, standing by with held breath for enlightenment, re: Trump/Xi talks....


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Merlin99

Visualize whirled peas
PREMO Member
Anyone remember the stock market crash from when Trump was elected, people jumping out high rise windows and drowning themselves in the swimming pools. How did we survive those dark days.
 

David

Opinions are my own...
PREMO Member
So how should I understand this? Good news, bad news, mixed bag, or something else?
Good on the surface, but when you look closer, its all smoke and mirrors.

Fed prints more money, money needs some place to go, it goes into the stock market driving prices up. All kinds of multi-billion dollar pension funds and huge ivy league endowment funds looking for some place to go so they can show some kind of positive annual performance ---> money goes into stock market driving prices up.

Then there's the Plunge Protection Team making sure the markets stay afloat by whatever means they have at their disposal.

If you want to know if things are good, look at your personal situation:
  • How much has food gone up?
  • How much has cost of transportation gone up? vehicles, maintenance and fuel ($50,000 for an F150? really?)
  • How are your personal investments working out. Do you feel comfortable retiring as soon as you had planned?
  • How about housing costs? Can your kids afford to buy a home or will they will living with you into their 30's?
  • How secure is your job? Gonna be replaced by a robot or have your job outsourced to India, or taken by one of the tens of thousands of illegals flowing across the border. Oh yeah baby, now they're coming for the high tech jobs too:

How much longer until those 6-figure social media whiz kids are replaced with these $18K/Year Indians? My guess is that the Indians won't be whining about gender and made-up pronouns either.

P.S. TIP: The aforementioned multi-billion dollar pension funds and huge ivy league endowment funds will probably moving into CryptoCurrencies in the next year. A betting person would throw at least "throw some mud at the wall." How many times did you say something like, if I had only bought Dell or Apple at $5?
 
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GURPS

INGSOC
PREMO Member
How much longer until those 6-figure social media whiz kids are replaced with these $18K/Year Indians? My guess is that the Indians won't be whining about gender and made-up pronouns either.



Here’s how much Silicon Valley tech workers actually make


Facebook came in second place, with a median pay of $228,651 in 2018. However, this number fell by nearly $12,000 from 2017. A spokesperson told WIRED there was "no specific reason" for the decline, although Facebook suffered multiple crises last year, including a massive data breach that caused its stock prices to plummet.

Meanwhile, it's not too rough to work at Twitter, Square, Workday, or Nvidia, either, where employees all made on average over $150,000 in 2018. That's more than enough to afford rent for the average San Francisco "modest two-bedroom" according to the National Low Income Housing Coalition's "Out of Reach" report (they reported you'd have to make at least a cool $127,000).
 

vraiblonde

Board Mommy
PREMO Member
Patron
If you want to know if things are good, look at your personal situation:
  • How much has food gone up? Since when, as in what time frame? In the last 10 years, not much.
  • How much has cost of transportation gone up? vehicles, maintenance and fuel ($50,000 for an F150? really?) See answer above...
  • How are your personal investments working out. Do you feel comfortable retiring as soon as you had planned? Quite well, and yes.
  • How about housing costs? Can your kids afford to buy a home or will they will living with you into their 30's? Both of my kids are in their early 30s and have their own homes. Both went on to their grown up lives shortly after graduating high school and haven't been back.
  • How secure is your job? Pretty secure, but if I lose my job for some reason I have no doubt I'd have another one within a week and I already know what it would be.

I'm not sure where you're going with this. Judging by my personal situation, things are just peachy.
 
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