I do love an honest man

[vraiblonde]

http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion...,4137172.column?coll=la-news-comment-opinions

I DON'T SUPPORT our troops. This is a particularly difficult opinion to have, especially if you are the kind of person who likes to put bumper stickers on his car. Supporting the troops is a position that even Calvin is unwilling to urinate on.

I'm sure I'd like the troops. They seem gutsy, young and up for anything. If you're wandering into a recruiter's office and signing up for eight years of unknown danger, I want to hang with you in Vegas.

And I've got no problem with other people — the ones who were for the Iraq war — supporting the troops. If you think invading Iraq was a good idea, then by all means, support away. Load up on those patriotic magnets and bracelets and other trinkets the Chinese are making money off of.

But I'm not for the war. And being against the war and saying you support the troops is one of the wussiest positions the pacifists have ever taken — and they're wussy by definition. It's as if the one lesson they took away from Vietnam wasn't to avoid foreign conflicts with no pressing national interest but to remember to throw a parade afterward.

Joel Stein is a Leftist twit, but his honesty is refreshing. I still hate him, but I grudgingly admire him for telling the truth.

 

[Spoiled]

Ive always wondered where the money for those magnets went, I figured it went back to the troops in some way. I guess not.

 

[Tonio]

Blindly lending support to our soldiers, I fear, will keep them overseas longer by giving soft acquiescence to the hawks who sent them there — and who might one day want to send them somewhere else.

I had assumed that if you didn't support the troops, you condoned their deaths at the hands of the enemy. Is that the case?

I'm not advocating that we spit on returning veterans like they did after the Vietnam War, but we shouldn't be celebrating people for doing something we don't think was a good idea.

That sounds a little mean-spirited to me. It's like he's taking out his anger at Bush by withholding just honors for our soldiers. Whether the soldiers are draftees or volunteers, they're not the ones responsibile for deciding when and where to wage war. But he's right about the horrid treatment that Vietnam vets received--if the antiwar activists had to spit on anyone, a better choice would have been Robert McNamara. (If I recall correctly, McNamara was the SecDef who pushed hard for large-scale U.S. involvement in Vietnam against the advice of his own generals, and then wouldn't support the generals' requests for more troops. Do I have that right?)

 

[vraiblonde]

Tonio, they all feel that way. Only Joel Stein was brave enough to admit it.

 

[SamSpade]

Tonio, they all feel that way. Only Joel Stein was brave enough to admit it.

Most of the left that I know personally have at the least, a mild animosity towards the military. This usually puzzles me, because they believe most of the ridiculous stereotypes of the military - and their families - and of the soldiers - that have never come close to what I've experienced all my life. And they usually have those beliefs and feelings in a complete vacuum of exposure to the military.

Those I know, believe that those who serve crave battle - belittle human life - and see brute force as the primary and main means of making decisions. For you and me, it's almost cartoonish. I try to tell them, NO ONE *hates* war more than the men who have to fight them. No one. Not anymore than cops who hate crime, doctors hate to see patients die, firefighters who hate to lose people to the flames. But they all see their job as necessary, and for the most part, I've found them to be very noble souls. If they saw those other professions in the same way, doctors would use people as guinea pigs, cops would sign up to hassle innocent people and firefighters are all a bunch of pyros.

On the other hand - a small amount see them in a much different way. In a way I believe is even worse.

And that view is the one promulgated by John Kerry back in his VVAW days - that veterans are automatons who only do what they're told, and any horror of war is directly attributable to those who sent them there. Thus, *he* could go on national television and claim that he himself participated in atrocities - but somehow exhibits no guilt in the matter, because he was only following orders. And if not strictly following orders - at the very least, following an agenda of violence, but taking specific matters into his own hands, because the entire war was wrong to begin with.

I am at least relieved to see ONE man admit, saying you support the troops but are against the war IS a wussy, wimpy way of trying to have it both ways. It's the answer of someone without strong enough convictions to take heat for having an unpopular view. It's sugar-coating the REAL sentiment.

 

[SAHRAB]

http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion...,4137172.column?coll=la-news-comment-opinions



Joel Stein is a Leftist twit, but his honesty is refreshing. I still hate him, but I grudgingly admire him for telling the truth.

HUGH HEWITT VS. JOEL STEIN

Here's the audio and transcript of Hugh's interview with Joel Stein. (Stein is decimated in it)

http://radioblogger.com/images/01-24stein.mp3

Excerpt : (about Parents of an Annapolis grad who died in Fallujah)

HH: Do you honor the service that their son did?

JS: To honor the service their son...now this is a dumb question, but what do you mean by honor? That's a word you keep using. I'm not entirely...maybe that's my problem. But I'm not entirely sure what you're...

HH: Honor usually means gratitude and esteem. Are you grateful for and esteem what he did? Honestly?

JS: Honestly? I admire the bravery. I don't...you know, I feel like he did something I could never do, so I'm kind of in awe on some level. Am I grateful, that I feel like he protected me? Um, no I don't.

 

[SamSpade]

HUGH HEWITT VS. JOEL STEIN

Here's the audio and transcript of Hugh's interview with Joel Stein. (Stein is decimated in it)

http://radioblogger.com/images/01-24stein.mp3

Excerpt : (about Parents of an Annapolis grad who died in Fallujah)

Skewers him. I like this Hewittt guy - he nails this guy in a way where you can't really argue that he's being unfair.

 

[Larry Gude]

The left-un plugged...

I DON'T SUPPORT Firemen. This is a particularly difficult opinion to have, especially if you are the kind of person who likes to put bumper stickers on his car. Supporting Firemen is a position that even Calvin is unwilling to urinate on.

I'm sure I'd like Firemen. They seem gutsy, young and up for anything. If you're wandering into a fire houses office and signing up for eight years of unknown danger, I want to hang with you in Vegas.

And I've got no problem with other people — the ones who were for putting out fires — supporting the firemen. If you think putting out fires was a good idea, then by all means, support away. Load up on those NYFD magnets and bracelets and other trinkets the Chinese are making money off of.

But I'm not for putting out fires. And being against putting out fires and saying you support the firemen is one of the wussiest positions the left have ever taken — and they're wussy by definition. It's as if the one lesson they took away from the first gulf war wasn't to avoid trusting dictators working against our national interest, but to remember to change your vote afterward.



FIXED

 

[2ndAmendment]

...cops would sign up to hassle innocent people

They don't?

and firefighters are all a bunch of pyros....

They aren't? Some I know like fire a little too much.

 

[Kerad]

So I guess that means I didn't support myself while I was deployed over there for "Iraqi Freedom".


Thanks for clearing that up for me.






You're all a bunch of radical, right-wing, fascist (that one's for you, Vrai) WHACK JOBS!

 

[Bruzilla]

I think that Stein is right in his view. The mission of our troops committed to combat is to wage war. Anything that you do to make their lives easier, or support their families, results in improving their ability to wage war. So there really is no way that you can be honest and say that you support the troops but not the war. If you're doing anything to support the troops you are also helping out the war effort whether you like it or not.

I was bothered by Charlie Rengel's comments on Hannity's radio show yesterday. He still contends that the only reason that anyone joins, or has joined, the military is for money. Hannity asked him the basis for this view, and his reply was "the only reason that I joined up was so that I could get an allotment check sent to my mother." So just because Charlie Rengel was broke and couldn't find a job, and desperately needed money to support his Mom when no one would hire him, he joined the Army... which must mean that his situation applies to everyone. I don't know if his problem is just an over abundance of ego or a lack of having a grasp on reality.

 

[Tonio]

I think that Stein is right in his view. The mission of our troops committed to combat is to wage war. Anything that you do to make their lives easier, or support their families, results in improving their ability to wage war. So there really is no way that you can be honest and say that you support the troops but not the war. If you're doing anything to support the troops you are also helping out the war effort whether you like it or not.

I think you're right for the most part. I think it's possible to support the troops and the war effort while disagreeing with the wisdom of the mission. If you had asked me in October 2001 where I thought Bin Laden would be in 2006, I would have said "in a jail cell awaiting trial, or in a grave after being tried executed for war crimes." I think it's outrageous that a monster like him is still free and still planning atrocities.

 

[vraiblonde]

You're all a bunch of radical, right-wing, fascist (that one's for you, Vrai) WHACK JOBS!

<-- a wet one with a loud mouthfart sound

Yeah, your boy Kerry is parroting Osama bin Laden's talking points and WE'RE the radical whack jobs.

That's rich.

 

[Ken King]

If you had asked me in October 2001 where I thought Bin Laden would be in 2006, I would have said "in a jail cell awaiting trial, or in a grave after being tried executed for war crimes." I think it's outrageous that a monster like him is still free and still planning atrocities.

Look how long it took to find Eric Rudolph and he was not getting help. If he hadn't been dumpster diving we would still be looking for him. It is totally understandable that Bin Laden has been able to hide out for so long as he knows the terrain and is receiving assistance from many that share his views.

 

[SAHRAB]

I was bothered by Charlie Rengel's comments on Hannity's radio show yesterday. He still contends that the only reason that anyone joins, or has joined, the military is for money. Hannity asked him the basis for this view, and his reply was "the only reason that I joined up was so that I could get an allotment check sent to my mother." So just because Charlie Rengel was broke and couldn't find a job, and desperately needed money to support his Mom when no one would hire him, he joined the Army... which must mean that his situation applies to everyone. I don't know if his problem is just an over abundance of ego or a lack of having a grasp on reality.

He always sounds like he needs a drink of water. Did you also notice that he was STILL trying to peddle the "only Poor Black kids join the military", and the Michael Moor(on) "the President/Congress/Senate children didnt join".

These Nuts need to keep peddling all their Crap, its doing ABSOLUTELY nothing for them, just helping new RepuTARDs get elected into office.

 

[SAHRAB]

<-- a wet one with a loud mouthfart sound

Yeah, your boy Kerry is parroting Osama bin Laden's talking points and WE'RE the radical whack jobs.

That's rich.

Even Better... Osama is spouting Kerry, Michael Moor(on), Murtha and Durbins talking points.

 

[Tonio]

Look how long it took to find Eric Rudolph and he was not getting help. If he hadn't been dumpster diving we would still be looking for him. It is totally understandable that Bin Laden has been able to hide out for so long as he knows the terrain and is receiving assistance from many that share his views.

Excellent point. It's just infuriating that Bin Laden is still free. But then, I'm still infuriated about Mogadishu.