seekeroftruth
Well-Known Member
11:1Then Zophar the Naamathite replied:
2 “Are all these words to go unanswered?
Is this talker to be vindicated?
3 Will your idle talk reduce others to silence?
Will no one rebuke you when you mock?
4 You say to God, ‘My beliefs are flawless
and I am pure in your sight.’
5 Oh, how I wish that God would speak,
that he would open his lips against you
6 and disclose to you the secrets of wisdom,
for true wisdom has two sides.
Know this: God has even forgotten some of your sin.
Is this talker to be vindicated?
3 Will your idle talk reduce others to silence?
Will no one rebuke you when you mock?
4 You say to God, ‘My beliefs are flawless
and I am pure in your sight.’
5 Oh, how I wish that God would speak,
that he would open his lips against you
6 and disclose to you the secrets of wisdom,
for true wisdom has two sides.
Know this: God has even forgotten some of your sin.
7 “Can you fathom the mysteries of God?
Can you probe the limits of the Almighty?
8 They are higher than the heavens above—what can you do?
They are deeper than the depths below—what can you know?
9 Their measure is longer than the earth
and wider than the sea.
Can you probe the limits of the Almighty?
8 They are higher than the heavens above—what can you do?
They are deeper than the depths below—what can you know?
9 Their measure is longer than the earth
and wider than the sea.
10 “If he comes along and confines you in prison
and convenes a court, who can oppose him?
11 Surely he recognizes deceivers;
and when he sees evil, does he not take note?
12 But the witless can no more become wise
than a wild donkey’s colt can be born human.[a]
and convenes a court, who can oppose him?
11 Surely he recognizes deceivers;
and when he sees evil, does he not take note?
12 But the witless can no more become wise
than a wild donkey’s colt can be born human.[a]
13 “Yet if you devote your heart to him
and stretch out your hands to him,
14 if you put away the sin that is in your hand
and allow no evil to dwell in your tent,
15 then, free of fault, you will lift up your face;
you will stand firm and without fear.
16 You will surely forget your trouble,
recalling it only as waters gone by.
17 Life will be brighter than noonday,
and darkness will become like morning.
18 You will be secure, because there is hope;
you will look about you and take your rest in safety.
19 You will lie down, with no one to make you afraid,
and many will court your favor.
20 But the eyes of the wicked will fail,
and escape will elude them;
their hope will become a dying gasp.”
and stretch out your hands to him,
14 if you put away the sin that is in your hand
and allow no evil to dwell in your tent,
15 then, free of fault, you will lift up your face;
you will stand firm and without fear.
16 You will surely forget your trouble,
recalling it only as waters gone by.
17 Life will be brighter than noonday,
and darkness will become like morning.
18 You will be secure, because there is hope;
you will look about you and take your rest in safety.
19 You will lie down, with no one to make you afraid,
and many will court your favor.
20 But the eyes of the wicked will fail,
and escape will elude them;
their hope will become a dying gasp.”
a. Job 11:12 Or wild donkey can be born tame
This is from enduringword.com.
For you have said, “My doctrine is pure, and I am clean in your eyes”: Zophar did not truthfully represent Job’s words here. Job did not claim to be pure and clean, as if he were sinless and perfect; but in fairness to Zophar, we must say that Job claimed to be in the right, and this was virtually a claim to be pure and clean in this matter.
Job knew there was no special or specific sin on his part behind the loss of his children, his health, his servants, and his material wealth (Job 7:20). Even so, Job knew that he was a sinner in a general sense and could not be considered righteous compared to God.
· Therefore my words have been rash (Job 6:3).
· Why then do You not pardon my transgression, and take away my iniquity (Job 7:21).
· How can a man be righteous before God (Job 9:2).
· Though I were righteous, my own mouth would condemn me; though I were blameless, it would prove me perverse (Job 19:20).
· I know that You will not hold me innocent (Job 9:28).
Therefore, we understand Job’s claims to be blameless (Job 9:21-22) to refer to the fact that there was indeed no special or particular sin on his part that prompted his great suffering. Indeed, even God recognized Job as blameless in this sense (Job 1:1, 1:8, and 2:3).
Know therefore that God exacts from you less than your iniquity deserves: In the thinking of Zophar, not only was Job wrong to claim to be either pure or clean, he was actually so guilty before God to deserve far worse than he had suffered.
Zophar here sounds like a man who has carefully studied a particular theological idea (especially in Reformed Theology) known as total depravity. In this idea, the sinfulness of man – both inherited from Adam and actually practiced by the individual – is so great that one could say regarding every suffering of life, “know therefore that God exacts from you less than your iniquity deserves.”
Bradley captures the idea of Zophar: “‘So far from being unjust and cruel, God has spared thee the full measure of thy desserts.’ He puts forward, that is, for the first time in its naked force, the full and logical conclusion of the creed which he and his friends held as an essential tenet of their faith.”
Unfortunately, Zophar is among the miserable comforters (Job 16:2) who were actually quite wrong in their analysis and advice (Job 42:7). Whatever the merits of the theological idea of total depravity, it did not speak to Job’s circumstance at all.
The commentaries have stated that these three men grew impatient. OK.... I would get impatient if I had to sit with someone scraping puss off himself for seven days...... they sat with Job in the ashes for a week..... they had to get back to their flocks, businesses, and homes..... this foolishness had to come to an end. Sure.... Job had a reason to be sad..... but in their eyes.... he did something wrong and didn't confess it or throw an ox on the fire for it...... it was time for him to put up or shut up.This is from the easy English site.
At the start, Job’s friends believed that Job was a good man. But they could not explain why God would allow an innocent man to suffer. So they started to think that Job might, in fact, be evil. In the end, Eliphaz would accuse Job clearly (Job 22:4-9).
Zophar’s explanation shows his doubts about Job’s character. Zophar said that he was wise enough to understand a secret about God. This secret was that God was really kind, even to Job. This seems a strange statement because Job was suffering so much. Zophar explained that Job deserved punishment for his evil behaviour. But God was kind. The punishment would be much worse if God punished Job for every evil deed.
When Job heard this, his attitudes changed. He became bolder. He realised that his friends’ words were in fact evil (Job 13:7). He warned them not to accuse him unfairly (Job 13:10). He told them about God’s deeds (Job 12:13). And Job realised that he needed to trust God (Job 13:3). Job knew now that nobody else would help him.
Back in the times of Adam and Eve.... satan was a snake. Then nothing..... he kind of blended in..... people didn't know about satan or fallen angels..... there were horrible disasters, floods, famines, and other humans to deal with. People didn't say "the devil made me do it". People didn't know about the devil.... this was before prayer in schools.... this was before there were churches on every corner..... people didn't know about satan.... they knew the law... the Ten Commandments..... and they knew the sacrificial schedules.
Job's friends understood, only, that Job had suffered not only financial disaster.... and illness.... but he lost his kids too. They sat with him for seven days....
Job kept complaining about how "Unfair" life was. How could so much loss be his fault?
His friend said..... "hey count yourself lucky..... if God really wanted to he could call you up on on your closet sins.... the ones you don't tell anyone about.... "
