Mexico will pay for the wall

Chris0nllyn

Well-Known Member
For the second year in a row, Trump will raid the Department of Defense’s coffers for money for the U.S.-Mexico border wall, dipping into fiscal year 2020 funds earmarked for counterdrug activities and military construction. But this year, a significant chunk of those dollars will be funneled from a war account known as the Overseas Contingency Operations fund
As it did last year, the White House is planning to transfer funds from elsewhere in the Pentagon’s budget into the counterdrug account. From there, the White House has argued it can legally transfer that money to build additional miles of the wall under U.S. Code Section 284 (b).

The money will go toward “barrier projects,” including building fences, roads, and lighting, in California, Arizona, New Mexico, and Texas, said Robert Salesses, deputy assistant secretary of defense for homeland defense integration and defense support of civil authorities, on Thursday at the Pentagon.
In total, the department plans to divert $1.6 billion from the Overseas Contingency Operations account to the counterdrug account, according to the reprogramming, which was signed by acting Pentagon comptroller Elaine McCusker. The money was intended for procurement of two C-130J airlift aircraft and eight MQ-9 unmanned aerial systems, as well as National Guard and Reserve equipment.

In addition, the department plans to transfer $2.2 billion from the base budget—funds that would otherwise have gone to buy Army vehicles, Navy aircraft and ships, and Air Force aircraft—to the counterdrug account. Specifically, the transfer includes $201 million for Army vehicles, $223 million for two Navy F-35s, $155 million for two V-22 Osprey tiltrotor aircraft, $180 million for one P-8 maritime aircraft, $650 million for Navy landing helicopter assault ships, $261 million for Expeditionary Fast Transports, $156 million for advanced procurement funds for Air Force F-35s, $196 million for two C-130Js, and $180 million from the now-defunct light attack aircraft program.
https://foreignpolicy.com/2020/02/13/trump-to-raid-pentagon-war-account-to-build-border-wall/

Instead of wasting billions on overseas conflicts, we'll do it at home.

And just because we all love to point out hypocrisy on both sides, under the Obama administration, Mulvaney (Trump's OMB Director) blasted the decision to raid OCO funding in order to bypass Congressional spending caps.

Mulvaney once called it "an accounting trick", "gimmick", "sham" and the OCO as a "slush fund". He called the practice "desperate," "dishonest," "disingenuous," "deceptive," and "mischievous."
 

phreddyp

Active Member
PREMO Member
https://foreignpolicy.com/2020/02/13/trump-to-raid-pentagon-war-account-to-build-border-wall/

Instead of wasting billions on overseas conflicts, we'll do it at home.

And just because we all love to point out hypocrisy on both sides, under the Obama administration, Mulvaney (Trump's OMB Director) blasted the decision to raid OCO funding in order to bypass Congressional spending caps.

Mulvaney once called it "an accounting trick", "gimmick", "sham" and the OCO as a "slush fund". He called the practice "desperate," "dishonest," "disingenuous," "deceptive," and "mischievous."
You weren't bitching when Obama used HIS phone and pen.
 

Chris0nllyn

Well-Known Member
You weren't bitching when Obama used HIS phone and pen.
This gets repeated often. And I often provide plenty of evidence that people who make this claim are full of sh!t.

I get why you'd say that; because you don't want to argue the merits of another failed campaign promise and another administration full of hypocrites, but you joined about a year ago. You're welcome to go back and look at my post history to see how completely wrong you are. You won't do that, but you can.
 

Merlin99

Visualize whirled peas
PREMO Member
https://foreignpolicy.com/2020/02/13/trump-to-raid-pentagon-war-account-to-build-border-wall/

Instead of wasting billions on overseas conflicts, we'll do it at home.

And just because we all love to point out hypocrisy on both sides, under the Obama administration, Mulvaney (Trump's OMB Director) blasted the decision to raid OCO funding in order to bypass Congressional spending caps.

Mulvaney once called it "an accounting trick", "gimmick", "sham" and the OCO as a "slush fund". He called the practice "desperate," "dishonest," "disingenuous," "deceptive," and "mischievous."
Once again Congress decides to not get behind the Presidents plan and he has to go around them.
 

Chris0nllyn

Well-Known Member
Once again Congress decides to not get behind the Presidents plan and he has to go around them.
I don't believe there is any obligation for Congress to follow the President's wishes carte blanche. This is another example of Trump not understanding that Congress deictates where money gets spent. As he did for FY21, Trump can propose funding for the wall in his budget proposal, but Congress has no obligation to agree to it.

What it appears he is doing, as you said to "go around" Congress, is bumping the DoD budget up only to raid it for his pet projects.

Given the past precedence, I can see why he'd do it. And given the "stick it to the Dems for not giving me what I want" mantra, I can see why Republicans suddenly don't care.
 

Merlin99

Visualize whirled peas
PREMO Member
I don't believe there is any obligation for Congress to follow the President's wishes carte blanche. This is another example of Trump not understanding that Congress deictates where money gets spent. As he did for FY21, Trump can propose funding for the wall in his budget proposal, but Congress has no obligation to agree to it.

What it appears he is doing, as you said to "go around" Congress, is bumping the DoD budget up only to raid it for his pet projects.

Given the past precedence, I can see why he'd do it. And given the "stick it to the Dems for not giving me what I want" mantra, I can see why Republicans suddenly don't care.
I'm seeing a lot of fault on both sides, congress doesn't want to admit that trump won and insists on every hill being the one that their willing to die on. Trump on the other hand has an idea on what's going to work to fix the country and has BO setting precedent on how to accomplish his aims. Personally I'm seeing congress as being more at fault here because Trump was elected to give his vision a try, congress should be obligated to at least give his vision an attempt before saying enough is enough. Instead they've gone for 100% intransigence.
 

Chris0nllyn

Well-Known Member
I'm seeing a lot of fault on both sides, congress doesn't want to admit that trump won and insists on every hill being the one that their willing to die on. Trump on the other hand has an idea on what's going to work to fix the country and has BO setting precedent on how to accomplish his aims. Personally I'm seeing congress as being more at fault here because Trump was elected to give his vision a try, congress should be obligated to at least give his vision an attempt before saying enough is enough. Instead they've gone for 100% intransigence.
I'd argue that Congress was also elected by the people to accomplish what they want. We don't have a monarchy where the President gets to decide everything.

I think the idea of a wall is dumb and will not get the desired results for the amount of money spent, but I do agree that Congress and the President should work together to find some common ground and each give some concessions to implement something that works for both sides. But thus far, neither side appears willing to do that, and it's certainly not anything new.
 

Barabbas

Active Member
Congress deictates where money gets spent.
No Congress does not. We do not have a dictatorial legislative branch. The president signs the spending bills to make them law. If he were to veto them, it would take 2/3 of Congress to override him

I'm not sure why people think Congress and Congress alone decides spending levels, but that is not true and never has been true, and has been pointed out as being false repeatedly.

That correction made, if we move on to the meat of your complaint, you are complaining that the president is using the spending bills exactly as the law allows, which took Congress to pass and are able to be modified by Congress and the president. It seems rather hypocritical to complain that Trump is using the law to protect the country. It's not like he's sending pallets of cash to a sworn enemy, he's using the law to add border security that he deems appropriate. Since we can reasonably say that a huge percentage of illegal drugs that come from outside the country come through the southern border, it's very reasonable to use drug protection funds to protect us this way.
 

Clem72

Well-Known Member
Technically we are wasting trillions overseas, not billions. And a wall while perhaps not entirely effective is at least representative of our desire to actively resist the tide of illegal immigration. It's better than a welcome mat.
 

Chris0nllyn

Well-Known Member
Since we can reasonably say that a huge percentage of illegal drugs that come from outside the country come through the southern border, it's very reasonable to use drug protection funds to protect us this way.
So if 2/3 of Congress wants to spend the money a certain way, what happens?

The majority of drugs seized come from ports of entry.

The majority of illegal immigrants arrive in airports and overstay their visas.

A wall fixes none of those things.

This is another example of Trump trying to circumvent Congress. Whether it's declaring a "national emergency" that didn't exist, or raiding DoD funds but I realize this only mattered when Obama was in the White House.

Technically we are wasting trillions overseas, not billions. And a wall while perhaps not entirely effective is at least representative of our desire to actively resist the tide of illegal immigration. It's better than a welcome mat.
That's true. Imagine how many walls could be built with that money.

It's someones' desire, but not Congress', apparently.
 

Gilligan

#*! boat!
PREMO Member
Gittin' er dun! That new wall is rolling right along...and starting to make a big difference too. :yay:

Another reason why Trump will win re-election in a landslide in November.
 

Merlin99

Visualize whirled peas
PREMO Member
So if 2/3 of Congress wants to spend the money a certain way, what happens?

The majority of drugs seized come from ports of entry.

The majority of illegal immigrants arrive in airports and overstay their visas.

A wall fixes none of those things.

This is another example of Trump trying to circumvent Congress. Whether it's declaring a "national emergency" that didn't exist, or raiding DoD funds but I realize this only mattered when Obama was in the White House.



That's true. Imagine how many walls could be built with that money.

It's someones' desire, but not Congress', apparently.
see we have a fundamental difference of opinion here. I can see a justifiable national emergency declaration with no problem, that you can’t says a lot about your politics. Illegal immigration is an out of control problem with many facets, an open border being one of them that actually can be fixed essentially by just throwing money at it. the way politicians already do this pretty much says they don’t look at money as money anyways, just as a way to exercise power. As such I don’t have a problem with the pres taking away some of their power.
 

Chris0nllyn

Well-Known Member
see we have a fundamental difference of opinion here. I can see a justifiable national emergency declaration with no problem, that you can’t says a lot about your politics. Illegal immigration is an out of control problem with many facets, an open border being one of them that actually can be fixed essentially by just throwing money at it. the way politicians already do this pretty much says they don’t look at money as money anyways, just as a way to exercise power. As such I don’t have a problem with the pres taking away some of their power.
It's not about politics. My opinion is there's no data that supports a national emergency. That's all.

Illegal immigration is much much lower than it was a few short years ago when there wasn't a national emergency.
Illegal drugs don't largely come across the open border.
Illegal immigrants largely do not come across the open border.
 

phreddyp

Active Member
PREMO Member
Greetings:

LOL, holy ancient reference Batman!!!
What' s the matter bro ? Can't remember 4 years ago ? Paying attention to history will help you from making the same mistakes over and over again . But I am pretty sure history is just a waste of time for you .
 

phreddyp

Active Member
PREMO Member
This gets repeated often. And I often provide plenty of evidence that people who make this claim are full of sh!t.

I get why you'd say that; because you don't want to argue the merits of another failed campaign promise and another administration full of hypocrites, but you joined about a year ago. You're welcome to go back and look at my post history to see how completely wrong you are. You won't do that, but you can.
If you say so . Trump has kept more of his campaign promises that ANY president in my lifetime . You can say and think what you want but the man gets it done with or without the help of congress. Sorry for your luck. Gonna be a long four years for you and your followers Chrissy .
 

Chris0nllyn

Well-Known Member
If you say so . Trump has kept more of his campaign promises that ANY president in my lifetime . You can say and think what you want but the man gets it done with or without the help of congress. Sorry for your luck. Gonna be a long four years for you and your followers Chrissy .
ANY President?

Promises like,
Repeal Obamacare?
Mexico will pay for the wall?
Eliminate the debt in 8 years?
Save coal?
Bring back manufacturing?
Open up libel laws?
Close down the internet?
Enact term limits?
Not take vacations and never leave the WH?
Eliminate Common Core?


He got us tax breaks. Which I agree with 100%. I don't agree with adding spending and increasing the deficit.
He got us gun control by telling the ATF to ban something they deemed legal under two previous Presidents.
He stopped migration from those "sh!t holes" around the world.
He is cutting regulations. I agree with this 100% also.

I realize that keeping all campaign promises is wishful thinking and no President will accomplish all of them, but I think it's silly to say he's kept even the majority of his biggest promises. I realize you may argue the source, but Politifact says that Trump has kept 17% of his campaign promises. 10% he compromised on, 17% broken promises, 26% stalled, and 27% in the works. I guess we'll only get to see what happens once his tenure is over.

I don't really care if it's Trump or Bernie or whoever in office. I didn't vote for Trump, and won't vote for him nor the Democratic candidate so I'll be fine. I also understand that regardless of who is President, we'll all be okay despite the constant jaw gnashing and doomsday predictions.
 
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