Mike Rowe: The college admissions scandal is 'outrageous,' but...

Kyle

Imagine No Democrats
PREMO Member
... the real crime is the cost of education.

Television host and author Mike Rowe believes that the American people should be just as outraged with the skyrocketing cost of higher education as they are with the celebrities exposed in the college admissions cheating scandal.

Rowe, who is best known for his Discovery Channel show "Dirty Jobs," also argues in favor of more vocational jobs and said that "not everyone has to go to college" during an appearance on "Fox & Friends" on Friday.



 

glhs837

Power with Control
Yep, once you turn on the Gubbmint Money spigot, there will appear as many sponges as needed to sop it all up and look like a desert needing more. Medicare/Medicaid and housing assistance and other programs bear this out.
 

TCROW

Active Member
Formal education is often required for vocations as well and while the cost of attending vocational school is certainly less expensive than traditional university, the costs still have increased because the government has their hands in that too.

The issue here is the government being in the business of making loans for education, not vocational vs. traditional universities.

You will need some formal post-secondary education no matter what you want to do in life — assuming you don’t want to be a minimum wage slave that is.
 

This_person

Well-Known Member
Formal education is often required for vocations as well and while the cost of attending vocational school is certainly less expensive than traditional university, the costs still have increased because the government has their hands in that too.

The issue here is the government being in the business of making loans for education, not vocational vs. traditional universities.

You will need some formal post-secondary education no matter what you want to do in life — assuming you don’t want to be a minimum wage slave that is.
You're correct, except to say that many vocations offer apprenticeship capability, the ability to train on the job.
 

Toxick

Splat
The issue here is the government being in the business of making loans for education, not vocational vs. traditional universities.

I find your ideas intriguing, and I would like to subscribe to your newsletter.
 

jazz lady

~*~ rara avis ~*~
Maryland used to heavily subsidize colleges in the state and thus costs were kept down for students. I believe these went away or were great reduced in the mid to late 90s. In my case and my field of IT, in order to get a job on base you needed a bachelor's degree as that is how the contracts were written. So I got an associate's degree via CSM, found an employer where the bachelor's degree was not required but paid significantly less, and gained experience in the field while I worked on and got my bachelor's degree from UMUC during employment there.

Back in the 80s, tuition was $35/credit hour at CSM (back then it was Charles County Community College). Now it is $127.50/credit hour. In the 90s, tuition at UMUC as $135/credit hour. Now it is $294/credit hour. :faint:
 

Kyle

Imagine No Democrats
PREMO Member
Back in the 80s, tuition was $35/credit hour at CSM (back then it was Charles County Community College). Now it is $127.50/credit hour. In the 90s, tuition at UMUC as $135/credit hour. Now it is $294/credit hour. :faint:
Imagine how much worse the private universities tuition!

In the 50s my mother earned her masters from Catholic University while working part time to pay her half and my grandfather paying the other half the tuition. Thats certainly not possible these days.
 

TCROW

Active Member
Maryland used to heavily subsidize colleges in the state and thus costs were kept down for students. I believe these went away or were great reduced in the mid to late 90s. In my case and my field of IT, in order to get a job on base you needed a bachelor's degree as that is how the contracts were written. So I got an associate's degree via CSM, found an employer where the bachelor's degree was not required but paid significantly less, and gained experience in the field while I worked on and got my bachelor's degree from UMUC during employment there.

Back in the 80s, tuition was $35/credit hour at CSM (back then it was Charles County Community College). Now it is $127.50/credit hour. In the 90s, tuition at UMUC as $135/credit hour. Now it is $294/credit hour. :faint:
Yes, mid 90s is when this government intervention started ramping up. To understand this, just ask the question, “who benefits”? Or, “follow the money”.

Who benefits? (from government subsidized loans)

The schools do, and that’s why tuition has skyrocketed. Not the parents of these kids, not the kids themselves, but the schools are the sole beneficiaries of government subsidized school tuition loans.
 

TCROW

Active Member
Imagine how much worse the private universities tuition!

In the 50s my mother earned her masters from Catholic University while working part time to pay her half and my grandfather paying the other half the tuition. Thats certainly not possible these days.
In the 50s one parent could work and provide for an entire family. That’s not possible these days either. Well it is, but certainly not the norm.

Lots has changed since the 50s, namely our monetary system.
 

jazz lady

~*~ rara avis ~*~
Imagine how much worse the private universities tuition!
All I know is I couldn't afford it then and certainly couldn't now. :lol:

Tuition and fees vary from college to college. The average cost of tuition and fees for the 2017–2018 school year was $34,699 at private colleges, $9,528 for state residents at public colleges and $21,632 for out-of-state students at state schools, according to data reported to U.S. News in an annual survey.

:yikes:

In the 50s my mother earned her masters from Catholic University while working part time to pay her half and my grandfather paying the other half the tuition. That's certainly not possible these days.
Good on your mom. :yay: No, not possible today. I took out student loans for my AA (and paid back fully) then saved to pay for my BS.
 

GURPS

INGSOC
PREMO Member
...... you needed a bachelor's degree ......
I always despised this and spurious certification requirements ..... I've got 18 yrs experience someone I talked to recently in a phone interview

'would you be willing to get a A+ in 6 months if hired'

Umm WTF did you NOT understand about 18 yrs experience

so I looked at Comp TA's web site .... and spent 2 days taking a collection on on line practice tests

NOTHING I took and any of the tests would have added ANYTHING to my répertoire in trouble shooting computers


What do you learn in an A+ certification program?

A+ certification programs typically focus on the skills required for entry-level PC technicians. Students learn about installing, configuring, upgrading and repairing PCs. At New Horizons, the IT training company, a five-day or 10-day course includes instruction in computer architecture, memory, modems, printers, hard disk setup and operating system optimization.
 

Clem72

Well-Known Member
I always despised this and spurious certification requirements ..... I've got 18 yrs experience someone I talked to recently in a phone interview

'would you be willing to get a A+ in 6 months if hired'

Umm WTF did you NOT understand about 18 yrs experience

so I looked at Comp TA's web site .... and spent 2 days taking a collection on on line practice tests

NOTHING I took and any of the tests would have added ANYTHING to my répertoire in trouble shooting computers
You have 18 years of experience, and possibly no means of establishing the level of that experience. Do you have a portfolio you can turn over, have you written any industry articles, etc.

That employer was telling you, hey this A+ cert is the minimum possible hoop you can jump through to show us your 18 years of IT experience wasn't playing solitaire and shoulder surfing while someone else actually did the work. And it is minimal; even without any professional experience you should have a pretty good shot at passing A+, and possibly Networking plus. Security+ might require you to memorize some port numbers and the LSI model (so lets call it a week of study if you have zero experience).
 

jazz lady

~*~ rara avis ~*~
I always despised this and spurious certification requirements ..... I've got 18 yrs experience someone I talked to recently in a phone interview

'would you be willing to get a A+ in 6 months if hired'

Umm WTF did you NOT understand about 18 yrs experience

so I looked at Comp TA's web site .... and spent 2 days taking a collection on on line practice tests

NOTHING I took and any of the tests would have added ANYTHING to my répertoire in trouble shooting computers


What do you learn in an A+ certification program?

A+ certification programs typically focus on the skills required for entry-level PC technicians. Students learn about installing, configuring, upgrading and repairing PCs. At New Horizons, the IT training company, a five-day or 10-day course includes instruction in computer architecture, memory, modems, printers, hard disk setup and operating system optimization.
I feel your pain. :lol:

They are useful in some cases but for the vast majority a waste of time. I have taken two bootcamps for certification and was mostly bored. IMHO, they are just "feel good" moneymakers and don't replace actual hands-on experience in any way, shape, or form. Certs are the latest "in" thing for whatever reason and am glad my current company doesn't require them. BUT...they do have an incentive bonu$ going that rewards you if you get certain ones. I said hell NO! :lmao:
 

TCROW

Active Member
You have 18 years of experience, and possibly no means of establishing the level of that experience. Do you have a portfolio you can turn over, have you written any industry articles, etc.

That employer was telling you, hey this A+ cert is the minimum possible hoop you can jump through to show us your 18 years of IT experience wasn't playing solitaire and shoulder surfing while someone else actually did the work. And it is minimal; even without any professional experience you should have a pretty good shot at passing A+, and possibly Networking plus. Security+ might require you to memorize some port numbers and the LSI model (so lets call it a week of study if you have zero experience).
More than all that, if it’s a DOD-related position there are statutory requirements for certifications.
 

GURPS

INGSOC
PREMO Member
I have taken two bootcamps for certification and was mostly bored.
Back in 1999 was pursuing an MSCE for Win NT 4.0 .... right as MS announced they would be retiring the NT 4 Certs in favor of Windows 2000 MCSE's of course 2000 wasn't out yet, but you could spend more MONEY on Classes

my 1st IT JOB in 2000 the company I was working for, had to let 2 'Microsoft Certified Systems Engineer's' go because the could not handle basic server hardware maintenance tasks like Hard Drive Replacement or Memory Upgrades .... but by GOD they had there MSCE Certs

:killingme

Book Smart ... no common sense or real world experience

When I more recently ran an IT Dept ... I hired guys or gals who were passionate about gaming and built their own gaming rigs .... one was the go to guy for his collection of friends handling the groups LAN Parties - Network Connectivity Troubleshooting, game [application] issues .... the only thing we needed to train him on was out Windows based POS Systems ... which i would have had to teach anyone.
 

glhs837

Power with Control
In the 50s one parent could work and provide for an entire family. That’s not possible these days either. Well it is, but certainly not the norm.

Lots has changed since the 50s, namely our monetary system.

Well, also the fact that by today standards, most families in the 50s lived like Tibetan monks as far as material possessions
 

This_person

Well-Known Member
Well, also the fact that by today standards, most families in the 50s lived like Tibetan monks as far as material possessions
And, to be fair, when women began to work in greater numbers at more significant positions, a plumber and a secretary were suddenly upwardly mobile and moving into more affluent neighborhoods - which turned the price for housing up turned what was a house that a single income could purchase into a home it took a plumber and a secretary to purchase. By inflating income, costs inflated until the new status quo was the same standard of living for most, but it now takes two incomes to get there.
 
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