Missile destruction

[SmallTown]

With regards to Iraq destroying the Al Samound 2 missiles,

"European leaders praised the move, but White House spokeswoman Merci Viana said Iraq's decision was "part of its game of deception." Spokesman Ari Fleischer said that to avoid a war, Iraq needed not only to disarm, but also to change its leadership. "

But just this past Tuesday in an interview, Bush said:
"President Bush told reporters on Tuesday that "there's only one thing" Saddam Hussein can do to avoid U.S.-led military action against Iraq: "full disarmament." "

"The president's comments echoed earlier remarks by White House press secretary Ari Fleischer, who said Iraq still had "an off ramp" from war if it "completely and totally and verifiably disarmed for the United Nations Security Council."


Talk about given an inch, take a mile. As I have said before, I don't think we are handling the Iraq situation the right way. We talk about iraq being full of lies and deceptions, and here we are saying that if iraq disarms, we won't go to war. Then they begin to disarm, and Bush says we also need change of leadership. Obviously, this was the goal from the beginning (and a good goal) but again, our handling of it just makes us look even worse and saddam looking even better (Turkey changing their minds... Guess our pockets weren't deep enough... Other arab countries jumping on the anti-war bandwagon)

Leave it to Bush to make a violent dictator who rules by death and destruction look like a Saint.

All of this from the party that is supposed to be the "foreign policy party"

 

[Ken King]

Originally posted by SmallTown
With regards to Iraq destroying the Al Samound 2 missiles,

Talk about given an inch, take a mile. As I have said before, I don't think we are handling the Iraq situation the right way. We talk about iraq being full of lies and deceptions, and here we are saying that if iraq disarms, we won't go to war. Then they begin to disarm, and Bush says we also need change of leadership. Obviously, this was the goal from the beginning (and a good goal) but again, our handling of it just makes us look even worse and saddam looking even better (Turkey changing their minds... Guess our pockets weren't deep enough... Other arab countries jumping on the anti-war bandwagon)

Leave it to Bush to make a violent dictator who rules by death and destruction look like a Saint.

All of this from the party that is supposed to be the "foreign policy party"

Smalltown,

What you are missing is that Iraq was directed to fully disarm back in 1991, which they haven’t done. They were directed again this past November and have only started to cooperate four months later. Now as our military approaches the required strength to bring about a military solution Hussein starts to comply by destroying a miniscule amount of the Al Samound 2 missiles. Destroying four missiles does not bring them into compliance with the resolutions. It is another ploy by Hussein to stretch out the time he has. Destroying a couple a day will stretch out the issue for many more months.

What else is he doing during this time? Has he decided to transfer certain items to others that share his goals (like maybe the French)? Is he building a surprise for our troops if they in fact do go in to clean this mess up? Or is it that he is starting to comply because he sees our build up as a no-BS move to bring him into compliance and is starting to realize that he has no other choice?

 

[SmallTown]

What has happened his Bush took a gamble, and saddam called him on it.

Hopefully the military build up has been a wake up call to saddam. I personally think that right now he is doing whatever he can to stay in power, as well as make the US look really bad which is starting to happen. If he is going down, he is going to take down people with him.

As for the gamble. Bush felt that a massive military build up with help get rid of saddam. He banked (literally) on countries in the region to finally get tired of saddam and be behind us. He banked on the notion that a huge world opposition to saddam would force him to either leave power or be overthrown. This opposition has not come about.
He banked on the history of saddam, knowing that he would never comply with the UN resolutions, and now it at least appears to the world he is.

We can't change the rules in the middle of the game. Regardless of history and how much time Iraq has had, Bush came out himself this past Tuesday and said to avoid war Iraq must disarm. Now that it appears he is starting to do it, we up the demand. People looking at this from the outside will see it as a way for Bush to guarantee that saddam can never comply by always changing the requirements.
Or, we could just make this change of voice part of the list of Bushisms.

So, since we had a thread concerning being patriotic meant following what the president says, do we go along with the way to avoid war is for iraq to disarm (the claim on tuesday) or to disarm and have a change of leadership (statement today)? I'm really working hard on this patriotic thing, but i'm just all confused now.

 

[Heretic]

A missle that has 40 miles more range than allowed isnt what we are really worried about. We are worried about the thousands of gallons of Anthrax, VX, Sarian, Mustard gas, and possible nuclear materials. Its the sales technique of I give you a little and you trust me and allow me to rob you blind. Its the same thing as if a deadbeat dad that owed $1000 in child support gave his ex wife a $20 bill and said "I just gave you some money". Its amazing how easily some people are appeased.

Hans Blix said today that its a start but much more needs to be done.

 

[SmallTown]

Yes, but as the president of the most powerful nation on earth, if you place a couple hundred thousand troops near a foreign country and tell them to disarm or else, and they begin to disarm... Then you say that isn't enough... There is a problem there. Funny how Bush keeps telling the UN to grow some nads and back up what they say, maybe he should do the same.

Guess we can add this one to the graphic I posted awhile back showing Bush saying "Finding Osama is our highest priority, we will search everywhere for him", then a year later after not finding him "I don't know where he is and I don't care, it is not a priority"

People talk about saddam using body doubles, I'm starting to think Bush does as well.

 

[Ken King]

It is in no way a gamble in what it is that Bush is doing. He is being very deliberate and is intent on protecting us from a madman with weapons that can do us serious harm. He has been directed, by law, to do whatever is necessary to bring Iraq into compliance with the UN resolutions. Along the way he has used the diplomatic channels to the point we are now and have been before, at exhaustion. Iraq has no intention on complying with the UN resolutions and their latest efforts are only being done to delay military action and are not an effort to come to full compliance.

Iraq’s failure to comply is being seen by some in the UN as nothing much to worry about, but then again these countries haven’t been the target of threats from this regime nor have they experienced the continued attacks upon their forces conducting the will of the UN (because they don't have any troops there. BTW, where are they or why aren't they supporting the UN?). They do not care if he passes his weapons on to those that will use them against us. The fact that some don’t see the same threat as he does doesn’t make that threat any less valid to us and our interests.

As to Iraq starting to comply by destroying a few of their illegal weapons, I would say it is a long way from what they are required to do. We have seen this tactic before during the past 12+ years and we know how the game plays out. Saddam does a little and gets a few weak-kneed countries to say it is progress and then the diplomatic arena stalls and he goes back to what he has been doing all along. At least now we have a President that realizes that enough is enough. It’s time for this to end. It’s up to Saddam if he wants to leave peacefully or if he wants to further destroy his country and be carried out in a body bag.

 

[Heretic]

Smalltown would you like it better if Bush got on TV every day and said were still looking for Bin Laden? You think they quit looking? It is a covert operation, we need to sneak arround with one or two people to find him and then go in quickly. I have no doubt that we are still hunting him down. You've heard the saying of too many cooks in the kitchen.

 

[vraiblonde]

Ya know, I think being a parent qualifies you as a human nature expert. In almost any world situation that happens, I can recognize something I've gone through with my kids.

A kid comes to me and wants to know if they can go to a friend's house. I say, "Is your room clean?" They say, "Yes." I say, "Okay, if I go down there and the room isn't clean, I get to smack you in the head, right?" They say, "Ummm...let me go check it again."

So, Saddam - we checked and your room wasn't clean so now we get to smack you in the head. The only way people learn is if there are consequences to their actions.

 

[vraiblonde]

And PS, Saddam - you get no credit for just vaccuuming. We told you to clean.

 

[Sharon]

Originally posted by vraiblonde

A kid comes to me and wants to know if they can go to a friend's house. I say, "Is your room clean?" They say, "Yes." I say, "Okay, if I go down there and the room isn't clean, I get to smack you in the head, right?" They say, "Ummm...let me go check it again."

I do that too.