Pat Buchanan: Suggests Bush Impeachment!!!

[Qpid]

R PIGS FLYING?

http://rawstory.com/news/2005/Buchanan_suggests_Bush_imp_0829.html

Pat Buchanan, a leading conservative pundit and former presidential adviser, quietly suggested House Republicans mull impeaching President Bush -- though not for the liberals' cause celebre, Iraq -- but rather for what he sees as Bush's 'criminal' failure to stem the tide of illegal immigrants, RAW STORY has discovered.

"We are being invaded," the reactionary Republican declared in his column Monday, "and the president of the United States is not doing his duty to protect the states against that invasion."

"Some courageous Republican, to get the attention of this White House, should drop into the hopper a bill of impeachment," he added, "charging Bush with a conscious refusal to uphold his oath and defend the states of the Union against 'invasion.'"

 

[2ndAmendment]

I don't agree that he should be impeached, but I do agree that the federal government is derelict in defending our borders which is one of the few things the federal government is really supposed to do.

 

[Bustem' Down]

I don't agree that he should be impeached, but I do agree that the federal government is derelict in defending our borders which is one of the few things the federal government is really supposed to do.

Exactly! Unfortuanly, something like this coming from him will be immediatly dissmised. We're so hell bent for leather to take the fight overseas that we have left the backdoor unlocked and swinging in the wind.

 

[vraiblonde]

Unfortuanly, something like this coming from him will be immediatly dissmised.

Naw - Pat Buchanan will suddenly be the darling of the liberal talk show set, after years of them hating his guts and not wanting anything to do with him.

Buchanan has always been an isolationist so his statements aren't particularly surprising. Libbies like to pretend that all non-liberals are the same and in cahoots with each other, when that's never been the case.

 

[Larry Gude]

Ditto...

I don't agree that he should be impeached, but I do agree that the federal government is derelict in defending our borders which is one of the few things the federal government is really supposed to do.

...that.

 

[Bruzilla]

Ok, so we've had terrorists working within the United States since at least the early 1990s, and since 9/11/01 we've been at war with Al Queera. And all during that time, the "backdoor" has been hanging wide open, with no new terrorist attacks, and only a couple barely-active terrorist cells found in the US.

Also during the period following 9/11/01, we've clamped down on Al Queera's funding pipelines, support pipelines, took over their major base of operations and sent them into the mountains, and took over what would have been a perfect replacement for Afghanistan. In short, we've been putting a serious hurting on Al Queera and other terrorist groups all during this time.

Lastly, during this time, unless you were deaf, dumb, blind, and stupid; living like a unibomber hermit; or hiding under a rock; it was impossible for you to miss all of the thousands of references in the media citing "... if there's another terrorist attack on the US Bush is through!", or "... it would only take one terrorist attack on US soil to make the US people lose all of their confidence in Bush", or "... attacks in the US by terrorists, and attributed to the Iraq War, would cause support for the war to end."

And yet, despite all these things - the wide-open backdoor, the pressure on Al Queera, the loss of their bases and support, and the obvious HUGELY negative political effects of such an attack... we've got nothin'. So I guess one could make the argument that our unsecured borders could be allowing herds of african elephants to come into the US and graze on our grain, but that's about as likely an event as all of these alledged terrorists streaming across the border.

Buchanon's big peave is he doesn't like a good chunk of America turning into Mexico. All the BS about terrorists streaming across the border is just that... BS. If they want to come here there's about a million ways for them to get in and you aren't going to stop them. Buchanon wants the Mexicans kept out plain and simple. While I don't like seeing everything being printed in English and Spanish these days, I do like being able to reap the economic benefits that cheap Mexican labor brings to the market place, so I can see Bush's reasoning on not closing the borders.

 

[2ndAmendment]

So Bruzilla, me thinks thou dost protest too much. Got a favorite ilegal on the payroll?

 

[Bruzilla]

Nope... I just collect a paycheck every other week. No payroll for me. But, I do spend some of that money I make every otherweek on goods that would cost me a helluvalot more if it weren't for illegal immigrants working for less than half of what a legal worker would work for.

I also enjoy not having to pay more in taxes to cover the costs associated with adding all of the illegals to the legal side of the income tax coffers, where they still wouldn't have to pay any taxes AND would qualify for earned income tax credits and other tax credits to boot.

While I have no illegals working for me directly, I do value their benefit to our economy and tax base.

 

[2ndAmendment]

Nope... I just collect a paycheck every other week. No payroll for me. But, I do spend some of that money I make every otherweek on goods that would cost me a helluvalot more if it weren't for illegal immigrants working for less than half of what a legal worker would work for.
...
While I have no illegals working for me directly, I do value their benefit to our economy and tax base.

Consider this. Phase out welfare, do away with the minimum wage (both unconstitutinal anyway), seal our borders, kick out the illegals - now put all the citizens that were on the tax dole to work. Heck, doing away with welfare and the minimum wage would probably go a long way toward making illegals not want to come here.

 

[Bruzilla]

Consider this. Phase out welfare, do away with the minimum wage (both unconstitutinal anyway), seal our borders, kick out the illegals - now put all the citizens that were on the tax dole to work. Heck, doing away with welfare and the minimum wage would probably go a long way toward making illegals not want to come here.

Great ideas! And while you're at it you can make Santa and the flying reindeer a reality, Nancy Pilosi and Rush Limbaugh get married, and heck, since we're not asking for anything too far out there, let's make all gays straight.

No offense, but not one of those items you have listed has a snowball's chance in hell of ever happening. None, zip, nada, so counting on them as a means to counter what could happen, that being the closing of the borders and expelling illegals who do so much for our country, ain't goin' to work.

So... what's your plan B?

 

[2ndAmendment]

Great ideas! ...

So... what's your plan B?

Plan B -> http://forums.somd.com/showthread.php?p=1098309&posted=1#post1098309

Then all of Plan A will be in effect again.

 

[Bruzilla]

Plan B -> http://forums.somd.com/showthread.php?p=1098309&posted=1#post1098309

Then all of Plan A will be in effect again.

So, what you're saying is that all we have to do to overcome the effects of ousting the illegals is to roll back 200 years of political and legislative crap that while unconsitutional has become so ingrained into American life that no politician alive would dare to suggest doing it, and probably 98+ of Americans would be opposed to? Hell... I thought it would be something more difficult.

Yeah... that's a super plan B. Maybe you and Santa can discuss it's implementation when he flies his reindeer in.

I guess plan C would be to resurrect the Founding Fathers from the dead and have them show the political courage you seek? Maybe Santa can help you out with that one.

 

[2ndAmendment]

So, what you're saying is that all we have to do to overcome the effects of ousting the illegals is to roll back 200 years of political and legislative crap that while unconsitutional has become so ingrained into American life that no politician alive would dare to suggest doing it, and probably 98+ of Americans would be opposed to? Hell... I thought it would be something more difficult.

Yeah... that's a super plan B. Maybe you and Santa can discuss it's implementation when he flies his reindeer in.

I guess plan C would be to resurrect the Founding Fathers from the dead and have them show the political courage you seek? Maybe Santa can help you out with that one.

When the economy fails because of the rising fuel prices which effect everything, police can't respond because they don't have gas, military can't fight a war because they don't have fuel for HumVees, F-15, M1As, and the like, rolling back to what the founders envisioned will seem like child's play.

 

[Bruzilla]

When the economy fails because of the rising fuel prices which effect everything, police can't respond because they don't have gas, military can't fight a war because they don't have fuel for HumVees, F-15, M1As, and the like, rolling back to what the founders envisioned will seem like child's play.

BTW, that's not to indicate barfing, it's just me shooting iced tea out my nose as I read your post.

Why is it that you think that the economy is going to fail because of high fuel prices? The only way that the economy will fail is if we stop producing or Americans stop spending, and that's not going to happen because gas goes to two or three bucks a gallon. Yes, SUV sales will fall, but fuel efficient car sales are going up. Yes, gas costs more, but that doesn't mean we're going to drive less anymore than higher cigarette prices have stopped smoking. If the price goes up we #####, we yell, and we pay, that's the way it is in America. And come next year you'll see all kinds of plans and actions to bring the cost of gas back down before the election, so nobody should be worried.

And where do you get the idea that our air force pilots are going to be scampering about the alert aprons with syphon hoses around their necks instead of those geeky ascots? Where's all this fuel shortage coming from? There is no fuel shortage aside from we've temporarily lost about 10% due to the hurricane. Are you telling me that there's no way that the US can function for a short time without that 10%??? Are we so far gone that this 10% will cause our M-1s and AH-64s to grind to a halt??? If you're first panic attack is true, Americans won't be buying any gas as the economy will be in ruins and nobody will be working, so there'll be plenty of fuel for things that go boom.

 

[SamSpade]

I don't think the economy is gonna go into a tailspin - but I do think it's gonna take a big hit from this. Rising fuel costs that aren't contained soon enough reach into everything - already, airlines are cancelling flights because of fuel costs. Shipping costs will rise; manufacturing costs will go up.


But wages - won't. We have an economy that for the last twenty years depends heavily on consumer spending - when fuel costs go up -and stay up - consumer spending goes down.

 

[2ndAmendment]

BTW, that's not to indicate barfing, it's just me shooting iced tea out my nose as I read your post.

Why is it that you think that the economy is going to fail because of high fuel prices? The only way that the economy will fail is if we stop producing or Americans stop spending, and that's not going to happen because gas goes to two or three bucks a gallon. Yes, SUV sales will fall, but fuel efficient car sales are going up. Yes, gas costs more, but that doesn't mean we're going to drive less anymore than higher cigarette prices have stopped smoking. If the price goes up we #####, we yell, and we pay, that's the way it is in America. And come next year you'll see all kinds of plans and actions to bring the cost of gas back down before the election, so nobody should be worried.

And where do you get the idea that our air force pilots are going to be scampering about the alert aprons with syphon hoses around their necks instead of those geeky ascots? Where's all this fuel shortage coming from? There is no fuel shortage aside from we've temporarily lost about 10% due to the hurricane. Are you telling me that there's no way that the US can function for a short time without that 10%??? Are we so far gone that this 10% will cause our M-1s and AH-64s to grind to a halt??? If you're first panic attack is true, Americans won't be buying any gas as the economy will be in ruins and nobody will be working, so there'll be plenty of fuel for things that go boom.

There you go with the

Fuel prices effect everything except horse manure and a few other things. People (2/3 thirds of those responding as I heard on the news) are already saying they are having to cut spending in other areas to afford fuel just to commute to work. Glad you are so well off that the additional cost doesn't bother you. If you commute 80 miles each way, the increase in fuel cost is between $200 and $400 depending on MPG. Most people don't have that much room in their budgets. People that bought "all the house they could afford" based on available income of a few months ago are going to be hard pressed to pay for fuel, mortgage, food, and medical. Bankruptcies and foreclosures don't help the economy.

Ten percent loss of fuel will cause some drastic price changes. It already is. And according to reports, it may be months, maybe many months before production of that 10% is back.

I really hope everything comes out rosy. I just don't see things through your rose colored glasses.

 

[Bruzilla]

As a matter of fact I do make more than enough money to cover the extra cost of gas... even to cover the cost of the two gallons that some sleezeball syphoned out of my gas tank sometime last night, and to cover the cost of the first locking gas cap I've had to buy since 1973.

But before you start planning the funeral for the economy, you need to take into account that our economy is mostly service based now, not manufacturing. It's no longer all that important for people to be on a job site. The company I work for is changing its rules for working from home for most of its employees, as are many other companies during this crisis. You see... this is what Americans do in a crisis... we adapt and overcome, we don't fall down and bemoan our problems. Well, some of us do, but most of us don't.

Some see these fuel shortages as destroying, cripling, etc., industries like the airlines, but speaking as a human performance guy I can tell you that this is a golden opportunity for the airlines and they are eating it up! This gives them perfect justification to eliminate unprofitable routes, up fares on all flights, and trim excess employees without anyone examining their every decision under a microscope. And if they're really smiled upon by God, the federal government will rush to their aid with subsidized fuel costs. Believe me, there are a lot of airline executives sleeping better because of this "crisis."

As for the rest of the economy going into the toilet because of higher fuel prices, you guys are focusing on the total cost of gasoline today. Say worst case, $3/gal. If you're driving 160 miles to/from work each day, and driving something with an average MPG of 22, that works out to about $108 a week, or $216 per two-week pay cycle. If you're driving an SUV that gets 13 MPG, you're looking at $369 every pay cycle for gas.

Now on the surface those numbers seem outrageous!!!, and sure to bring about doom and despair on all who pay those bills!!! But, as always, the Devil's in the details and the detail you're convienently overlooking is that when gas was $2.50 a gallon, before all the doom and gloom hit, these same people were paying $181 or $307 respectively and apparently able to pay their bills, so the real increase is not $216 or $369, it's only $35 or $62. Maybe I'm using my rose-colored glasses too much, but my thinking is that if you can afford the payments on that nice SUV you can certainly swing an extra $31 bucks a week to put gas in it. As for the driver of the 22 MPG car, they're looking at trimming a whopping $15.50 a week out of the family budget. So which businesses do you envision going down the economic toilet because they're losing out on a part of that $15.50???

Gas prices are going to go back down once all the vultures have tapped every last ounce of panic out of folks like you, and then things will settle back down. Then the 2006 elections are going to drive the prices down even more as I'm thinking gas prices are going to become a major driver for change, and because the problems in New Orleans should overcome the Greens's objections to building more refineries.

 

[2ndAmendment]

Gas has already topped $3/gal in many areas and at some stations in Maryland. Put on your glasses.

 

[Bruzilla]

Gas has already topped $3/gal in many areas and at some stations in Maryland. Put on your glasses.

So what if it goes to four or five? You're still trying to base your issue on total gas costs vice the delta between pre-storm and post-storm costs.

And to be perfectly honest, anyone who bought an SUV or other gas guzzler knew long before they even bought it that those things suck gas like it's nobody's business. I know... I spent most of last year working for Ford, and that was a hot topic with those people even last year. When the discussion turned to fuel economy, it was always "I know this thing gets terrible milage, but I just have to have one because I have lots of kids, I like the safety, I think they're cool, I want to keep up with my relatives, I need the room, etc. They all knew what they were signing up for, and they all said "I want it!" when they could have gotten a smaller more efficient vehicle.

Now the price of gas is going way up, and they're bally-hooing about how awful it is to pay $100 to fill up your gas tank! Well dumbass, you knew when you bought the thing you were putting yourself at risk, so shut up and pony over the money, walk, or go buy a cheap throwaway car for $500 and drive that till the price of gas comes down. I just bought a new Crown Victoria last Monday, when gas was at $2.50 a gallon, and I knew then that prices were going to go up, but that was the car I wanted so I pay the price of keeping it filled. And if I were short on salary I would have bought something that gets 40-50 MPG rather than 23. If you're living beyond your means and get caught short, that's your own bad to deal with.

 

[2ndAmendment]

So what if it goes to four or five? You're still trying to base your issue on total gas costs vice the delta between pre-storm and post-storm costs.
...
If you're living beyond your means and get caught short, that's your own bad to deal with.

No, I am not. You are looking at a fill up per week. Many commuters are doing a fill up every two days. Not me, but some I know.

It does matter. If you can believe Fox News (I believe them before the others), many economists are lamenting what fuel prices are doing and going to do to the economy. We have a consumer economy. If too much of the disposable income flows into one sector, the economy in general suffers.

Many, many household live paycheck to mouth. They have little or no savings and no room in the budget for additional expense. I remember when I was earning an hourly wage instead of a salary; an additional $30 a week was a BIG deal. You may be pulling in high 5 to 7 figures, but the average household earns about $40k. Not much room there, and they typically get the cast off vehicles, not new.

Even many households that make good money, low 6s, and have recently "bought all the house they could afford" thinking the household income would rise and they would get "breathing room" in a year or two may not survive the increase in fuel prices.

Something will give. The housing market may dry up. That would cause home prices to fall. People will get upside down in their mortgages and the lenders will demand additional capital to get back even. Many will not have the assets to be able to do that. They will have to sell or go bankrupt which will further depress the market.

Glad your world is rosy. Many are not as well healed as you state you are.