Photographer Who Refused to Shoot Same-Sex Ceremony

ylexot

Super Genius
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2014/04/07/supreme-court-deals-major-blow-to-new-mexico-photographer-who-refused-to-shoot-same-sex-ceremony/
The justices on Monday left in place a state Supreme Court ruling that said Elane Photography violated a state anti-discrimination law when it refused to work for a same-sex couple who wanted pictures of their commitment ceremony.
The lesson here is to not refuse the work...just do a really ####ty job for them.

Seriously, why would you want to hire someone who doesn't want to work for you?
Photographer - I can use Photoshop to make you uglier than you currently are...
Baker - Mmmm...what's in this frosting?
Home builder - I've got all these nails left over...

If a company wants to discriminate for any reason (race, religion, gender, height, weight, eye color, whatever), I say let them. They will fail on their own due to bad reputation and low consumer base. The free market does not like racism, sexism, homophobia, etc and eventually forces those ideas out on its own. But if you force service, you're just going to get bad service.
 

Hijinx

Well-Known Member
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2014/04/07/supreme-court-deals-major-blow-to-new-mexico-photographer-who-refused-to-shoot-same-sex-ceremony/

The lesson here is to not refuse the work...just do a really ####ty job for them.

Seriously, why would you want to hire someone who doesn't want to work for you?
Photographer - I can use Photoshop to make you uglier than you currently are...
Baker - Mmmm...what's in this frosting?
Home builder - I've got all these nails left over...

If a company wants to discriminate for any reason (race, religion, gender, height, weight, eye color, whatever), I say let them. They will fail on their own due to bad reputation and low consumer base. The free market does not like racism, sexism, homophobia, etc and eventually forces those ideas out on its own. But if you force service, you're just going to get bad service.
The problem here is that you do not understand the agenda. The agenda is to force people to accept work they do not want.
These people who force others to work for them do not really care about getting a cake or their pictures taken, they are forcing the homosexual agenda on people who do not wish to accept it. If it works others will accept their jobs out of fear.
 

PsyOps

Pixelated
Seriously, why would you want to hire someone who doesn't want to work for you?
Because it's about winning. It's about forcing people to do what they fundamentally disagree with. "So what the photos came out crappy; we got another victory over those religious fanatics."
 

itsbob

I bowl overhand
none of the above.. They want to search out people with different beliefs and morals than their own and destroy them.. They don't want to out them, they want to destroy their way of life, take way their means of making a living, ruin their businesses, run them into the ground financially and then, hopefully send them to jail, tear apart their family, make their kids hate them, and even possibly turn them in..

ALL of this, from the people that BEGGED for tolerance and acceptance.. and supported by the "Progressives"...

"We are VERY tolerant, unless you don't believe what we believe, then we'll crucify your ass!"
 

PsyOps

Pixelated
none of the above.. They want to search out people with different beliefs and morals than their own and destroy them.. They don't want to out them, they want to destroy their way of life, take way their means of making a living, ruin their businesses, run them into the ground financially and then, hopefully send them to jail, tear apart their family, make their kids hate them, and even possibly turn them in..

ALL of this, from the people that BEGGED for tolerance and acceptance.. and supported by the "Progressives"...

"We are VERY tolerant, unless you don't believe what we believe, then we'll crucify your ass!"
Sort of the same thing I said, only more words. :yay:
 

glhs837

Power with Control
none of the above.. They want to search out people with different beliefs and morals than their own and destroy them.. They don't want to out them, they want to destroy their way of life, take way their means of making a living, ruin their businesses, run them into the ground financially and then, hopefully send them to jail, tear apart their family, make their kids hate them, and even possibly turn them in..

ALL of this, from the people that BEGGED for tolerance and acceptance.. and supported by the "Progressives"...

"We are VERY tolerant, unless you don't believe what we believe, then we'll crucify your ass!"

Liking this ^^
 

Larry Gude

Strung Out
I would just like to say, for the record, that, if you would like to buy a #### ton of flowers, wholesale, I don't care if you're gay or straight or Christian or Muslim or Hindu or anarchist or going to use them in some sort of weird ritual I may or may not, personally, approve of, or even if you're a Dallas Cowboy fan, come on down! And bring your credit card. We take them all because we're non discriminatory that way. If you drink, gamble, are divorced, that's OK, too. I'm not marrying you. I sell flowers. By me selling you flowers, I am not making a value judgment, pro or con, about you or your beliefs.

As long as you're not harming someone else, that's your business. And, hell, on that one, we're kinda agnostic. Case in point; when I was a kid, a guy comes into the shop and wants two dozen long stem red roses delivered to his wife on VD day. With all the heads popped off. Just stems. He paid for them and off he went. And we did our part. Now, we could have started assuming why and, potentially, it could be considered harmful but, it also coulda been a joke. Or maybe she deserved it. That's not my role. My role is flowers.

I sell flowers.
 

Hijinx

Well-Known Member
I would just like to say, for the record, that, if you would like to buy a #### ton of flowers, wholesale, I don't care if you're gay or straight or Christian or Muslim or Hindu or anarchist or going to use them in some sort of weird ritual I may or may not, personally, approve of, or even if you're a Dallas Cowboy fan, come on down! And bring your credit card. We take them all because we're non discriminatory that way. If you drink, gamble, are divorced, that's OK, too. I'm not marrying you. I sell flowers. By me selling you flowers, I am not making a value judgment, pro or con, about you or your beliefs.

As long as you're not harming someone else, that's your business. And, hell, on that one, we're kinda agnostic. Case in point; when I was a kid, a guy comes into the shop and wants two dozen long stem red roses delivered to his wife on VD day. With all the heads popped off. Just stems. He paid for them and off he went. And we did our part. Now, we could have started assuming why and, potentially, it could be considered harmful but, it also coulda been a joke. Or maybe she deserved it. That's not my role. My role is flowers.

I sell flowers.

And that is the whole point:

The point being that these people could have found a business owner just like you to take their pictures and make their cake, only they did not want to. They would rather harass people who did not want their business. They are pushing their agenda.
 

Larry Gude

Strung Out
They are pushing their agenda.
Say it isn't so.

Like Prop 8? Like Defense of Marriage Act? The right could not have picked a bigger loser battle than to treat homosexuality like it is THE sin. Any time you want to deny something to someone else, they're gonna fight back. When it harms you not one bit if they get it, that makes your position all the more untenable and their motivation all the more inspired.

But, hey, battle on.

The left hates the military but, learned to make their peace with it, wear the lapel pin, wave the flag and call even the most useless solider a hero. That was a bitter pill but, necessary to achieve their larger goals. The right? We're willing to pass up even the opportunity to achieve larger goals because, for whatever reasons, what other people do in the bedroom really bothers us.
 

terbear1225

Well-Known Member
playing evil's advocate here but you do not have to be physically present at the event about which you may/ may not agree. I can see a difference between selling flowers to someone and they walk off with them or you drop them off, and actually being there during the wedding if you are against same sex marriage.

(to be clear, I don't give two figs who wants to marry who, but I can see where someone who is adamantly against same sex marriage wouldn't want to attend one, even as part of their business)
 

b23hqb

Well-Known Member
PREMO Member
Say it isn't so.

Like Prop 8? Like Defense of Marriage Act? The right could not have picked a bigger loser battle than to treat homosexuality like it is THE sin. Any time you want to deny something to someone else, they're gonna fight back. When it harms you not one bit if they get it, that makes your position all the more untenable and their motivation all the more inspired.

But, hey, battle on.

The left hates the military but, learned to make their peace with it, wear the lapel pin, wave the flag and call even the most useless solider a hero. That was a bitter pill but, necessary to achieve their larger goals. The right? We're willing to pass up even the opportunity to achieve larger goals because, for whatever reasons, what other people do in the bedroom really bothers us.
You were right with your post #7. Should have just left it there.

But then you went straight to your usual stance of (my quotes, para-phrased by me) "Why not give in to the homosexual community on whatever and wherever they want it? Who's it going to hurt? How is it going to hurt one's moral/religious beliefs"?

You don't give a crap about anybody's morals or religious beliefs until it impacts on the feelings of the homosexual.

If I lived in SOMD, or even within 100 miles of your shop, I'd buy flowers for a wedding from you just to show that we who do not believe in caving to the homosexual community, and will do it just to counter your point. And I believe you and yours would do a fine job.

My point being that I don't give a crap about who I am buying flowers or florist services from voluntarily, but not by forcing anyone to provide the same such services for a religious ceremony - photography, renting out buildings, catering, etc.

Would be nice if the homosexual community would give the same considerations to those who do not buy into that lifestyle.
 

Hijinx

Well-Known Member
Say it isn't so.

Like Prop 8? Like Defense of Marriage Act? The right could not have picked a bigger loser battle than to treat homosexuality like it is THE sin. Any time you want to deny something to someone else, they're gonna fight back. When it harms you not one bit if they get it, that makes your position all the more untenable and their motivation all the more inspired.

But, hey, battle on.

The left hates the military but, learned to make their peace with it, wear the lapel pin, wave the flag and call even the most useless solider a hero. That was a bitter pill but, necessary to achieve their larger goals. The right? We're willing to pass up even the opportunity to achieve larger goals because, for whatever reasons, what other people do in the bedroom really bothers us.
I didn't start the battle, they did. I agree with number #11 you stated your position, it was fine. Now you support the agenda.
I don't give a fig what they do in their bedroom, or their toilet, or their hot tub, or anywhere else they care to do it.
I also do not push what it is I do in my bedroom, toilet, or anywhere else. Let them be as kind and STF up about their lifestyle.
 

Larry Gude

Strung Out
But then you went straight to your usual stance of (my quotes, para-phrased by me) "Why not give in to the homosexual community on whatever and wherever they want it? Who's it going to hurt? How is it going to hurt one's moral/religious beliefs"?

You don't give a crap about anybody's morals or religious beliefs until it impacts on the feelings of the homosexual. .
What does this mean, 'give in'???????? I swear to...Would Jesus refuse to bake a cake for a gay couple??? Would he refuse to take pictures, talk to them, maybe sell them a nice condo over looking the park? If Jesus grew up in the other family business, would he refuse to do wood work for them?????

Y'all act like you're being forced to give up your faith. Forced to 'give in' and become gay. Is it, really, in keeping with Christs teachings to refuse to provide products and services to gay people? Is it in keeping with His teachings to claim baking some homo's a cake betrays your love and trust in Him???

I VERY much give a crap about your feelings about your faith and I applaud people like Maher or anyone else who points out the 'gay mafia' and the hypocrisy but THEY are not the ones trying to deny you ANYTHING. They're not trying to ban Christian marriage. I never met a gay florists who said "We're not taking this wedding. They're breeders..." So, in the process, the right has long since lost the battle and gotten nothing for it out of a battle that never made sense. Right war, the culture war, wrong battle. THAT is the issue here. If I didn't care about Christianity, I'd just shut up and watch y'all keep reducing it while Islam, the real enemy, ascends. THAT is what pisses me off. I lose in that battle, too.

And, faith aside, it sure as hell does not conform to the tenets of religious freedom and individual right to pursuit of happiness and liberty we're ALL supposed to subordinate our personal bias' to so that we may all live in peace. Homosexuals would have and, maybe still could be, tremendous allies in the war for freedom and liberty, especially against Islam, yet you folks can't see that and would rather argue that baking cakes for homos is the evil here.

:tap:
 

Larry Gude

Strung Out
I didn't start the battle, they did. I agree with number #11 you stated your position, it was fine. Now you support the agenda.
I don't give a fig what they do in their bedroom, or their toilet, or their hot tub, or anywhere else they care to do it.
I also do not push what it is I do in my bedroom, toilet, or anywhere else. Let them be as kind and STF up about their lifestyle.
Fair enough. I assume you would go to a gay wedding invited and enjoy yourself and not feel like you'd just sold your soul?
 

Larry Gude

Strung Out
playing evil's advocate here but you do not have to be physically present at the event about which you may/ may not agree. I can see a difference between selling flowers to someone and they walk off with them or you drop them off, and actually being there during the wedding if you are against same sex marriage.
Florists do set up. Same as the caterer. The photog. The baker. Then, florists, especially, make themselves scarce. They don't get asked to do the service. As attendants, they're not considered part of the congregation that has a say in the 'speak now or forever hold you peace' part. They're not considered witness's.
 

b23hqb

Well-Known Member
PREMO Member
What does this mean, 'give in'???????? I swear to...Would Jesus refuse to bake a cake for a gay couple??? Would he refuse to take pictures, talk to them, maybe sell them a nice condo over looking the park? If Jesus grew up in the other family business, would he refuse to do wood work for them?????

Y'all act like you're being forced to give up your faith. Forced to 'give in' and become gay. Is it, really, in keeping with Christs teachings to refuse to provide products and services to gay people? Is it in keeping with His teachings to claim baking some homo's a cake betrays your love and trust in Him???

I VERY much give a crap about your feelings about your faith and I applaud people like Maher or anyone else who points out the 'gay mafia' and the hypocrisy but THEY are not the ones trying to deny you ANYTHING. They're not trying to ban Christian marriage. I never met a gay florists who said "We're not taking this wedding. They're breeders..." So, in the process, the right has long since lost the battle and gotten nothing for it out of a battle that never made sense. Right war, the culture war, wrong battle. THAT is the issue here. If I didn't care about Christianity, I'd just shut up and watch y'all keep reducing it while Islam, the real enemy, ascends. THAT is what pisses me off. I lose in that battle, too.

And, faith aside, it sure as hell does not conform to the tenets of religious freedom and individual right to pursuit of happiness and liberty we're ALL supposed to subordinate our personal bias' to so that we may all live in peace. Homosexuals would have and, maybe still could be, tremendous allies in the war for freedom and liberty, especially against Islam, yet you folks can't see that and would rather argue that baking cakes for homos is the evil here.

:tap:
Your song remains the same. No one should be offended except homosexuals.
 

PsyOps

Pixelated
I would just like to say, for the record, that, if you would like to buy a #### ton of flowers, wholesale, I don't care if you're gay or straight or Christian or Muslim or Hindu or anarchist or going to use them in some sort of weird ritual I may or may not, personally, approve of, or even if you're a Dallas Cowboy fan, come on down! And bring your credit card. We take them all because we're non discriminatory that way. If you drink, gamble, are divorced, that's OK, too. I'm not marrying you. I sell flowers. By me selling you flowers, I am not making a value judgment, pro or con, about you or your beliefs.

As long as you're not harming someone else, that's your business. And, hell, on that one, we're kinda agnostic. Case in point; when I was a kid, a guy comes into the shop and wants two dozen long stem red roses delivered to his wife on VD day. With all the heads popped off. Just stems. He paid for them and off he went. And we did our part. Now, we could have started assuming why and, potentially, it could be considered harmful but, it also coulda been a joke. Or maybe she deserved it. That's not my role. My role is flowers.

I sell flowers.
What about someone that plays jazz?

NOT KENNY G – THAT’S NOT JAZZ
 

vraiblonde

Board Mommy
PREMO Member
Patron
Why wouldn't the photographer have just said he was booked up that day instead of allowing a stink to be made?
 
C

czygvtwkr

Guest
Why wouldn't the photographer have just said he was booked up that day instead of allowing a stink to be made?
If I was against it I would have quoted them a higher price (25% or so) if his fees aren't published ahead of time I would have taken the job and either enjoyed that extra 25% or donated it to a cause they are against in their name so that the card went to them.
 

vraiblonde

Board Mommy
PREMO Member
Patron
If I was against it I would have quoted them a higher price (25% or so) if his fees aren't published ahead of time I would have taken the job and either enjoyed that extra 25% or donated it to a cause they are against in their name so that the card went to them.
See, and I wouldn't waste any negative energy trying to "get" them. If someone that I hated came to me and said, "Hey, would you...?" I'd just tell them I'm busy then, sorry. It's immature drama bull#### to stand on a soapbox and proclaim your views when a simple "sorry, no can do" would suffice. The gay couple almost certainly came to him specifically because they knew he was a Christian, and they wanted to do a gotcha and get famous like those idiots with the wedding cake, shake their fist at the man. I say let them be the aholes, and you don't take their bait.
 
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